Failed SOL notifications already?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

Yes it does mean your child gets remediation. The school is required to provide it for every child who fails.

The required minimum is one hour.

I am expecting that my 6th grader will fail his Math 7 SOL. Fairly or unfairly, I blame his teacher. (My mom is a teacher, so I don't say those words lightly. And she agrees with me.) I have two questions.

(1) In light of the fact that I blame his teacher (and by extension the school -- meaning I care NOT AT ALL if his teacher or the school looks bad), should I allow him to retake the test if a retake is offered? He has no anxiety issues, but he may be embarrassed if his friends find out he failed the SOL.

(2) What kind of remediation will he receive, given that he was already in an advanced class? We're in APS, if it matters.

Students are only permitted by the state to re-take if they score between 375-399. I imagine you will be contacted quickly if he is in this group. If you are not contacted then either he passed or he did not pass but his score was too low to be allowed to re-take.

If he fails, don't delude yourself: his friends probably will find out anyway. Either because he tells them or because of his math class assignment next year or because of how his school might set up the remediation program for the students who are not re-takers. At one kid's school last year, all the passers were in one classroom doing projects and all the failers were in another classroom doing math practice sheets while the smaller group of re-take students were working pretty much one-on-one with a teacher and para.

If he is in the re-take group and if you agree to re-take, the method of remediation will vary. The teachers get pretty detailed reports about each student who is eligible to re-take and most teachers will use that to focus the remediation on those areas. Now is the time to ask these questions. Not later.

I have a feeling you are going to blow off this recommendation but my suggestion is that if you have concerns about the teacher then you should surface those to the Principal asap. In fact, you should have done it a long time ago. I know you say it is the teacher's fault but remember the saying...when you point one finger at someone else look at your hand and you will see that you are pointing three fingers right back at yourself... What were you doing if you thought that his teacher was so bad? That's on you.

Good luck to your son.

Thank you for your thoughtful response. So he will only get remediation if we agree to a retake? And the remediation will be in the hands of his classroom teacher? Regarding contacting admin, it's been done by me and others. Hence, the reason I blame the teacher and, by extension, the school. (And the reason my teacher-mom agrees with me.)

From what I've seen, only the re-take children get close to one-on-one remediation. The kids whose scores are less than 375, so not eligible for re-takes, usually are in a class with subs and they do math work but there are a lot of kids in those classrooms to compensate for the teachers pulled to remediate with re-takers so it is definitely worksheet based. It may not be the case at your child's school but I've seen a couple of schools (we are emergency-care foster parents so our foster children stay in their school not our zoned geographic school) and it seems to look a lot alike at all the schools.

Thanks for clarifying about the principal. It is so important to be in contact to let them know what you are seeing. The teacher is the first contact and resource, and most of the ones I see are just great, but every once in a while you find a dud and then you really do need to let someone know what you're seeing or not seeing.

I hope this helps. You really do need to talk to your school and find out what they will be doing. Like I said, every school is different and it just may be that the schools I am seeing are alike but others are different... Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

Yes it does mean your child gets remediation. The school is required to provide it for every child who fails.

The required minimum is one hour.

I am expecting that my 6th grader will fail his Math 7 SOL. Fairly or unfairly, I blame his teacher. (My mom is a teacher, so I don't say those words lightly. And she agrees with me.) I have two questions.

(1) In light of the fact that I blame his teacher (and by extension the school -- meaning I care NOT AT ALL if his teacher or the school looks bad), should I allow him to retake the test if a retake is offered? He has no anxiety issues, but he may be embarrassed if his friends find out he failed the SOL.

(2) What kind of remediation will he receive, given that he was already in an advanced class? We're in APS, if it matters.

Students are only permitted by the state to re-take if they score between 375-399. I imagine you will be contacted quickly if he is in this group. If you are not contacted then either he passed or he did not pass but his score was too low to be allowed to re-take.

