Out of school suspension in MCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm an MCPS teacher who strongly believes in public education, but I send my kids to Catholic school. I live in the neighborhood where I teach and the parents here are out of control. They refuse to hold their kids accountable, let them fail, or accept consequences. The entitlement of some of these kids is outrageous. The Catholic school my kids attend has a strong discipline system and the parents support it.

This was true of us as well. The students at my W feeder were so out of control that I laughed when my principal suggested I COSA my child there. It was hard managing private ES on two MCPS salaries, but we made it to the age DC could latchkey. Discipline is less of a problem at my child’s DCC MS than the school where I teach. Looking to transfer away from parents with their heads in the sand and a lawyer on speed dial.

two-teacher (MCPS) HH

We're moving out of county. I simply cannot stand the excuses made for poor behavior, and I say this for ALL kids - regardless of race and SES status. The parents with money use their lawyers to threaten the schools. So even if the schools try to hold kids to certain standards of behavior and academic performance, parents intervene. Minorities are also held to different standards, which is - in itself - racist. Pushing a kid along - one who can't read on level - and blaming the teachers for issues beyond our control are two reasons that have soured me.

And guess what? I blame us! Until we start rocking the boat and taking our professions back, we will always be pawns. sad, but true

If you think MCPS is worth saving, then inundate the BOE with letters.

One email address - [e-mail] - goes out to all.

I'm assuming you have perfect kids. Lucky you. You do realize that as a teacher, YOU failed a child if they cannot read. That child should have been assessed and given significant interventions by 1st grade and parents shouldn't have to fight for basic supports. We've spent a fortune on private interventions to keep our child at grade level because MCPS services and help are a joke. Teachers are to blame. They need to help advocate for kids and not let them fall through the cracks. Our teacher clearly identified one area of need. We held an IEP mention where we and the teacher agreed and they refused to give my child the basic support they needed. So, instead, they failed him on that subject area in the report card we got a few days later and they never ever mentioned that he was going to fail in that IEP meeting (this a a two day difference).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm an MCPS teacher who strongly believes in public education, but I send my kids to Catholic school. I live in the neighborhood where I teach and the parents here are out of control. They refuse to hold their kids accountable, let them fail, or accept consequences. The entitlement of some of these kids is outrageous. The Catholic school my kids attend has a strong discipline system and the parents support it.

This was true of us as well. The students at my W feeder were so out of control that I laughed when my principal suggested I COSA my child there. It was hard managing private ES on two MCPS salaries, but we made it to the age DC could latchkey. Discipline is less of a problem at my child’s DCC MS than the school where I teach. Looking to transfer away from parents with their heads in the sand and a lawyer on speed dial.

two-teacher (MCPS) HH

We're moving out of county. I simply cannot stand the excuses made for poor behavior, and I say this for ALL kids - regardless of race and SES status. The parents with money use their lawyers to threaten the schools. So even if the schools try to hold kids to certain standards of behavior and academic performance, parents intervene. Minorities are also held to different standards, which is - in itself - racist. Pushing a kid along - one who can't read on level - and blaming the teachers for issues beyond our control are two reasons that have soured me.

And guess what? I blame us! Until we start rocking the boat and taking our professions back, we will always be pawns. sad, but true

If you think MCPS is worth saving, then inundate the BOE with letters.

One email address - [e-mail] - goes out to all.

I'm assuming you have perfect kids. Lucky you. You do realize that as a teacher, YOU failed a child if they cannot read. That child should have been assessed and given significant interventions by 1st grade and parents shouldn't have to fight for basic supports. We've spent a fortune on private interventions to keep our child at grade level because MCPS services and help are a joke. Teachers are to blame. They need to help advocate for kids and not let them fall through the cracks. Our teacher clearly identified one area of need. We held an IEP mention where we and the teacher agreed and they refused to give my child the basic support they needed. So, instead, they failed him on that subject area in the report card we got a few days later and they never ever mentioned that he was going to fail in that IEP meeting (this a a two day difference).

