Tiger Mom’s husband kept trying to bang his students

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

At least that’s all that was alleged in the formal complaint process...

Exactly. Plus the average YLS alum, especially one that got an assist from him after any alleged extracurricular activity, is likely very successful and would not want anyone knowing how they get a leg up, nor any drama in their life from this. Plus YLS produces a lot of future professors, so who would want their participation in this to leak, knowing it could impact their Ivory Tower career. I'd bet anyone involved had a "no comment" response to Yale investigators.

Probably. I was at YLS 15 years ago and it was rumored then that he slept with his female students. I would say "well known" except I, of course, didn't know anyone who'd actually admitted to doing it, nor anyone alleged to have done so, only that everyone said it went on. So, that's rumor. I never took a class with either of them. Based on the gossip mill he was super smarmy and she was flashy and more talk than substance, and I was more interested in black letter, basic law than cutting edge stuff. (Not why most people go to Yale, admittedly.)

It was gross then and it's gross now. Gross of the teacher and the student, although given the power dynamics the teacher is always more to blame. It's not like they have to sleep with anyone if propositioned. There was another exceedingly good-looking, brilliant young prof when I was there -- Noah Feldman, who's now at Harvard or Columbia I think -- and I never heard any rumors about him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student in a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jed is an ass. The formal allegations against him were only the tip of the iceberg. He was even smarmier 10-20 years ago and is lucky many of this folks moved on with this lives. (Also, he tended to reward rather than retaliate against those he behaved most inappropriately towards even once their dalliances ended, so I don’t think many of his biggest victims would really be out to get him.) Amy is an idiot who wrote almost none of her most recent book. Sophia is actually really smart & nice; surprisingly good people. (I don’t know Lulu.)

Posts like these are why I stick around DCUM. I figured someone here would have personal experience with this couple thru law school/industry networks.

NP- I am familiar with her from her Duke days. She fanned the flames of many a crush. There were even guys who wore “hot for teacher” themed costumes on Halloween, and she was the focus of all that ridiculousness.

She was young when she taught at Duke right? Like in her early 30s?

It was 20+ years ago, so whatever that works out to. I don’t know exactly how old she is now, but that sounds about right.

I have an old friend who was her student at Duke and really liked her and kept in touch with her. I wonder what she thinks of her now. My old friend is a nice person but maybe she was a bit star struck, I don’t know. I also went to a top 10 law school and people were sort of weirdly obsessed with various professors, a combo of hero worship and Stockholm syndrome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmm. I want more evidence before I pass judgement.

You think Yale suspended one of its most powerful law professors for fun? Uh, no.

PS I think you are totally wrong about Elizabeth Warren, who was incredibly popular and well-respected as a HLS professor, and I don't think you know her well enough to call her Liz.

Warren absolutely got her Harvard gig off her husband Bruce Mann's coattails -- he's the Carl F. Schipper, Jr. Professor of Law at Harvard Law School.

This is a load of bullshit. Warren and Bruce Mann both taught at Penn. Warren left Penn to teach at Harvard Law in 1995. Mann remained at Penn until 2006, then moved to Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmm. I want more evidence before I pass judgement.

You think Yale suspended one of its most powerful law professors for fun? Uh, no.

PS I think you are totally wrong about Elizabeth Warren, who was incredibly popular and well-respected as a HLS professor, and I don't think you know her well enough to call her Liz.

Warren absolutely got her Harvard gig off her husband Bruce Mann's coattails -- he's the Carl F. Schipper, Jr. Professor of Law at Harvard Law School.

This is a load of bullshit. Warren and Bruce Mann both taught at Penn. Warren left Penn to teach at Harvard Law in 1995. Mann remained at Penn until 2006, then moved to Harvard.

New poster. I have known Sen. Warren for years - didn’t go to HLS but have worked with her. She has a strong legal mind. Sound but not what you would call brilliant. Very well prepared but when things veer off script - and this is where great lawyers earn their greatness - she was just ok. No clue how she got her job at HLS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hmm. I want more evidence before I pass judgement.

You think Yale suspended one of its most powerful law professors for fun? Uh, no.

PS I think you are totally wrong about Elizabeth Warren, who was incredibly popular and well-respected as a HLS professor, and I don't think you know her well enough to call her Liz.

Warren absolutely got her Harvard gig off her husband Bruce Mann's coattails -- he's the Carl F. Schipper, Jr. Professor of Law at Harvard Law School.

This is a load of bullshit. Warren and Bruce Mann both taught at Penn. Warren left Penn to teach at Harvard Law in 1995. Mann remained at Penn until 2006, then moved to Harvard.

