Why do special ed teachers.therapists seem to condescend to the students, parents?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SLP is terrible at our school. Despite documented concerns for years, she denies any speech issues and says its attention. After several evaluations and years of therapy, she is the only one commenting this. Our special ed teacher seems great but most I have met are not and most general ed teachers because they don't know each disorder generally lump all SN kids together and assume the worst vs. the best. Many don't like parents who are involved and advocate.

I am wondering if your kid is at the same school as mine. She was obsessed with attention. Mainstream TEACHER who had my kid all day agreed the issue was language and not attention, but miss know it all could not let it go even when her own testing showed otherwise. I basically (in front of the IEP team) told her we see some of the top people in the country and even the world and they feel our child needs SLT and attention is not the issue. We have documentation of this in the file. Some of them are highly regarded researchers and professors. What makes you think you know more than they do? Please share your research and publications on the subject matter.

OMG. Not the OP here but we encountered the same type of issue in our school system. Outside evaluations (multiple evaluations that showed the same speech-language issues) and input from top professionals from top institutions (not hand-picked private professionals) didn't matter to our school system - they insisted against all evidence that DC didn't have speech-language issues at all. It's maddening.

Your private evaluations may show that there is a speech-language issue, but that doesn't mean your child will qualify for service. The SLPs are bound by certain qualification criteria. Other students may benefit from treatment, but that doesn't mean we can provide service in the schools. Sadly, that is what private therapy is for. Also, speech-pathologists in the county are not allowed to qualify a student based on assessments completed by a profession who is not an SLP. Psychologist often use tests that are more of a screening and not specific enough to language. So, they are required to do further testing even if they'd like to provide service. Believe me, testing takes a long time and takes the student away from instruction. We'd love to use your testing from the private psych, but simply are not allowed to. A private SLP may identify a speech-language weakness, but if the scores don't meat qualification criteria (which are very low), then our hands are tied. Not receiving school service is not an indication that your child would not benefit from treatment. We are simply limited to providing service only to those students whose difficulties can be identified as a disability which negatively impacts education and requires the specialized service of an SLP. As students reach MS and HS, they have more academic English classes and we are not allowed to bill for services which can reasonably be provided by someone else. Sometimes, that is the English teacher. For instance, we are not supposed to make IEP goals for reading even though SLPs have extensive training in this area, but MCPS have reading specialist who can target this area and they are easier to come by. There is always an SLP shortage.

We turned in several evaluations including a recent one from this summer from an SLP. The school SLP said she didn't see an language issue despite this child having serious language issues and only recently began talking. She was very clear she was not going to assist and was very annoyed we were even asking for services. It made no sense when the primary issue is language, the teachers supported the request and the SLP is saying that the test scores are fine (when they are not).

I can't really comment on that without knowing more details. Sorry. I do agree that some SLPs are less motivated than others. Unfortunately, caseloads typically grow, often substantially, over the course of the year and the SLP does not get additional help. So, more work in less time. Allocations for schools are made in January and a lot can change by the end of the year. Add in medical billing, IEP meetings, Speech Service meetings, paperwork, and prep time and you're left with barely any time to actually provide service. It's very frustrating. I am sorry that you've had a hard time.

That's really not acceptable. Schools are required to provide such services by law. Sadly, they often try to avoid their legal responsibility to do so, and that includes in the area of speech-language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The SLP is terrible at our school. Despite documented concerns for years, she denies any speech issues and says its attention. After several evaluations and years of therapy, she is the only one commenting this. Our special ed teacher seems great but most I have met are not and most general ed teachers because they don't know each disorder generally lump all SN kids together and assume the worst vs. the best. Many don't like parents who are involved and advocate.

I am wondering if your kid is at the same school as mine. She was obsessed with attention. Mainstream TEACHER who had my kid all day agreed the issue was language and not attention, but miss know it all could not let it go even when her own testing showed otherwise. I basically (in front of the IEP team) told her we see some of the top people in the country and even the world and they feel our child needs SLT and attention is not the issue. We have documentation of this in the file. Some of them are highly regarded researchers and professors. What makes you think you know more than they do? Please share your research and publications on the subject matter.

OMG. Not the OP here but we encountered the same type of issue in our school system. Outside evaluations (multiple evaluations that showed the same speech-language issues) and input from top professionals from top institutions (not hand-picked private professionals) didn't matter to our school system - they insisted against all evidence that DC didn't have speech-language issues at all. It's maddening.