Let’s start with ending social promotion. Can’t read by third grade, you repeat third grade. That way, middle schoolers aren’t acting up to disguise they can’t do the work. Teachers won’t be blamed for deficiencies that happened five years earlier in another school. And parents will have an accurate view of their child’s abilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If your child is white or Asian, he is out of luck. MCPS trys to reduce the suspension rate for blacks and hispanics now. They can neither keep the troubled bl and hispanic students in the classroom or suspend more white or Asian students so the rate of bl and hispanic students being disciplined will go lower. You need either find a lawyer to navigate the system or find a private school for your ds.

Or maybe her kid can start behaving himself.
Black and Hispanic kids get suspended from our school, so stop the trolling.

She’s not trolling. I work for MCPS, and the county is carefully tracking these numbers.

Yes, that is why sometimes my principal unofficially suspends kids. Basically when it goes too far to be ignored but they don’t want the data to show they suspended an AA or HI male. I am in a position at my school where I am able to see suspension data and the kids who most deserve it (most egregious behavior over multiple instances) aren’t on there as having received suspensions. I know my principal unofficially suspends them but doesn’t want the data to reflect that because then they’d have to hear it from their boss and Central Office. This shouldn’t be allowed at all but it happens. If a kid’s behavior is egregious enough for a suspension then it should be properly documented for the student’s sake as well. Sometimes an alternative placement is the best environment for the student and there needs to be documentation to help make that argument.

+1 on the scam of using unofficial suspensions to keep it off the books. Any parent who is asked to pick up a child early or to keep that at home should be asking for paperwork - documentation of the incident an a form indicating reason for suspension, lesser alternative solutions tried and failed, term of suspension and rights of appeal.

Schools do this unofficial suspension crap also all the time to kids with IEPs and 504s to cover up failure to provide FAPE.

What schools are doing this unofficial thing? That really bothers me. They should fix the underlying reason principals feel they need to fly under the radar, but in the meantime scamming isn’t the answer—it just obscures the problem and makes it difficult for troubled kids to get appropriate help or an IEP or whatever they need because they haven’t accrued evidence.

Our school does this. It is very well known. Parents and teachers have been incredibly frustrated and some parents have gone to the Cluster Super. But I’m guessing ALL the admin are in the same situation and under the same pressures.

Agree that it obscures the problem. And IMO, it’s confusing to the kids who need solid limits. Especially in ES.

Our school kept my child in the office all day one day and took away several days of lunch and recess for something really minor. It was bizarre as all the kids were doing it. I had no idea they were holding him hostage all day in the office or I would have gone to the school and taken him. I believe in holding kids accountable but he copied another child, they knew it, scape coated him and then when the other kids kept doing it, he kept getting blamed when he didn't continue to do it. All the kids act similar at our school, except some with high SN and that's a different situation. However, they are much more severe on the white kids than other races and hold some kids, like mine to a different standard (including telling us how he should dress and wear his hair - neat, clean nothing remarkable). Schools are very inconsistent with how they handle things. It sounds like he should have also had protection under his IEP and clearly did not. So those wanting to make it a race issue, you'll be happy to know my white kid is bullied by other kids and nothing is done and he is severely punished for something minor he didn't even fully understand.

I truly wish this county had more affordable privates beyond the catholic schools.

Think Catholic schools are too much discipline for your DS? Or is it anti-Catholic bias keeping you in MCPS?

My child did something minor and it was a one time incident which was copying other kids. He's been at highly structured schools and had no problems. They choose to make an example out of him, which didn't work as the class behavior only got worse according to my child. I don't know what was fully going on as the teacher refused to talk to me about it.

The Catholic piece is what keeps us away. I looked at several schools and there were very few non-Christians and teachers at all schools referred to the kids as Catholic or non-Catholic with a clear distinction. At two schools on their social media, they encouraged the kids to go to pro-life marches and they heavily pushed religion. Kids were forced to say Catholic prayers multiple times a day. If they were more accepting of other religions and tolerant, I'd move my child in a heartbeat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If your child is white or Asian, he is out of luck. MCPS trys to reduce the suspension rate for blacks and hispanics now. They can neither keep the troubled bl and hispanic students in the classroom or suspend more white or Asian students so the rate of bl and hispanic students being disciplined will go lower. You need either find a lawyer to navigate the system or find a private school for your ds.