If he fails, don't delude yourself: his friends probably will find out anyway. Either because he tells them or because of his math class assignment next year or because of how his school might set up the remediation program for the students who are not re-takers. At one kid's school last year, all the passers were in one classroom doing projects and all the failers were in another classroom doing math practice sheets while the smaller group of re-take students were working pretty much one-on-one with a teacher and para.

If he is in the re-take group and if you agree to re-take, the method of remediation will vary. The teachers get pretty detailed reports about each student who is eligible to re-take and most teachers will use that to focus the remediation on those areas. Now is the time to ask these questions. Not later.

I have a feeling you are going to blow off this recommendation but my suggestion is that if you have concerns about the teacher then you should surface those to the Principal asap. In fact, you should have done it a long time ago. I know you say it is the teacher's fault but remember the saying...when you point one finger at someone else look at your hand and you will see that you are pointing three fingers right back at yourself... What were you doing if you thought that his teacher was so bad? That's on you.

Good luck to your son.

Thank you for your thoughtful response. So he will only get remediation if we agree to a retake? And the remediation will be in the hands of his classroom teacher? Regarding contacting admin, it's been done by me and others. Hence, the reason I blame the teacher and, by extension, the school. (And the reason my teacher-mom agrees with me.)

From what I've seen, only the re-take children get close to one-on-one remediation. The kids whose scores are less than 375, so not eligible for re-takes, usually are in a class with subs and they do math work but there are a lot of kids in those classrooms to compensate for the teachers pulled to remediate with re-takers so it is definitely worksheet based. It may not be the case at your child's school but I've seen a couple of schools (we are emergency-care foster parents so our foster children stay in their school not our zoned geographic school) and it seems to look a lot alike at all the schools.

Thanks for clarifying about the principal. It is so important to be in contact to let them know what you are seeing. The teacher is the first contact and resource, and most of the ones I see are just great, but every once in a while you find a dud and then you really do need to let someone know what you're seeing or not seeing.

I hope this helps. You really do need to talk to your school and find out what they will be doing. Like I said, every school is different and it just may be that the schools I am seeing are alike but others are different... Good luck!

At my school the classroom teacher just does the remediation during regular class time like we would with any other small math or reading group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would totally opt my kid out if it meant what they were taught in the classroom wasn't so test focused. But my kid would still have to do the drilling and the curriculum, so I just let him take them. It sucks.

You can Opt Out of mid-year bench mark testing and EOY testing. In addition, you can communicate with your kid's teacher and ask that he/she not be given any multiple choice practice sheets, since you are Opting Out.

And - by Opt Out - you are sending a message to Richmond that you want TEACHING not TESTING!

As a former teacher and a parent I am pro testing, but I think the test-makers need more input from teachers. Not a fan of the current tests. However, without some accountability you could get stuck with the teacher who BSes the whole year. Even if they give tests throughout the year, the SOLs provide some important data. Early on it lets the school know of which kids need some extra help and presuming a teacher did not have many kids with LDs, etc it can help indicate a teacher may need more strategies. You'd be surprised. That kid everyone labels as a goof off could get a high pass indicating she/he was learning the material. Meanwhile the child quietly struggles with learning issues who tries to compensate, may be identified as needing the extra help she/he was too afraid to ask for. Keep in mind the scores don't affect the child in terms of making a child repeat a grade or class until highschool. They are getting practice with test taking. If a child repeatedly fails say a math SOL, then there is nothing wrong with putting that child in a math group where the teacher has more repitition and makes sure to use a multi-sensory approach (which supposedly they all do).

As long as the student takes the test seriously and does his/her best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

You need to chill and read again.

The complaint was that the teacher started remediating before permission for the retake was given. I said a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission to remediate. That happens all year long and can occur even if a parent does not give permission for the retake.

The teacher's behavior is a separate issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

You need to chill and read again.

The complaint was that the teacher started remediating before permission for the retake was given. I said a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission to remediate. That happens all year long and can occur even if a parent does not give permission for the retake.

The teacher's behavior is a separate issue.

