Hunkering down: the long haul

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My husband and I (geneticist and virologist) are probably not sending our tween and teen to school until we’ve been vaccinated. We are anticipating Covid-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths to surge with each attempt to open, and hope a vaccine will be available in 2021 (Dr. Fauci predicted early 2021).

Are you otherwise continuing to live in “stay at home” rules or have you shifted on any of that?

PP you replied to.

We are still teleworking, not seeing people socially and ordering online. We rented a Bay beach house with private beach we plan to drive to without stopping, and will disinfect surfaces once we arrive. We will probably have a physically distant picnic with one other family to celebrate our multiple missed birthdays. I am not inviting anyone to my house (we will need to let in someone from Verizon).

And for another PP, a surge for me would be a statistically significant increase in Covid-19 hospitalization and deaths.

Pls share your rental info. I would love to do something like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

My husband and I (geneticist and virologist) are probably not sending our tween and teen to school until we’ve been vaccinated. We are anticipating Covid-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths to surge with each attempt to open, and hope a vaccine will be available in 2021 (Dr. Fauci predicted early 2021).

Are you otherwise continuing to live in “stay at home” rules or have you shifted on any of that?

PP you replied to.

We are still teleworking, not seeing people socially and ordering online. We rented a Bay beach house with private beach we plan to drive to without stopping, and will disinfect surfaces once we arrive. We will probably have a physically distant picnic with one other family to celebrate our multiple missed birthdays. I am not inviting anyone to my house (we will need to let in someone from Verizon).

And for another PP, a surge for me would be a statistically significant increase in Covid-19 hospitalization and deaths.

Merely statistically significant? Are you sure you really meant to say that? All that would mean is that there's an increase of any size that is unlikely to occur by chance. If opening schools *doesn't* lead to a statistically significant increase, then this lockdown has been an incredible mistake.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People generally have trouble changing (for want of a better word) paradigm. At first, they just think about going back to the way it was and not accepting that it will never be the same again. Eventually, most accept the change and move forward. I have no idea how long it will take most people to accept the change.

I work with parents of children with special needs and there is a very wide range of acceptance timelines after the first diagnosis. I see some similar reactions to the Covid threat.

Yeah, let’s just scramble and undo thousand of years of evolution when people developed a need for belonging to social groups and children required in person interaction with peers for social and emotional development.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
NP here. “Stress” is simply overused now. It’s not a deadly stress to deny your kid play dates or skip going to the mall. Yes, it’s difficult - and it’s different - but we all really have to learn to buck up.

It is actually deadly because the mental health consequences of isolation are detrimental.
Idiot, your kid is not just having a playdate, he/she us learning social skills they will use for the rest of their lives and emotional regulation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

That’s your family’s problem. Either one of your bosses will have to allow you to continue to work from home, you’ll have to find a job that will, or you will have to change your lifestyle and learn to live on a single income. This is a global crisis. None of us are entitled to the same lifestyle we had before the pandemic.
When you chose to have children, you assumed responsibility for their care. It’s simple.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

That’s your family’s problem. Either one of your bosses will have to allow you to continue to work from home, you’ll have to find a job that will, or you will have to change your lifestyle and learn to live on a single income. This is a global crisis. None of us are entitled to the same lifestyle we had before the pandemic.
When you chose to have children, you assumed responsibility for their care. It’s simple.

And I had options for care before the county took them away.

And working from home doesn't solve that problem. I can work from home indefinitely. But you can't work while caring for two kids under 3.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

That’s your family’s problem. Either one of your bosses will have to allow you to continue to work from home, you’ll have to find a job that will, or you will have to change your lifestyle and learn to live on a single income. This is a global crisis. None of us are entitled to the same lifestyle we had before the pandemic.
When you chose to have children, you assumed responsibility for their care. It’s simple.

And I had options for care before the county took them away.

And working from home doesn't solve that problem. I can work from home indefinitely. But you can't work while caring for two kids under 3.

Adding to that. I'd be really curious to know what that previous poster's situation is. I bet they don't have young children. Or if they do, they're either single income or have a nanny. It's pretty easy to say "shut down daycares and schools" when it doesn't have that much of an impact on you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

That’s your family’s problem. Either one of your bosses will have to allow you to continue to work from home, you’ll have to find a job that will, or you will have to change your lifestyle and learn to live on a single income. This is a global crisis. None of us are entitled to the same lifestyle we had before the pandemic.
When you chose to have children, you assumed responsibility for their care. It’s simple.