Your private evaluations may show that there is a speech-language issue, but that doesn't mean your child will qualify for service. The SLPs are bound by certain qualification criteria. Other students may benefit from treatment, but that doesn't mean we can provide service in the schools. Sadly, that is what private therapy is for. Also, speech-pathologists in the county are not allowed to qualify a student based on assessments completed by a profession who is not an SLP. Psychologist often use tests that are more of a screening and not specific enough to language. So, they are required to do further testing even if they'd like to provide service. Believe me, testing takes a long time and takes the student away from instruction. We'd love to use your testing from the private psych, but simply are not allowed to. A private SLP may identify a speech-language weakness, but if the scores don't meat qualification criteria (which are very low), then our hands are tied. Not receiving school service is not an indication that your child would not benefit from treatment. We are simply limited to providing service only to those students whose difficulties can be identified as a disability which negatively impacts education and requires the specialized service of an SLP. As students reach MS and HS, they have more academic English classes and we are not allowed to bill for services which can reasonably be provided by someone else. Sometimes, that is the English teacher. For instance, we are not supposed to make IEP goals for reading even though SLPs have extensive training in this area, but MCPS have reading specialist who can target this area and they are easier to come by. There is always an SLP shortage.

We turned in several evaluations including a recent one from this summer from an SLP. The school SLP said she didn't see an language issue despite this child having serious language issues and only recently began talking. She was very clear she was not going to assist and was very annoyed we were even asking for services. It made no sense when the primary issue is language, the teachers supported the request and the SLP is saying that the test scores are fine (when they are not).

I can't really comment on that without knowing more details. Sorry. I do agree that some SLPs are less motivated than others. Unfortunately, caseloads typically grow, often substantially, over the course of the year and the SLP does not get additional help. So, more work in less time. Allocations for schools are made in January and a lot can change by the end of the year. Add in medical billing, IEP meetings, Speech Service meetings, paperwork, and prep time and you're left with barely any time to actually provide service. It's very frustrating. I am sorry that you've had a hard time.

That's really not acceptable. Schools are required to provide such services by law. Sadly, they often try to avoid their legal responsibility to do so, and that includes in the area of speech-language.

Somehow I trust the professional judgment of a therapist more than the Dr. Google-certified parent lobbying for services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Um, I don't know because I've never had a bad experience though I have clicked better with some than others. Are you just unlucky or am I lucky? Who knows.

So I'd say because people suck everywhere in every profession.

This. It's ridiculous to make vast generalizations based on limited experience, OP.

I've been at this quite awhile. I've dealt with a lot of "professionals" over the past 15 years. And yes, many of them have very low expectations of SN kids.

Right, you = n of 1--that's limited experience.

She's not alone. Most parents become experts of their kids, and understanding of others' needs as well. Which means that unless the SPED has LDs herself, or SN kids, she will perhaps not have the best approach. And then, sometimes SPED teachers with SN kids want to lump every kid they meet with their own kids! So there's never a set rule, except this one:
Many sped teachers don't get it.

That's one option.

Another is that parents themselves don't get it -- they believe their particular snowfllake is the center of the universe.

Sorry, that's not how schools work.

If you don't like it, and you believe you know it all, simply go the homeschooling route.

How ugly a thought on a SN forum.

The law is LRE and a FAPE, which includes specialized therapies that allow chidlren to access the curriculum. And parents have every right to insist on those.

Absolutely! The scandal is the excellent school districts around here that use the law to do the bare minimum (or less) and often get away with it, including in the area of speech-language.

[Anonymous]

To the OP - I got a little lost in some of the conversation going on here, but I really feel like you should talk with your child's teacher and/or school counselor. I am sorry you overheard the special ed teacher saying this because parents are a teacher's BEST partner in educating a child. I was a school administrator, and when parents had a problem, I listened and tried to make sure the relationship with the teacher was one of respect and willingness to work together. I have only encountered a handful of teachers in my 31 year career that didn't want what was best for a child. I am hopeful that you can work this out! Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ooh yeah...

I spent 5 years trying to explain that my child was gifted AND learning disabled, and needed to be challenged within the bounds of his disabilities, to no avail. That combo is the hardest scenario, as an educator who doesn't have much time with your kid, to understand and plan for. As a parent, I KNOW my child. But these people don't, and I hate to say it, but if they don't have a certain level of intelligence themselves, all their care and professional dedication will only go so far.

I battled during my son's 5th grade year to have the SPED teacher recommend him for a gifted and LD program in middle school, as he had been waitlisted for the magnet. We spent thousands in private evaluations to prove our point, which makes me sad because so many families can't afford this and are left at the mercy of a very imperfect system.

OK, I have heard this term gifted and LD, but what does that mean? How can that be? Does that mean high IQ but poor results? Is disability in only one area and child excels at other subjects? I am not trying to be sarcastic or smart "something" but could you explain what that means in real life and in real school, how does this reflect grades and learning? Both my kids seem smart to me, but their issues interfere with all aspects of school and life.

It means parents want taxpayers to pony up north of $50,000 in free services for said child, stealing resources from other equally unique and amazing kids.