No, the complaint was that the teacher told my third grader that he failed the sol. Then you came in with your comment. You strike me as someone who likes to cause trouble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

You need to chill and read again.

The complaint was that the teacher started remediating before permission for the retake was given. I said a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission to remediate. That happens all year long and can occur even if a parent does not give permission for the retake.

The teacher's behavior is a separate issue.

No, the complaint was that the teacher told my third grader that he failed the sol. Then you came in with your comment. You strike me as someone who likes to cause trouble.

Here is the exact post: A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission. She also insulted my child and the children she was working with during this remediation and put tons of pressure on them.

I replied and said a teacher does not need a parent's permission to remediate, which is true and is a direct response to the part of the complaint I bolded above. That's not trying to cause trouble. I'm just pointing out that permission isn't needed to do that.

The response then came which said that I had stated a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission for a retake, which was not what I wrote.

[Anonymous]

New poster here. The teacher also doesn't need your permission to tell the child that they failed an SOL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

You need to chill and read again.

The complaint was that the teacher started remediating before permission for the retake was given. I said a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission to remediate. That happens all year long and can occur even if a parent does not give permission for the retake.

The teacher's behavior is a separate issue.

No, the complaint was that the teacher told my third grader that he failed the sol. Then you came in with your comment. You strike me as someone who likes to cause trouble.

Here is the exact post: A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission. She also insulted my child and the children she was working with during this remediation and put tons of pressure on them.

I replied and said a teacher does not need a parent's permission to remediate, which is true and is a direct response to the part of the complaint I bolded above. That's not trying to cause trouble. I'm just pointing out that permission isn't needed to do that.

The response then came which said that I had stated a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission for a retake, which was not what I wrote.

Read harder. My response was to a post about elementary students not needing to know if they passed or failed the sol. I agreed with that post and decided to respond about the time a teacher informed my third grader that he failed the first sol he ever took. You know very well I'm sure, that there wouldn't have been any remediation unless it was in preparation for an sol retake. And in elementary school they do need parents permission to have children retake an sol. What you did is read one part of my post and assume what my "complaint" was about. My original post wasn't a complaint as much as it was a response to the pp about elementary students not needing to know their sol scores. I'm pretty sure you're just arguing with me because you need to feel like you are right and I am wrong, so whatever. That's why I think you're the type of poster that likes to make trouble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. The teacher also doesn't need your permission to tell the child that they failed an SOL.

Sure. When I called the school after it happened it seems that they disagree with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

They don't need my permission to have my child retake an sol? That's news to me! Pp, are you ok with teachers telling your child (in third grade!) that they failed an sol? Are you ok with your child being pulled out of class and stuck in a group so that an overly stressed teacher can "remediate" them and lose her temper out of frustration because the kids aren't experienced test takers yet and aren't doing it the right way? I'm not. My child has an iep bc he has some special needs, but he comes close enough to passing each time that they ask permission for a retake. So, yeah, I'd say the standard is that they ask for parent permission before retakes in elementary school. And a teacher telling a third grader they failed is WRONG. Way to motivate them

You need to chill and read again.

The complaint was that the teacher started remediating before permission for the retake was given. I said a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission to remediate. That happens all year long and can occur even if a parent does not give permission for the retake.

The teacher's behavior is a separate issue.

No, the complaint was that the teacher told my third grader that he failed the sol. Then you came in with your comment. You strike me as someone who likes to cause trouble.

Here is the exact post: A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission. She also insulted my child and the children she was working with during this remediation and put tons of pressure on them.

I replied and said a teacher does not need a parent's permission to remediate, which is true and is a direct response to the part of the complaint I bolded above. That's not trying to cause trouble. I'm just pointing out that permission isn't needed to do that.

The response then came which said that I had stated a teacher doesn't need a parent's permission for a retake, which was not what I wrote.