And I had options for care before the county took them away.

And working from home doesn't solve that problem. I can work from home indefinitely. But you can't work while caring for two kids under 3.

Adding to that. I'd be really curious to know what that previous poster's situation is. I bet they don't have young children. Or if they do, they're either single income or have a nanny. It's pretty easy to say "shut down daycares and schools" when it doesn't have that much of an impact on you.

It has an impact on everyone. People who expect 5 days a week of full time school in the fall are going to have a really tough time dealing with the reality. The county isn’t taking anything away from you. There is currently a pandemic that necessitates we take measures to control the spread of infection. It isn’t a plot to inconvenience you and no one is imposing this on you or your family. 21 cases are seeing rising levels of infection and some are reporting record hospitalizations. Is pretending the virus is gone working for them?

[Anonymous]

*states not cases

[Anonymous]

The county isn’t taking anything away from you.

How can you possibly say that? I had daycare. The state said the daycare provider could reopen and watch my kids. Then the county said no.

How is that not the county taking it away?

We could argue over whether that is justifiable, not whether they took it away.

[Anonymous]

It isn’t a plot to inconvenience you and no one is imposing this on you or your family.

And no, of course I don't think it's a plot against me.

But again, it's wrong to say no one is imposing this on us. The county absolutely is. If they stayed out of it then our daycare provider would have reopened and would be watching our kids. That wasn't our decision. That wasn't the provider's decision. That was a county decision imposed on us.

[Anonymous]

It has an impact on everyone. People who expect 5 days a week of full time school in the fall are going to have a really tough time dealing with the reality.

I'll also note it's different for older kids. Having middle school, or even elementary school, kids home is a distraction. They're somewhat autonomous at that point. By that point they're old enough to know when they should leave you alone, and they can occupy themselves while staying out of dangerous situations fairly well.

That's not true for infants/toddlers. It's not a comparable situation. In all likelihood, daycares will reopen fairly soon, and probably won't close again to the same extent because I think the county has learned their lesson. After talking to some of the county staff, it's pretty clear they dug themselves into a hole and didn't know how to get themselves out of it, particularly once they started deviating from the MSDE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I keep thinking that we’re going wrong in believing that returning to our previous before corona lifestyle is the only answer. I totally feel the stress too but that can’t justify just giving up and pretending the virus doesn’t exist.

This. We have to find other ways to live and thrive.

“Other ways to live and thrive”?? Like what? What does this even mean?

Not interacting with other humans?
Not socializing?
Not receiving an education?
It’s Orwellian! And people don’t want it, and I don’t blame them.

NP here and it’s not about what people want!! People didn’t want to go through the Blitz or the rationing during the war. But they didn’t deny it was happening just to get back to normal or because it was too stressful.

Not going back to school, socializing, parties, etc is temporary.

And it’s so far from Orwellian.

+1 to the bold. So much wimpiness all over these boards. Their idea of "temporary" changes means weeks, not months or years. Yet they feel they've made noble sacrifices already and must be set free to "live their lives" and ensure their children get what they think of as "socialization." They actually mean they are tired of having their kids underfoot and want school and playtime back so the kids are occupied and tired out. But they'll be right back to blasting the schools and criticizing the teachers, even as they rush to send their kids back to those teachers in desperation for the babysitting--sorry, the education and socializing.

Total wimps, as well as science deniers who will be so very shocked when the virus continues to spread after the reopenings they insist must happen.

OK, so can I bring my kids over to your house if you think we need to keep society shut down until there's a vaccine? Because it's not like I don't have to work right now. What do you expect dual-income families to do that have small kids?

That’s your family’s problem. Either one of your bosses will have to allow you to continue to work from home, you’ll have to find a job that will, or you will have to change your lifestyle and learn to live on a single income. This is a global crisis. None of us are entitled to the same lifestyle we had before the pandemic.
When you chose to have children, you assumed responsibility for their care. It’s simple.

Come on now. I hope that you are more supportive of your own coworkers with young children than you have been to PP. I have an 11 and 7 year old and this has been a breeze for us compared to my friends and colleagues with very young children...but it sure has felt hard for us too! I am not interested in opening up schools and daycares earlier than the science recommends. I also recognize the burden that closures place on families with young children. This only works if we show compassion to one another.