Positive Discipline isn't working...

[Anonymous]

And to the pathetic PP above who puts hot sauce on her child's tongue for bad language, you can be arrested for that. Where do you live, Vile PP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

Again, you are vile. Further, you are stunningly under-educated.

Really? Interesting, considering that I have a master's degree and am nearly finished with my PhD save for completing the dissertation. In what way would you suggest that I should further my education such that I will suddenly come to the conclusion that raising children with strict discipline is anything other than a benefit both for them and for everyone with whom they must interact?

I have to agree with the others - you truly are vile. Stop trying to defend the indefensible and go away. Your children will turn on you soon enough and rightfully so.

PS. Those of use with doctorate degrees never say PhD. For the next time you lie about your degree, write "nearly finished my doctorate". It will be a more believable lie. And the doctorate is the dissertation so you may want to come up with a better lid on that one, too.

Except for the several classes included in my PhD program, but alright anonymous internet stranger...

Anyway, this thread has had far more than my $0.02 and opinions on such issues rarely change. You're quite right that time will tell which parenting techniques turn out well for children. Best wishes to you and yours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

I don't know of a single adult whose parents put hot sauce in their mouths as punishment growing up! Where the hell did you grow up that you think this was the norm a generation ago?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Positive discipline is snake oil in my opinion. It makes you think you are overcoming something when really the outcome remains unchanged. We physically remove our 2.5 year old from the situation whether It be a restaurant, play date or outing. Take them outside on the sidewalk, get on their level, hold their chin so they are looking you directly in the eyes and have a very stern conversation. This conversation doesn’t end until the child repeats back what the poor behavior was, agreed to stop, apologizes, and walks in holding your hand. This has worked for about a year now.

Amen.

Also, repeated defiance will earn a spanking in our house.

Agree with the bolded.

One of my kids got the occasional swat on the butt, the other didn't.

Misbehavior, though was met with a firm "no" or "stop" with the "I mean business" face.

So "no! Give it back." If he didn't, I took it from him and gave it back. If he continued, we left.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

My cousin did that with his kids. He's under 50.

I don't know of a single adult whose parents put hot sauce in their mouths as punishment growing up! Where the hell did you grow up that you think this was the norm a generation ago?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

I don't know of a single adult whose parents put hot sauce in their mouths as punishment growing up! Where the hell did you grow up that you think this was the norm a generation ago?

I need to learn to quote.

Anyway, my under 50 cousin did that with his kid.

I think I wiped soap on ds's mouth once for spitting at me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD is two (27 months) and very, very active and spirited. When we go to a play date or this one play group, I have noticed that she is the only child who doesn't seem to understand no or taking turns. If another child has something she wants she takes it and will not give it back. She will knock/pull another kid off a riding toy if she wants it. None of the other kids - all her exact age practically - do this. To get her to give something back or let someone else have their turn, I actually have to physically restrain her.

What do I do? I tell her I understand it is hard for her to share or take turns and I try not to say no - but she is stubborn and simply wants what she wants.

What do I do now? TIA

Oy. DCUM’s favorite adjective for an out of control child. “Spirited”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is two (27 months) and very, very active and spirited. When we go to a play date or this one play group, I have noticed that she is the only child who doesn't seem to understand no or taking turns. If another child has something she wants she takes it and will not give it back. She will knock/pull another kid off a riding toy if she wants it. None of the other kids - all her exact age practically - do this. To get her to give something back or let someone else have their turn, I actually have to physically restrain her.

What do I do? I tell her I understand it is hard for her to share or take turns and I try not to say no - but she is stubborn and simply wants what she wants.

What do I do now? TIA

Oy. DCUM’s favorite adjective for an out of control child. “Spirited”

I find it interesting that the phrase is often coupled with the approaches of positive disciple, avoiding saying no, etc.

Not always, but I've noticed it.

[Anonymous]

I found the OP's "try not to say no" attitude annoying myself and even had some sympathy for the spanking poster..right up until she mentioned putting hot sauce on the child's tongue. One day, that child will have the courage to open up about it at school. The natural consequences for HotSauceMom won't be pretty.