Or maybe her kid can start behaving himself.
Black and Hispanic kids get suspended from our school, so stop the trolling.

She’s not trolling. I work for MCPS, and the county is carefully tracking these numbers.

Yes, that is why sometimes my principal unofficially suspends kids. Basically when it goes too far to be ignored but they don’t want the data to show they suspended an AA or HI male. I am in a position at my school where I am able to see suspension data and the kids who most deserve it (most egregious behavior over multiple instances) aren’t on there as having received suspensions. I know my principal unofficially suspends them but doesn’t want the data to reflect that because then they’d have to hear it from their boss and Central Office. This shouldn’t be allowed at all but it happens. If a kid’s behavior is egregious enough for a suspension then it should be properly documented for the student’s sake as well. Sometimes an alternative placement is the best environment for the student and there needs to be documentation to help make that argument.

+1 on the scam of using unofficial suspensions to keep it off the books. Any parent who is asked to pick up a child early or to keep that at home should be asking for paperwork - documentation of the incident an a form indicating reason for suspension, lesser alternative solutions tried and failed, term of suspension and rights of appeal.

Schools do this unofficial suspension crap also all the time to kids with IEPs and 504s to cover up failure to provide FAPE.

What schools are doing this unofficial thing? That really bothers me. They should fix the underlying reason principals feel they need to fly under the radar, but in the meantime scamming isn’t the answer—it just obscures the problem and makes it difficult for troubled kids to get appropriate help or an IEP or whatever they need because they haven’t accrued evidence.

Our school does this. It is very well known. Parents and teachers have been incredibly frustrated and some parents have gone to the Cluster Super. But I’m guessing ALL the admin are in the same situation and under the same pressures.

Agree that it obscures the problem. And IMO, it’s confusing to the kids who need solid limits. Especially in ES.

Our school kept my child in the office all day one day and took away several days of lunch and recess for something really minor. It was bizarre as all the kids were doing it. I had no idea they were holding him hostage all day in the office or I would have gone to the school and taken him. I believe in holding kids accountable but he copied another child, they knew it, scape coated him and then when the other kids kept doing it, he kept getting blamed when he didn't continue to do it. All the kids act similar at our school, except some with high SN and that's a different situation. However, they are much more severe on the white kids than other races and hold some kids, like mine to a different standard (including telling us how he should dress and wear his hair - neat, clean nothing remarkable). Schools are very inconsistent with how they handle things. It sounds like he should have also had protection under his IEP and clearly did not. So those wanting to make it a race issue, you'll be happy to know my white kid is bullied by other kids and nothing is done and he is severely punished for something minor he didn't even fully understand.

I truly wish this county had more affordable privates beyond the catholic schools.

Think Catholic schools are too much discipline for your DS? Or is it anti-Catholic bias keeping you in MCPS?

My child did something minor and it was a one time incident which was copying other kids. He's been at highly structured schools and had no problems. They choose to make an example out of him, which didn't work as the class behavior only got worse according to my child. I don't know what was fully going on as the teacher refused to talk to me about it.

The Catholic piece is what keeps us away. I looked at several schools and there were very few non-Christians and teachers at all schools referred to the kids as Catholic or non-Catholic with a clear distinction. At two schools on their social media, they encouraged the kids to go to pro-life marches and they heavily pushed religion. Kids were forced to say Catholic prayers multiple times a day. If they were more accepting of other religions and tolerant, I'd move my child in a heartbeat.

This isn’t true if all Catholic schools. Most parochial ones have huge percentages of non-Catholic and even non-Christian students.

[Anonymous]

They are Catholic schools. God forbid they require students to study their religion and say Catholic prayers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If your child is white or Asian, he is out of luck. MCPS trys to reduce the suspension rate for blacks and hispanics now. They can neither keep the troubled bl and hispanic students in the classroom or suspend more white or Asian students so the rate of bl and hispanic students being disciplined will go lower. You need either find a lawyer to navigate the system or find a private school for your ds.