Why they don't just homeschool or go private is beyond me.

Entitlement, some may say.

I was off this board for a day or so and I am astounded by the posts put here, especially if this post is by a teacher/service provider. I am the poster who said that when I brought experts, they were not listened to. All the experts that we have ever used also know the IDEA and what can and cannot be provided in schools. And when the recommendations were followed, my son thrived. All of them have taught and/or have practiced in school and clinical settings.

The problem is when ask for something reasonable and you encounter people in the system who do not understand. In some cases, they not even take the time to talk with my DS, but just wrote their reports based on reading the testing.

People in special education in public school settings are not trained broadly enough to understand the variety of disabilities they will likely encounter and general ed teachers will tell you that they do not get much follow-up guidance.

One teacher/provider on this board wrote "that is not how schools work". That is exactly the problem. Some school officials come with a bias and mindset and if your kid does not fit their assumptions, you can have an entire program that was working yanked out from under the child. For the PP who said that you know your field better: yes, you have studied and practiced. But I have apprenticed. I have sat through OT, speech language, Wilson instruction for years and then followed the advice of those providers with "home" work.

My DS is not some"special snowflake." He is a kid who is trying to go to school and learn, just like other kids. The law entitles him to an education. An education means that he can take care of himself and his family in the future. The poster here above that is worried about taxpayer money clearly doesn't understand that education is my son's future as a contributing member of society.

DS disability was observed as early as age 2. In this journey, I have met people who do know what they are doing and when they made that happen, public school worked for my kid. When I met the ignorant and arrogant, my DS suffered. And since so much of a kid's life is spent in school, it was agony for all of us. I was never condescending to those who wanted my child to do well. But I have met those who were condescending to me because I was only a "parent".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ooh yeah...

I spent 5 years trying to explain that my child was gifted AND learning disabled, and needed to be challenged within the bounds of his disabilities, to no avail. That combo is the hardest scenario, as an educator who doesn't have much time with your kid, to understand and plan for. As a parent, I KNOW my child. But these people don't, and I hate to say it, but if they don't have a certain level of intelligence themselves, all their care and professional dedication will only go so far.

I battled during my son's 5th grade year to have the SPED teacher recommend him for a gifted and LD program in middle school, as he had been waitlisted for the magnet. We spent thousands in private evaluations to prove our point, which makes me sad because so many families can't afford this and are left at the mercy of a very imperfect system.

OK, I have heard this term gifted and LD, but what does that mean? How can that be? Does that mean high IQ but poor results? Is disability in only one area and child excels at other subjects? I am not trying to be sarcastic or smart "something" but could you explain what that means in real life and in real school, how does this reflect grades and learning? Both my kids seem smart to me, but their issues interfere with all aspects of school and life.

It means parents want taxpayers to pony up north of $50,000 in free services for said child, stealing resources from other equally unique and amazing kids.

Why they don't just homeschool or go private is beyond me.

Entitlement, some may say.

I was off this board for a day or so and I am astounded by the posts put here, especially if this post is by a teacher/service provider. I am the poster who said that when I brought experts, they were not listened to. All the experts that we have ever used also know the IDEA and what can and cannot be provided in schools. And when the recommendations were followed, my son thrived. All of them have taught and/or have practiced in school and clinical settings.

The problem is when ask for something reasonable and you encounter people in the system who do not understand. In some cases, they not even take the time to talk with my DS, but just wrote their reports based on reading the testing.

People in special education in public school settings are not trained broadly enough to understand the variety of disabilities they will likely encounter and general ed teachers will tell you that they do not get much follow-up guidance.

One teacher/provider on this board wrote "that is not how schools work". That is exactly the problem. Some school officials come with a bias and mindset and if your kid does not fit their assumptions, you can have an entire program that was working yanked out from under the child. For the PP who said that you know your field better: yes, you have studied and practiced. But I have apprenticed. I have sat through OT, speech language, Wilson instruction for years and then followed the advice of those providers with "home" work.

My DS is not some"special snowflake." He is a kid who is trying to go to school and learn, just like other kids. The law entitles him to an education. An education means that he can take care of himself and his family in the future. The poster here above that is worried about taxpayer money clearly doesn't understand that education is my son's future as a contributing member of society.

DS disability was observed as early as age 2. In this journey, I have met people who do know what they are doing and when they made that happen, public school worked for my kid. When I met the ignorant and arrogant, my DS suffered. And since so much of a kid's life is spent in school, it was agony for all of us. I was never condescending to those who wanted my child to do well. But I have met those who were condescending to me because I was only a "parent".

Are you the pp with a gifted and learning disabled child? If so, your long post still doesn't explain what that means. Could you please explain? I have a high IQ DD but she is still learning disabled, no matter her IQ.