pros and cons of CES?

[Anonymous]

Avoid PBES if you can. There's something not right about their CES 4th Grade Reading / Writing program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Avoid PBES if you can. There's something not right about their CES 4th Grade Reading / Writing program.

Completely disagree. The 4th grade CES at PBES set our DC up for being highly successful in writing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^If you have your heart set on a MS magnet I do think at least this year it was easier to get in from the non-CES schools. They tried to include a few from each elementary so if your child is the top at his home school it seems like she or he got in. At the CES, top kids were waitlisted left and right and according to DC's friends some of the non-CES kids scored lower than some CES kids.

Those higher scoring CES kids did get off the wait list later.

They compared CES kids to other kids from their home elementary, not the CES class, and were looking at the cohort available in their home MS. CES does not change whether or not you get into MS magnets.

You are very wrong.

They compared kids to their home middle school. But there was an extra layer of selection where they tried to make sure every elementary was included. This is why you would see kids with much lower scores get in if they were the top kids at their home middle school. Competition to get from the CES was crazy. Shocked certain kids (not DC) did not get during the first round.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Academics are infinitely better. There is just no comparison. None. Math is actually better, too, because they go through so much faster and have time for extra projects. The principal will try very hard to get you to stay at the home school, but they cannot give your child that kind of constant enrichment. The CES is a place where acceleration and aptitude are embraced instead of accommodated. The classmates MAKE the class... they are bright and fast and funny. The CES teachers work very hard and give lots of feedback. If your child hates to read, I would hesitate, because there is a lot of reading and most of the kids love to discuss their books together.

I agree with all of this, unfortunately, because it shouldn't require a kid to be at a CES program to get this type of education. I would consider the CCES CES program on par, academically, with the best private schools in the area. It's still MCPS with the same facilities, bureaucracy, etc., but the core classes - reading, writing, social studies/science and math - are right up there. And, yes, I realize that math is not formally part of the program, but it effectively is because the CES kids at CCES all take compacted math together with one of the CES teachers dedicated to the program, and it's been one of the best parts of the experience for our DC. It might be the same compacted math curriculum, but the math teachers have not hesitated to go deeper into each area and really make the subject come alive, and assign projects that keep the kids engaged. Also, the homework at CCES hasn't been heavy at all, although your kids has to like reading as the PP noted. Most of the work is done during the school hours. Long term projects do take time, organization and focus.

This is not universally true. At Piney Branch not all the CES kids are in compacted math and kids who are not in the CES are in compacted math alongside some CES kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^If you have your heart set on a MS magnet I do think at least this year it was easier to get in from the non-CES schools. They tried to include a few from each elementary so if your child is the top at his home school it seems like she or he got in. At the CES, top kids were waitlisted left and right and according to DC's friends some of the non-CES kids scored lower than some CES kids.

Those higher scoring CES kids did get off the wait list later.

They compared CES kids to other kids from their home elementary, not the CES class, and were looking at the cohort available in their home MS. CES does not change whether or not you get into MS magnets.

You are very wrong.

They compared kids to their home middle school. But there was an extra layer of selection where they tried to make sure every elementary was included. This is why you would see kids with much lower scores get in if they were the top kids at their home middle school. Competition to get from the CES was crazy. Shocked certain kids (not DC) did not get during the first round.

Link please.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^If you have your heart set on a MS magnet I do think at least this year it was easier to get in from the non-CES schools. They tried to include a few from each elementary so if your child is the top at his home school it seems like she or he got in. At the CES, top kids were waitlisted left and right and according to DC's friends some of the non-CES kids scored lower than some CES kids.

Those higher scoring CES kids did get off the wait list later.

They compared CES kids to other kids from their home elementary, not the CES class, and were looking at the cohort available in their home MS. CES does not change whether or not you get into MS magnets.

You are very wrong.

They compared kids to their home middle school. But there was an extra layer of selection where they tried to make sure every elementary was included. This is why you would see kids with much lower scores get in if they were the top kids at their home middle school. Competition to get from the CES was crazy. Shocked certain kids (not DC) did not get during the first round.

Link please.

No. It had nothing to do with CES. It had to do with home elementary and home MS. Same for kids who apply from private school... they were compared to home elementary and home middle school. There is no CES competition. This is pure myth.

[Anonymous]

You aren't reading carefully. The kids were compared to their home MS so the outliers from there got in. Next they went back and tried to make sure every elementary was included.

Assuming many of the outliers were already at the CES there was no extra need to make sure that CES was represented.

Some home elementary schools were not represented in the initial selection by home MS. They had to go back and make sure at least 2 kids from each ES was represented which resulted in some other kids not getting in and some of those kids were at the CES because CES kids tend to score high on testing which is why they are there in the first place.

They don't explicitly look at being in a CES but the criteria ends up favoring those top students who stay at their home ES.