Who followed who to Penn? Penn Harvard, tomato tomahto.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student is a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

My oldest two daughters witnessed several "ambitious" undergraduate interns in SF and NYC eagerly hooking up with their managers to ensure favor and offers at the end of the summer. These were merely $60,000 to $80,000 entry level jobs. To act as if no cutthroat young ladies at YLS would ever hook up with a decent looking professor for a $180,000 to $200,000+ gig is very naive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student is a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

My oldest two daughters witnessed several "ambitious" undergraduate interns in SF and NYC eagerly hooking up with their managers to ensure favor and offers at the end of the summer. These were merely $60,000 to $80,000 entry level jobs. To act as if no cutthroat young ladies at YLS would ever hook up with a decent looking professor for a $180,000 to $200,000+ gig is very naive.

The parents who say this always cry foul when that oily midlevel manager propositions THEIR daughter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Who followed who to Penn? Penn Harvard, tomato tomahto.

Said no one ever. Except to put down a woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student is a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

My oldest two daughters witnessed several "ambitious" undergraduate interns in SF and NYC eagerly hooking up with their managers to ensure favor and offers at the end of the summer. These were merely $60,000 to $80,000 entry level jobs. To act as if no cutthroat young ladies at YLS would ever hook up with a decent looking professor for a $180,000 to $200,000+ gig is very naive.

It is not especially difficult for a YLS grad to get a $180,000 to $200,000 a year job. It is sort of hard not to get that offer. I imagine students did sleep with Jed over the years (he was sort of hot 20 years ago, for one thing) but I don’t think that getting a standard issue big law job was the motivation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student is a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

My oldest two daughters witnessed several "ambitious" undergraduate interns in SF and NYC eagerly hooking up with their managers to ensure favor and offers at the end of the summer. These were merely $60,000 to $80,000 entry level jobs. To act as if no cutthroat young ladies at YLS would ever hook up with a decent looking professor for a $180,000 to $200,000+ gig is very naive.

It is not especially difficult for a YLS grad to get a $180,000 to $200,000 a year job. It is sort of hard not to get that offer. I imagine students did sleep with Jed over the years (he was sort of hot 20 years ago, for one thing) but I don’t think that getting a standard issue big law job was the motivation.

I agree. It wasn't people after standard issue big law jobs, it was people who were after elite clerkships which are much, much scarcer. And for an elite clerkship, having Jed's stamp of approval carries weight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. He tried to bang but could not bang. Big difference.

Oh sweetie, you're naive. It's a numbers game; some say no, some say yes. Not all, but a few of my sorority sisters 30 years ago 100% would have hooked up with a professor for an A in a very tough course. That's just one undergrad course. Imagine the extent gals would go when $180,000 to 200,000 jobs and hyper-exclusive clerkships are on the line. Again, not every gal would, but of course SOME would eagerly hook up with him. Not to mention the average law student is a conniver -- you hook up with him, you have him by the balls. Clever YLS gals would exploit that to make sure he delivered the summer associate, clerkship, etc. help.

I agree. I knew a lot of YLS people and some were cool but definitely a large number of connivers—bright but conniving. The connivers were the ones who would do this stuff, the gunners were more out in the open re:their tactics.

I think the crowd after clerkships was often pretty bad. Probably because clerkships were so scarce and you had to kiss up to the right professors. The crowd after generic biglaw jobs was okay at Yale (enough of those in a non recession esp since Yale is smaller) other than a handful who decided it was Wachtell/Cravath or bust.

My oldest two daughters witnessed several "ambitious" undergraduate interns in SF and NYC eagerly hooking up with their managers to ensure favor and offers at the end of the summer. These were merely $60,000 to $80,000 entry level jobs. To act as if no cutthroat young ladies at YLS would ever hook up with a decent looking professor for a $180,000 to $200,000+ gig is very naive.

Eh, there are generally enough biglaw jobs to go around at YLS which has a small class size (some of which don't even want to go into biglaw) and a reputation as the most elite law school. You don't have to be top of the class to get a generic 180k NYC biglaw offer from YLS. You don't need professor's recs, either.

However, you DO have to be top the class at YLS to get a top clerkship, which many Yale students dream of. And a professor's word/recommendation counts for a LOT when it comes to clerkship hiring.

[Anonymous]

I'm trying to wrap my head around a cute and very smart 22-26 year old gal at the most prestigious law school in the US being propositioned by her professor.

Can one of you detail precisely how scarce are clerkships? There's also varying tiers of clerkships too, yes? And clerks don't make much money, do they, it's all about setting the table for exit opportunities? What's the big deal about clerking?

200 kids total per year at YLS and only a small % of each class (inc. m and f) is gunning for these clerkships, right? So a pervy professor's pool of clerkship-gunning females would be fairly shallow?

[Anonymous]

About 40 percent of each YLS class clerks and some apply who don’t end up getting a clerkship. Jed flirted with me long long ago. It was all very plausibly deniable. I doubt that he was going up to students and proposing a quid pro quo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe she can get a book deal out of it.

No question.

Tiger divorcee dating.

Totally. She was the one who mentored the Hillbilly Elegy author (I did not like his book).

Interesting, I grew up in a poor community not quite as downtrodden as the Hollow, but went on to an Ivy and thought I would relate more to that book than I did. I suspect her influence maybe part of it.