Read harder. My response was to a post about elementary students not needing to know if they passed or failed the sol. I agreed with that post and decided to respond about the time a teacher informed my third grader that he failed the first sol he ever took. You know very well I'm sure, that there wouldn't have been any remediation unless it was in preparation for an sol retake. And in elementary school they do need parents permission to have children retake an sol. What you did is read one part of my post and assume what my "complaint" was about. My original post wasn't a complaint as much as it was a response to the pp about elementary students not needing to know their sol scores. I'm pretty sure you're just arguing with me because you need to feel like you are right and I am wrong, so whatever. That's why I think you're the type of poster that likes to make trouble.

Nobody ever said the teacher or the school doesn't need your permission to retake an SOL test. You said I did, but I didn't.

There is no argument. I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm not arguing. I read your entire post. There are no assumptions. You wrote "and the teacher started remediation for a retake without our permission". I simply stated the teacher doesn't need your permission to remediate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:New poster here. The teacher also doesn't need your permission to tell the child that they failed an SOL.

Sure. When I called the school after it happened it seems that they disagree with you.

Different poster here.

Students are pulled into small groups for remediation all the time. We have remediation/enrichment blocks for this. Some students might meet for a short amount of time, others a little longer. The groups change quite often too. During the block of time we have students go between classrooms and we "tackle" groups that way. During language arts or math I pull small groups for reteaching (aka remediation). We do the same thing prior to an SOL retake. The students don't "stand out' because students do this frequently. Nobody needs to give permission.

[Anonymous]

Read harder. My response was to a post about elementary students not needing to know if they passed or failed the sol. I agreed with that post and decided to respond about the time a teacher informed my third grader that he failed the first sol he ever took. You know very well I'm sure, that there wouldn't have been any remediation unless it was in preparation for an sol retake. And in elementary school they do need parents permission to have children retake an sol. What you did is read one part of my post and assume what my "complaint" was about. My original post wasn't a complaint as much as it was a response to the pp about elementary students not needing to know their sol scores. I'm pretty sure you're just arguing with me because you need to feel like you are right and I am wrong, so whatever. That's why I think you're the type of poster that likes to make trouble.


Another completely new poster here to say that, unfortunately, you are incorrect. The first respondent has been completely polite to you but you are being quite obtuse and rude. As has been pointed out by several people, remediation occurs throughout the year and, indeed, at multiple times during a child's school day. That is what good teaching is all about. Remediation is completely different than re-taking the SOL.

And, by the way, as a parent, I definitely do disagree with you about children knowing their SOL scores; they should know their SOL scores. Every time a child takes an assessment, whether it is formative or summative, the child should get feed back on how he or she performed. Otherwise the assessment has value only to the assessor and no value at all to the child being assessed.

Think about it this way. If your child plays soccer and kicks the ball towards the goal, do you want him or her to see if the ball goes in the net or not? Certainly you want the child to see what happens: if the ball misses the net then the child learns from that and if the ball goes into the net then the child learns from that as well. But blindly kicking the ball and not knowing the outcome does the child very little good.

FWIW, since several of us have read your posts and come to quite remarkably similar interpretations, you might want to think about how you can improve your writing style to be more clear about what you are trying to say. Especially since you think that none of us are understanding you. For instance, I think it would greatly help you if you phrased it this way: remediation for the purpose of re-taking the SOL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Failing an SOL doesn't necessarily get you more services or remediation. I think passing a retake can help a kid's confidence. Can you imagine failing at a school with 90% pass rates? That must feel awful for a kid.

in elementary school a child never has to know if they passed or failed a SOL UNLESS a parent tells them! Therefore at that level, boosting confidence is irrelevant unless you tell them they failed.

A teacher told my son he failed it when he was in 3rd grade and started remediation for a retake without our permission.

You don't need parent permission to reteach and/or remediate.

The elementary teacher had NO right to tell your child that they failed! I hope you went to the principal and then up the chain if need be. A lot of elementary schools do remediation within the classroom in small groups. All children(even those that passed) are working on different things. A good teacher, and administration will make sure the kids are not aware of who failed, who is retaking. Teaching in a few different schools this has always been the protocol. I'm sorry your child had to go through that.