Or maybe her kid can start behaving himself.
Black and Hispanic kids get suspended from our school, so stop the trolling.

She’s not trolling. I work for MCPS, and the county is carefully tracking these numbers.

Yes, that is why sometimes my principal unofficially suspends kids. Basically when it goes too far to be ignored but they don’t want the data to show they suspended an AA or HI male. I am in a position at my school where I am able to see suspension data and the kids who most deserve it (most egregious behavior over multiple instances) aren’t on there as having received suspensions. I know my principal unofficially suspends them but doesn’t want the data to reflect that because then they’d have to hear it from their boss and Central Office. This shouldn’t be allowed at all but it happens. If a kid’s behavior is egregious enough for a suspension then it should be properly documented for the student’s sake as well. Sometimes an alternative placement is the best environment for the student and there needs to be documentation to help make that argument.

+1 on the scam of using unofficial suspensions to keep it off the books. Any parent who is asked to pick up a child early or to keep that at home should be asking for paperwork - documentation of the incident an a form indicating reason for suspension, lesser alternative solutions tried and failed, term of suspension and rights of appeal.

Schools do this unofficial suspension crap also all the time to kids with IEPs and 504s to cover up failure to provide FAPE.

What schools are doing this unofficial thing? That really bothers me. They should fix the underlying reason principals feel they need to fly under the radar, but in the meantime scamming isn’t the answer—it just obscures the problem and makes it difficult for troubled kids to get appropriate help or an IEP or whatever they need because they haven’t accrued evidence.

Our school does this. It is very well known. Parents and teachers have been incredibly frustrated and some parents have gone to the Cluster Super. But I’m guessing ALL the admin are in the same situation and under the same pressures.

Agree that it obscures the problem. And IMO, it’s confusing to the kids who need solid limits. Especially in ES.

Our school kept my child in the office all day one day and took away several days of lunch and recess for something really minor. It was bizarre as all the kids were doing it. I had no idea they were holding him hostage all day in the office or I would have gone to the school and taken him. I believe in holding kids accountable but he copied another child, they knew it, scape coated him and then when the other kids kept doing it, he kept getting blamed when he didn't continue to do it. All the kids act similar at our school, except some with high SN and that's a different situation. However, they are much more severe on the white kids than other races and hold some kids, like mine to a different standard (including telling us how he should dress and wear his hair - neat, clean nothing remarkable). Schools are very inconsistent with how they handle things. It sounds like he should have also had protection under his IEP and clearly did not. So those wanting to make it a race issue, you'll be happy to know my white kid is bullied by other kids and nothing is done and he is severely punished for something minor he didn't even fully understand.

I truly wish this county had more affordable privates beyond the catholic schools.

Think Catholic schools are too much discipline for your DS? Or is it anti-Catholic bias keeping you in MCPS?

My child did something minor and it was a one time incident which was copying other kids. He's been at highly structured schools and had no problems. They choose to make an example out of him, which didn't work as the class behavior only got worse according to my child. I don't know what was fully going on as the teacher refused to talk to me about it.

The Catholic piece is what keeps us away. I looked at several schools and there were very few non-Christians and teachers at all schools referred to the kids as Catholic or non-Catholic with a clear distinction. At two schools on their social media, they encouraged the kids to go to pro-life marches and they heavily pushed religion. Kids were forced to say Catholic prayers multiple times a day. If they were more accepting of other religions and tolerant, I'd move my child in a heartbeat.

This isn’t true if all Catholic schools. Most parochial ones have huge percentages of non-Catholic and even non-Christian students.

Which ones would you recommend? I assumed that which is why I looked but the numbers were very few. I am more concerned about non-Christian and how they handle that. There is a big difference between non-Catholic and non-Christian in terms of beliefs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm an MCPS teacher who strongly believes in public education, but I send my kids to Catholic school. I live in the neighborhood where I teach and the parents here are out of control. They refuse to hold their kids accountable, let them fail, or accept consequences. The entitlement of some of these kids is outrageous. The Catholic school my kids attend has a strong discipline system and the parents support it.

