Why is quota a bad idea if the true intention is to diversify ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is my biggest concern:
What if the smartest Asian kid, smartest Indian kid, smartest Black Kid, smartest White kid, smartest Hispanic kid.....all of them...all of them dont get lucky in the lottery.
And these five kids were the ones who were going to be the next inventors, innovators in STEM and we failed them because they were "unlucky"

With the lottery system, there is still no guarantee that the selection pool will be diverse or the smartest well deserved URM student will be in TJ.
I understand the need to help the URM kids who had no access to prepping.
Why can't we have a quota, for example, 40 or 50 sears for the highest scoring Hispanics, same for the highest scoring Blacks? Isn't this better, because now we have the best kids who can take that rigor, who tested well. and need that level?
And even if those URM kids did not prep, they are still the best among them, and that's who we want to serve in TJ. I know quota-based can also have pitfalls, but it can be closely monitored to adjust etc each year.

If we open TJ selection for lottery and everyone who just wants to try for the heck of it, gets lucky, the entire school will have to scramble, or parents will hate this, whose kids are stuggling and the kids whose needs are not met because of the struggling kids. And then what? It will take a few years to realize the very essemce of TJ is lost.

In the US we don't have separate schools by race. These types of schools were made illegal in the 1950's and 1960's in the US. Taxpayers pay for our schools.

It does not matter that the essence of the school is lost. It does not matter that the essence of TJ is lost. AA kids have just as much right to be at TJ in a school with
good physical equipment, a school without holes in the walls and a school with teachers that are not burned out.

[Anonymous]

The true intention here was never to diversify. The lottery / quota has great optics, but has proven time and time again, to lead to worse outcomes for the very demographic it pretends to be helping.

One good case study to explore is affirmative action for law students. A study published in the Stanford Law review found that "Affirmative action thus artificially depresses, quite substantially, the rate at which blacks pass the bar." This led to fewer black lawyers in the workforce. "....If all preferences were abolished, the data in Part VIII suggests that the number of black attorneys emerging from the class of 2004 would be 7% larger than it is.... and the number of black attorneys passing the bar on their first attempt would be 20% larger.".

[Anonymous]

The people that get executed are likely not going to reflect racial percentages in the population. Lets do a lottery and pick up a few to even it out.

[Anonymous]

Brabrand is a snake oil salesman. FCPS board is sleeping at the wheel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is my biggest concern:
What if the smartest Asian kid, smartest Indian kid, smartest Black Kid, smartest White kid, smartest Hispanic kid.....all of them...all of them dont get lucky in the lottery.
And these five kids were the ones who were going to be the next inventors, innovators in STEM and we failed them because they were "unlucky"

With the lottery system, there is still no guarantee that the selection pool will be diverse or the smartest well deserved URM student will be in TJ.
I understand the need to help the URM kids who had no access to prepping.
Why can't we have a quota, for example, 40 or 50 sears for the highest scoring Hispanics, same for the highest scoring Blacks? Isn't this better, because now we have the best kids who can take that rigor, who tested well. and need that level?
And even if those URM kids did not prep, they are still the best among them, and that's who we want to serve in TJ. I know quota-based can also have pitfalls, but it can be closely monitored to adjust etc each year.

If we open TJ selection for lottery and everyone who just wants to try for the heck of it, gets lucky, the entire school will have to scramble, or parents will hate this, whose kids are stuggling and the kids whose needs are not met because of the struggling kids. And then what? It will take a few years to realize the very essemce of TJ is lost.

In the US we don't have separate schools by race. These types of schools were made illegal in the 1950's and 1960's in the US. Taxpayers pay for our schools.

It does not matter that the essence of the school is lost. It does not matter that the essence of TJ is lost. AA kids have just as much right to be at TJ in a school with
good physical equipment, a school without holes in the walls and a school with teachers that are not burned out.

Again, you are talking about a few dozen AA kids at the cost of shredding the whole merit-based system. It may even be less than that depending on the applicant/acceptance pool. Do some cost-benefit and uncertainty analysis. An easy solution usually does not work. I don't have a right as a short hispanic to be on a varsity basketball team to enjoy the new gym. I have to earn it by being able to jump/dribble/shoot. 3.5 GPA is pretty short when it comes to the curriculum at TJ. But perhaps that is the goal - to stunt TJ as an institution which produces some of the greatest potential to shape the future in the STEM fields.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The true intention here was never to diversify. The lottery / quota has great optics, but has proven time and time again, to lead to worse outcomes for the very demographic it pretends to be helping.

One good case study to explore is affirmative action for law students. A study published in the Stanford Law review found that "Affirmative action thus artificially depresses, quite substantially, the rate at which blacks pass the bar." This led to fewer black lawyers in the workforce. "....If all preferences were abolished, the data in Part VIII suggests that the number of black attorneys emerging from the class of 2004 would be 7% larger than it is.... and the number of black attorneys passing the bar on their first attempt would be 20% larger.".

Maybe the exam to pass the bar is discriminating. We know for a fact that math is discriminating, SAT is discriminating, STEM is discriminating, it won’t be a surprise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The true intention here was never to diversify. The lottery / quota has great optics, but has proven time and time again, to lead to worse outcomes for the very demographic it pretends to be helping.

One good case study to explore is affirmative action for law students. A study published in the Stanford Law review found that "Affirmative action thus artificially depresses, quite substantially, the rate at which blacks pass the bar." This led to fewer black lawyers in the workforce. "....If all preferences were abolished, the data in Part VIII suggests that the number of black attorneys emerging from the class of 2004 would be 7% larger than it is.... and the number of black attorneys passing the bar on their first attempt would be 20% larger.".

Maybe the exam to pass the bar is discriminating. We know for a fact that math is discriminating, SAT is discriminating, STEM is discriminating, it won’t be a surprise.

Yes let’s have a lottery to select lawyers with all the law school grads. No different than what they are proposing.

[Anonymous]

The black kids will ruin it

[Anonymous]

Read the Shaker Heights Study. Say no more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The black kids will ruin it

The incidents of harassments, disruptive behavior, assaults and cheating will increase.

[Anonymous]

I'll say it again. Read the Shaker Heights Study.

[Anonymous]

These posts are so incredibly racist and, no, not towards Asians.

I believe FCPS has no option at this point other than to return TJ to local community use and retain a consultant to redraw the FCPS school boundaries. TJHSST is simply beyond saving at this point.

[Anonymous]

Harvard is racist the whole college should be Asian. And I'm not a racist I'm a race realist.

[Anonymous]

People lie to themselves, they shouldn't envy hard working intelligent kids they should admit their kids watch to much tv, sleep to much, and are generally lazy.

Look at the bright side though, TJ may soon have a competitive football team.

[Anonymous]

Biggest lie we tell our kids today is that they can be anything, they can't.....they're limited.