You don't have to believe me but this is how they did it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You aren't reading carefully. The kids were compared to their home MS so the outliers from there got in. Next they went back and tried to make sure every elementary was included.

Assuming many of the outliers were already at the CES there was no extra need to make sure that CES was represented.

Some home elementary schools were not represented in the initial selection by home MS. They had to go back and make sure at least 2 kids from each ES was represented which resulted in some other kids not getting in and some of those kids were at the CES because CES kids tend to score high on testing which is why they are there in the first place.

They don't explicitly look at being in a CES but the criteria ends up favoring those top students who stay at their home ES.

You don't have to believe me but this is how they did it.

How do you know? The process has always been a little opaque, and it does seem to have changed with every class for the last 3 years at least.

So, how do you have such detailed knowledge of the process, when the explanations put out by MCPS have always been so fuzzy?

[Anonymous]

I asked them.

[Anonymous]

It does match with what they have said. It's part of their balancing at the end. They also go back and balance for gender.

[Anonymous]

We are similarly having difficulty deciding about CES (Chevy Chase) for our daughter. She is very comfortable and has great friends at our home school. She didn't even want to take the test because it might mean she would be moved to a different school, so we haven't told her yet that she was accepted. She is very anxious in new social situations, and there is no easy way to introduce her to the new school in these crazy times. So we are really struggling with weighing her social/emotional and academic well being right now.

[Anonymous]

PP, Strongly advise you to talk to other parents in your neighborhood who have kids at CCES. I think they will be reassuring. Our child's experience is that the other girls have been supportive and there was less drama than in the home school. DD also said the boys and girls mixed more in terms of friendship groups which was different for her and nice.

If she wants the academic challenge and won't shy away from that I don't think the social aspect should hold her back. If she is a person who is less confident about academics or less organized I would hesitate more in recommending as DD does see a lot more anxiety about grades and performance among her peers than in her home school. Some very upset kids when the first few sets of graded papers came back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^If you have your heart set on a MS magnet I do think at least this year it was easier to get in from the non-CES schools. They tried to include a few from each elementary so if your child is the top at his home school it seems like she or he got in. At the CES, top kids were waitlisted left and right and according to DC's friends some of the non-CES kids scored lower than some CES kids.

Those higher scoring CES kids did get off the wait list later.

They compared CES kids to other kids from their home elementary, not the CES class, and were looking at the cohort available in their home MS. CES does not change whether or not you get into MS magnets.

You are very wrong.

They compared kids to their home middle school. But there was an extra layer of selection where they tried to make sure every elementary was included. This is why you would see kids with much lower scores get in if they were the top kids at their home middle school. Competition to get from the CES was crazy. Shocked certain kids (not DC) did not get during the first round.

Link please.

No. It had nothing to do with CES. It had to do with home elementary and home MS. Same for kids who apply from private school... they were compared to home elementary and home middle school. There is no CES competition. This is pure myth.

I don't believe this for a second. I have a kid at CCES CES, and almost no one got into the MS magnets. Irrespective of what ES they came from. It's not possible that none of these kids are the top kid when compared with the pool at the home school. They absolutely are considering the CES kids to be coming "from" the CES elementary school, not from the home school. I strongly believe that going to the CES now reduces the chance of getting into the MS magnets. But I can also see some value to spreading around those opportunities. My kid got 2 great years in CES, and now a kid from our home ES who didn't have that will have a similarly rigorous experience in MS. And my kid will be coming from a different MS when time rolls around for HS programs. Or kid will have a great experience at the home HS. It is what it is and you're not guaranteed the perfect individualized learning experience from public school. If that's what you want you have to go pay for it. Our kid has flourished in the CES. But kid will most likely also be fine at the home MS. It is what it is.

[Anonymous]

PP,

MCPS has said they compare the kids by home MS and then they make sure to include every elementary school. That would result in the same situation you are talking about even if they did not compare CES students against other CES students.

Guess your child's home MS is the same as ours. Some CES kids with stratospheric scores headed there so those with merely high scores will not look like outliers compared to them.

Your child's old classmate from the home school is likely the top of his/her school and got in that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I don't believe this for a second. I have a kid at CCES CES, and almost no one got into the MS magnets. Irrespective of what ES they came from. It's not possible that none of these kids are the top kid when compared with the pool at the home school. They absolutely are considering the CES kids to be coming "from" the CES elementary school, not from the home school. I strongly believe that going to the CES now reduces the chance of getting into the MS magnets. But I can also see some value to spreading around those opportunities. My kid got 2 great years in CES, and now a kid from our home ES who didn't have that will have a similarly rigorous experience in MS. And my kid will be coming from a different MS when time rolls around for HS programs. Or kid will have a great experience at the home HS. It is what it is and you're not guaranteed the perfect individualized learning experience from public school. If that's what you want you have to go pay for it. Our kid has flourished in the CES. But kid will most likely also be fine at the home MS. It is what it is.

+1 to the almost no one got in this year.