This was true of us as well. The students at my W feeder were so out of control that I laughed when my principal suggested I COSA my child there. It was hard managing private ES on two MCPS salaries, but we made it to the age DC could latchkey. Discipline is less of a problem at my child’s DCC MS than the school where I teach. Looking to transfer away from parents with their heads in the sand and a lawyer on speed dial.

two-teacher (MCPS) HH

We're moving out of county. I simply cannot stand the excuses made for poor behavior, and I say this for ALL kids - regardless of race and SES status. The parents with money use their lawyers to threaten the schools. So even if the schools try to hold kids to certain standards of behavior and academic performance, parents intervene. Minorities are also held to different standards, which is - in itself - racist. Pushing a kid along - one who can't read on level - and blaming the teachers for issues beyond our control are two reasons that have soured me.

And guess what? I blame us! Until we start rocking the boat and taking our professions back, we will always be pawns. sad, but true

If you think MCPS is worth saving, then inundate the BOE with letters.

One email address - [e-mail] - goes out to all.

I'm assuming you have perfect kids. Lucky you. You do realize that as a teacher, YOU failed a child if they cannot read. That child should have been assessed and given significant interventions by 1st grade and parents shouldn't have to fight for basic supports. We've spent a fortune on private interventions to keep our child at grade level because MCPS services and help are a joke. Teachers are to blame. They need to help advocate for kids and not let them fall through the cracks. Our teacher clearly identified one area of need. We held an IEP mention where we and the teacher agreed and they refused to give my child the basic support they needed. So, instead, they failed him on that subject area in the report card we got a few days later and they never ever mentioned that he was going to fail in that IEP meeting (this a a two day difference).

Let’s start with ending social promotion. Can’t read by third grade, you repeat third grade. That way, middle schoolers aren’t acting up to disguise they can’t do the work. Teachers won’t be blamed for deficiencies that happened five years earlier in another school. And parents will have an accurate view of their child’s abilities.

If a child cannot read by the 3rd grade, the school and parents both failed them. MCPS waits till kids are much older to test for things like dyslexia and even then they don't provide targeted services. Many parents cannot afford private services and testing. You can blame the kids but reality is that someone failed them if they are not reading by the 3rd grade, even if it is just recognizing what the issue is. I know several good kids where this has happened and its sad as parents waited too long to get them private help and the schools failed to recognize the issue. It has nothing to do with social promotion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If the kid is so disrespectful to staff and peers that the teacher can't even teach, then that is grounds for removal from the classroom. If this happens in multiple classrooms, then it can clearly reach the level for suspension/ parents required to pick up the student that day. MCPS is not a daycare service.

NP +1

Excluding a child from school is a last resort and if your kid behaves very badly in class (and yes, "talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff" does fall into that category) then it's YOUR job to do something about it. Teachers are there to teach, not to raise your child and change him from a wild animal into a student who is willing to learn and allow others to learn.

If sending your kid home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior, then you need to change the way you think about suspensions. Maybe get your kid working in a soup kitchen for those days (and nights) that he's suspended. Or supervise him picking up all the trash and dog crap in every local park. Whatever you need to do to make suspensions unpleasant enough for your child that he doesn't mouth off to the teacher all day and stop the other kids from being able to learn.

Of course, that would actually involve some parenting. But it can be done.

And if your kid really is so unable to control himself and cannot possibly resist mouthing off all day no matter how you punish him (and that's assuming absolutely no tech, no privileges, etc, in addition to the chores above) then you need to accept that he's not a normal kid and he needs a special placement. You can't just keep sending him back into regular school and expecting everyone else to put up with your disruptive and totally disrespectful kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If your child is white or Asian, he is out of luck. MCPS trys to reduce the suspension rate for blacks and hispanics now. They can neither keep the troubled bl and hispanic students in the classroom or suspend more white or Asian students so the rate of bl and hispanic students being disciplined will go lower. You need either find a lawyer to navigate the system or find a private school for your ds.