She knows this, hence her abrupt exit from the thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

Again, you are vile. Further, you are stunningly under-educated.

Really? Interesting, considering that I have a master's degree and am nearly finished with my PhD save for completing the dissertation. In what way would you suggest that I should further my education such that I will suddenly come to the conclusion that raising children with strict discipline is anything other than a benefit both for them and for everyone with whom they must interact?

I have to agree with the others - you truly are vile. Stop trying to defend the indefensible and go away. Your children will turn on you soon enough and rightfully so.

PS. Those of use with doctorate degrees never say PhD. For the next time you lie about your degree, write "nearly finished my doctorate". It will be a more believable lie. And the doctorate is the dissertation so you may want to come up with a better lid on that one, too.

PP, I agree with you in terms of the spanking and physical punishment issue. However, you have posted the ignorant statement elsewhere that no one with a Ph.D calls it that. Sorry, you’re just wrong. The only people I know who call their degrees doctorates are pretentious assholes who got their degrees from Phoenix Online University.

Ivy Ph.D.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

I don't know of a single adult whose parents put hot sauce in their mouths as punishment growing up! Where the hell did you grow up that you think this was the norm a generation ago?

My uncle used hot sauce. My mom used soap.

I know of someone in my generation who used hot sauce on his kids. A lot just wouldn't admit it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD is two (27 months) and very, very active and spirited. When we go to a play date or this one play group, I have noticed that she is the only child who doesn't seem to understand no or taking turns. If another child has something she wants she takes it and will not give it back. She will knock/pull another kid off a riding toy if she wants it. None of the other kids - all her exact age practically - do this. To get her to give something back or let someone else have their turn, I actually have to physically restrain her.

What do I do? I tell her I understand it is hard for her to share or take turns and I try not to say no - but she is stubborn and simply wants what she wants.

What do I do now? TIA

Practice saying "no"... if you love your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are some real softie parents on this thread, smh. Misbehavior and bad choices should hurt; in the absence of a reason to avoid bad behavior, much of which is more enjoyable to kids in the short term, there is little reason for kids to behave. We spank until at least age 8 (depending on the child) and for rude language or sassy mouths we do either soap or hot sauce. In general these consequences are rare because our children's behavior is usually reasonable. I would think that any consequences for misbehavior should be more unpleasant for the child than for the parent.

You are vile.

I'd venture a guess that it's how a majority of current adults were raised, and their parents before that, and etc. Things that are effective -- are effective. There's been quite the shift lately towards permissive parenting and parents no longer being clearly in charge of the home. Is it working out in an overall positive way?

I would say not. Today's kids could benefit from a dose of old-fashioned discipline.

I don't know of a single adult whose parents put hot sauce in their mouths as punishment growing up! Where the hell did you grow up that you think this was the norm a generation ago?

My uncle used hot sauce. My mom used soap.

I know of someone in my generation who used hot sauce on his kids. A lot just wouldn't admit it.

Yes, hot sauce mom, it's not surprising that your parents and their siblings used abusive disciplinary tactics also. No doubt you understand the consequences if you ever get caught. I'm sure you've let your children know just much pain they're in for if they ever tell anyone. That always works, right?

[Anonymous]

Saying no is sometimes a very good thing.

[Anonymous]

"it is hard for her to share or take turns and I try not to say no - but she is stubborn and simply wants what she wants"

I know it's hard for you, but you should try to share - is a complex and nuanced message for a 2 yo to understand and react to. You're trying to couch your requests with empathy but all your kid is picking up on is her mother's love & sympathy; none of the "please share" message is getting through.

Try clearer communication:
"Susie, that's not yours. Give it back."
"Susie, you can't knock other kids down. Come for a time out."
"Susie, that's not okay. We're leaving."

You have to be clear. A nuanced, empathetic message will be more effective when she's older. In the meantime keep it simple: positive communication 95% of the time + crystal clear negative feedback with consequences for bad behavior.