Or maybe her kid can start behaving himself.
Black and Hispanic kids get suspended from our school, so stop the trolling.

She’s not trolling. I work for MCPS, and the county is carefully tracking these numbers.

Yes, that is why sometimes my principal unofficially suspends kids. Basically when it goes too far to be ignored but they don’t want the data to show they suspended an AA or HI male. I am in a position at my school where I am able to see suspension data and the kids who most deserve it (most egregious behavior over multiple instances) aren’t on there as having received suspensions. I know my principal unofficially suspends them but doesn’t want the data to reflect that because then they’d have to hear it from their boss and Central Office. This shouldn’t be allowed at all but it happens. If a kid’s behavior is egregious enough for a suspension then it should be properly documented for the student’s sake as well. Sometimes an alternative placement is the best environment for the student and there needs to be documentation to help make that argument.

+1 on the scam of using unofficial suspensions to keep it off the books. Any parent who is asked to pick up a child early or to keep that at home should be asking for paperwork - documentation of the incident an a form indicating reason for suspension, lesser alternative solutions tried and failed, term of suspension and rights of appeal.

Schools do this unofficial suspension crap also all the time to kids with IEPs and 504s to cover up failure to provide FAPE.

What schools are doing this unofficial thing? That really bothers me. They should fix the underlying reason principals feel they need to fly under the radar, but in the meantime scamming isn’t the answer—it just obscures the problem and makes it difficult for troubled kids to get appropriate help or an IEP or whatever they need because they haven’t accrued evidence.

Our school does this. It is very well known. Parents and teachers have been incredibly frustrated and some parents have gone to the Cluster Super. But I’m guessing ALL the admin are in the same situation and under the same pressures.

Agree that it obscures the problem. And IMO, it’s confusing to the kids who need solid limits. Especially in ES.

Our school kept my child in the office all day one day and took away several days of lunch and recess for something really minor. It was bizarre as all the kids were doing it. I had no idea they were holding him hostage all day in the office or I would have gone to the school and taken him. I believe in holding kids accountable but he copied another child, they knew it, scape coated him and then when the other kids kept doing it, he kept getting blamed when he didn't continue to do it. All the kids act similar at our school, except some with high SN and that's a different situation. However, they are much more severe on the white kids than other races and hold some kids, like mine to a different standard (including telling us how he should dress and wear his hair - neat, clean nothing remarkable). Schools are very inconsistent with how they handle things. It sounds like he should have also had protection under his IEP and clearly did not. So those wanting to make it a race issue, you'll be happy to know my white kid is bullied by other kids and nothing is done and he is severely punished for something minor he didn't even fully understand.

I truly wish this county had more affordable privates beyond the catholic schools.

Think Catholic schools are too much discipline for your DS? Or is it anti-Catholic bias keeping you in MCPS?

My child did something minor and it was a one time incident which was copying other kids. He's been at highly structured schools and had no problems. They choose to make an example out of him, which didn't work as the class behavior only got worse according to my child. I don't know what was fully going on as the teacher refused to talk to me about it.

The Catholic piece is what keeps us away. I looked at several schools and there were very few non-Christians and teachers at all schools referred to the kids as Catholic or non-Catholic with a clear distinction. At two schools on their social media, they encouraged the kids to go to pro-life marches and they heavily pushed religion. Kids were forced to say Catholic prayers multiple times a day. If they were more accepting of other religions and tolerant, I'd move my child in a heartbeat.

This isn’t true if all Catholic schools. Most parochial ones have huge percentages of non-Catholic and even non-Christian students.

Which ones would you recommend? I assumed that which is why I looked but the numbers were very few. I am more concerned about non-Christian and how they handle that. There is a big difference between non-Catholic and non-Christian in terms of beliefs.

Catholic school mom here. I would recommend that you not pursue a Catholic school education based on your concerns. The Catholic schools are very accepting of other religions. However, they will be teaching your child the Hail Mary and Our Father, have religion class every day, attend mass at least 1X per week, and yes, encourage them to go to pro-life marches. This is what the Catholic church preaches, and what Catholic schools instill. Some may be more conservative than others, but I can guarantee that just about every one has a bus taking eighth graders to DC for the pro-life march every January. Expect to also see this happening in Catholic high schools as well. Of course attending is not mandatory, but the discussion will be happening in the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Let’s start with ending social promotion. Can’t read by third grade, you repeat third grade. That way, middle schoolers aren’t acting up to disguise they can’t do the work. Teachers won’t be blamed for deficiencies that happened five years earlier in another school. And parents will have an accurate view of their child’s abilities.

I’m not sure why you think there is social promotion in MCPS. The move towards transparency ended that. You either earn the passing grade or you don’t pass the class. There is a formula that is preset for determining whether you pass. Thing is that failing a class or two isn’t going to hold you back a grade. It just means that you take it in summer school or take it again another year.

Also, while I agree that not reading by third grade is a problem, holding a kid back if they are passing everything else is a ridiculous concept.

[Anonymous]

FYI - there is no such thing as failing an elementary grade. The lowest score a teacher can enter in their grade book is a "N" for grades K to 1 or a D for grades 2 - 5. We have a student who has refused to do work for the last marking period. He literally cannot fail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FYI - there is no such thing as failing an elementary grade. The lowest score a teacher can enter in their grade book is a "N" for grades K to 1 or a D for grades 2 - 5. We have a student who has refused to do work for the last marking period. He literally cannot fail.

So what are you doing for that child? Has that child been screened for mental illness? Has anyone looked into what may be happening at home? Kids that age just don’t refuse to do all of their school work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FYI - there is no such thing as failing an elementary grade. The lowest score a teacher can enter in their grade book is a "N" for grades K to 1 or a D for grades 2 - 5. We have a student who has refused to do work for the last marking period. He literally cannot fail.

So what are you doing for that child? Has that child been screened for mental illness? Has anyone looked into what may be happening at home? Kids that age just don’t refuse to do all of their school work.

They don't? Jeez I never realized that. Thank God you let me know. There have been daily phone calls home, daily visits with the counselor, a home visit with the PPW and counselor and referrals for outside therapy. Parents seem disinterested in taking action and despite our very frank conversations, seem to think this is just a phase. The student has two older siblings in HS who apparently pull the same stuff and are out at all hours doing God knows what. It's a sad situation.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I have read the MCPS code of conduct and discipline policy and it seems to be saying that out of school suspensions should not be used unless efforts to keep the kid in school really are not working. The document talks about things like restorative opportunities, opportunities for apologizing, peer justice, etc. These all sound like great things but our middle school keeps suspending my kid for nonviolent offenses such as talking back with inappropriate language and disobeying requests from staff. They’ve never given them a behavioral plan, they’ve tried to work with him but today I had to ask if he could even talk to a counselor before he was booted out the door on his suspension. They don’t seem to offer anything but out the door you go. Come pick him up. Has anyone found that MCPS handles suspensions a little more lightly than I am experiencing? Have you ever complained or fought the suspension and how do you do that in MCPS? In my opinion suspension is just stupid unless the kid is a physical threat to someone at school. Sending him home for a few days does nothing to help him change his behavior and I thought MCPS was getting that point.

If your child is white or Asian, he is out of luck. MCPS trys to reduce the suspension rate for blacks and hispanics now. They can neither keep the troubled bl and hispanic students in the classroom or suspend more white or Asian students so the rate of bl and hispanic students being disciplined will go lower. You need either find a lawyer to navigate the system or find a private school for your ds.

Or maybe her kid can start behaving himself.
Black and Hispanic kids get suspended from our school, so stop the trolling.

She’s not trolling. I work for MCPS, and the county is carefully tracking these numbers.

Yes, that is why sometimes my principal unofficially suspends kids. Basically when it goes too far to be ignored but they don’t want the data to show they suspended an AA or HI male. I am in a position at my school where I am able to see suspension data and the kids who most deserve it (most egregious behavior over multiple instances) aren’t on there as having received suspensions. I know my principal unofficially suspends them but doesn’t want the data to reflect that because then they’d have to hear it from their boss and Central Office. This shouldn’t be allowed at all but it happens. If a kid’s behavior is egregious enough for a suspension then it should be properly documented for the student’s sake as well. Sometimes an alternative placement is the best environment for the student and there needs to be documentation to help make that argument.

+1 on the scam of using unofficial suspensions to keep it off the books. Any parent who is asked to pick up a child early or to keep that at home should be asking for paperwork - documentation of the incident an a form indicating reason for suspension, lesser alternative solutions tried and failed, term of suspension and rights of appeal.

Schools do this unofficial suspension crap also all the time to kids with IEPs and 504s to cover up failure to provide FAPE.

What schools are doing this unofficial thing? That really bothers me. They should fix the underlying reason principals feel they need to fly under the radar, but in the meantime scamming isn’t the answer—it just obscures the problem and makes it difficult for troubled kids to get appropriate help or an IEP or whatever they need because they haven’t accrued evidence.

Our school does this. It is very well known. Parents and teachers have been incredibly frustrated and some parents have gone to the Cluster Super. But I’m guessing ALL the admin are in the same situation and under the same pressures.

Agree that it obscures the problem. And IMO, it’s confusing to the kids who need solid limits. Especially in ES.

Our school kept my child in the office all day one day and took away several days of lunch and recess for something really minor. It was bizarre as all the kids were doing it. I had no idea they were holding him hostage all day in the office or I would have gone to the school and taken him. I believe in holding kids accountable but he copied another child, they knew it, scape coated him and then when the other kids kept doing it, he kept getting blamed when he didn't continue to do it. All the kids act similar at our school, except some with high SN and that's a different situation. However, they are much more severe on the white kids than other races and hold some kids, like mine to a different standard (including telling us how he should dress and wear his hair - neat, clean nothing remarkable). Schools are very inconsistent with how they handle things. It sounds like he should have also had protection under his IEP and clearly did not. So those wanting to make it a race issue, you'll be happy to know my white kid is bullied by other kids and nothing is done and he is severely punished for something minor he didn't even fully understand.

I truly wish this county had more affordable privates beyond the catholic schools.

Think Catholic schools are too much discipline for your DS? Or is it anti-Catholic bias keeping you in MCPS?

My child did something minor and it was a one time incident which was copying other kids. He's been at highly structured schools and had no problems. They choose to make an example out of him, which didn't work as the class behavior only got worse according to my child. I don't know what was fully going on as the teacher refused to talk to me about it.

The Catholic piece is what keeps us away. I looked at several schools and there were very few non-Christians and teachers at all schools referred to the kids as Catholic or non-Catholic with a clear distinction. At two schools on their social media, they encouraged the kids to go to pro-life marches and they heavily pushed religion. Kids were forced to say Catholic prayers multiple times a day. If they were more accepting of other religions and tolerant, I'd move my child in a heartbeat.

This isn’t true if all Catholic schools. Most parochial ones have huge percentages of non-Catholic and even non-Christian students.

Which ones would you recommend? I assumed that which is why I looked but the numbers were very few. I am more concerned about non-Christian and how they handle that. There is a big difference between non-Catholic and non-Christian in terms of beliefs.

A friend is Muslim and her son is at St. John the Evangelist in Silver Spring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Let’s start with ending social promotion. Can’t read by third grade, you repeat third grade. That way, middle schoolers aren’t acting up to disguise they can’t do the work. Teachers won’t be blamed for deficiencies that happened five years earlier in another school. And parents will have an accurate view of their child’s abilities.

I’m not sure why you think there is social promotion in MCPS. The move towards transparency ended that. You either earn the passing grade or you don’t pass the class. There is a formula that is preset for determining whether you pass. Thing is that failing a class or two isn’t going to hold you back a grade. It just means that you take it in summer school or take it again another year.

Also, while I agree that not reading by third grade is a problem, holding a kid back if they are passing everything else is a ridiculous concept.

I see students fail every class in 6th. The parents refuse summer school and the child goes to 7th. It repeats two more times and the child goes to HS. That’s social promotion. No accountability until 9th grade.