WWYD? Saw crying k student being picked up and moved to classroom by teacher

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you reported it, what would you report? If you told the parents, what would you tell?

OP I read all four pages of this thread. I still don't know the answer to this question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rules regarding restraints were written for special ed kids not 5 year old kindergarten students who are crying outside the door of the kindergarten classroom. I am a school psychologist and in the fall I get called to deal with a few kindergarten students who are crying outside the kinder classroom. Often times they won't let go of their parent. If the parent is there we have the parent carry the child into the classroom then the teacher or I hold the student as the parent leaves. If the parent leaves student outside the door and the student is crying and won't move we try talking first but usually it doesn't work. We gently move the student a few feet into the classroom. Most kids calms down in 5 to 10 minutes. There is a big difference between a crying kinder student and an emotionally disturbed student. We never move ED students (unless they are in a dangerous place like the middle of the street) we wait them out.

I have never worked in a place where the rules said they didn't apply to kindergarteners. What state are you in that the law makes that distinction?

In my experience, kindergarteners with separation anxiety can easily be handled without being picked up. Since it wasn't legal where I worked, we came up with other strategies. For starters, why not ask the parents leave them inside the classroom, taking away the need to move them?

I'm not a teacher, but I've witnessed a few occasions in this area where Kindergartners have had to be carried in to the classroom, and there really was no alternative. The teachers are gentle and soothing, and they do their best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rules regarding restraints were written for special ed kids not 5 year old kindergarten students who are crying outside the door of the kindergarten classroom. I am a school psychologist and in the fall I get called to deal with a few kindergarten students who are crying outside the kinder classroom. Often times they won't let go of their parent. If the parent is there we have the parent carry the child into the classroom then the teacher or I hold the student as the parent leaves. If the parent leaves student outside the door and the student is crying and won't move we try talking first but usually it doesn't work. We gently move the student a few feet into the classroom. Most kids calms down in 5 to 10 minutes. There is a big difference between a crying kinder student and an emotionally disturbed student. We never move ED students (unless they are in a dangerous place like the middle of the street) we wait them out.

I have never worked in a place where the rules said they didn't apply to kindergarteners. What state are you in that the law makes that distinction?

In my experience, kindergarteners with separation anxiety can easily be handled without being picked up. Since it wasn't legal where I worked, we came up with other strategies. For starters, why not ask the parents leave them inside the classroom, taking away the need to move them?

Sometimes the parents would leave them in the classroom but sometimes the child would cling on very tightly to the parent (who often times was going to be late to work or had a toddler with them). The only way was to gently hold the child while the parent pulled away. Other times the parent could bring the child in and the child was left crying by car line or outside the door. A kid with severe anxiety would be treated differently. Talk to any preschool teacher and they often have to do the same thing during drop off.
According to the state of Maryland
Physical restraint” does not include:
(i) Briefly holding a student to calm or comfort the student;
(ii) Holding a student’s hand or arm to escort the student safely from one area to another;
(iii) Moving a disruptive student who is unwilling to leave the area if other methods such as counseling have been unsuccessful; or
iv) Intervening in a fight in accordance with Education Article §7-307, Annotated Code of Maryland.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you really know these parents, I would certainly mention to them that their child seemed to have a really rough day at school and they should try and understand why she was so upset at the singalong.
To be mad at a K teacher because she moved the kid away from the situation that was upsetting her (and away from all the other kids who were behving and trying to have a good experience) is something I just don't understand.
You really want the K teacher to do breathing exercises (or other "social emotional exercise" whatever the heck that even means) with this kid smack in the middle of the singalong? I don't think that would have been very effective anyway.

A few clarifications, this is a private school. There are 11 students and 2 teachers. It prides itself on a strong social-emotional foundation based on the Responsive Classroom curriculum. This was right after school started, not at the sing along, happening right outside the classroom.

I understand what many are saying in that teachers need to be able to get their classroom on track for the sake of the other students. However, I do think other tactics could have been used other than forcibly carrying a girl who was resisting. All in all, I appreciate the feedback but I do stand by my gut.

Thank you to all who replied.

-OP

It can also be called anxiety. Children get overwhelmed and behave like this.

It is called a tantrum. The girl wanted to control the situation, she was unable so she had a tantrum which meant of couse she would resist.. Had the teacher left her in the hallway you would be upset that she was left unattended. And the girl would learn thgat tantrums at school get me ewhat I want.

[Anonymous]

So let me get this straight -
Whole school is in the room singing and Child is in the hallway with teacher (not explained how that part happened) but doesn't want to go back inside. Teacher does not provide what OP deems enough "social-emotional" tools to calm her. Child is still crying so teacher picks her up and takes her back in. A few minutes later child comes back out with a different teacher who breathes with her until she stops crying.

It doesn't sound as if the carrying of the crying child was abusive in any way (plus that teacher is essentially walking back into a room ful of people while doing it so I can't imagine it was heated) Basically you just wanted Teacher1 to be more loving and patient, right?

(Of course there would be a whole separate thread from parents about "My child had an event at school which was completely ruined because the teachers would not take out the one child who cried and made it so the rest of us couldn't hear" if the child hadn't been taken out)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People, this is a 5 year old who didn't want to sing. Not an emotionally disturbed 16 year old. Pick the kid up and deal with her. This isnt fucking rocket science.

2 years ago she was sitting in her own shit in a diaper. OP you are over reacting. Move on, nothing to see here.

Plus 1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So let me get this straight -
Whole school is in the room singing and Child is in the hallway with teacher (not explained how that part happened) but doesn't want to go back inside. Teacher does not provide what OP deems enough "social-emotional" tools to calm her. Child is still crying so teacher picks her up and takes her back in. A few minutes later child comes back out with a different teacher who breathes with her until she stops crying.

It doesn't sound as if the carrying of the crying child was abusive in any way (plus that teacher is essentially walking back into a room ful of people while doing it so I can't imagine it was heated) Basically you just wanted Teacher1 to be more loving and patient, right?

(Of course there would be a whole separate thread from parents about "My child had an event at school which was completely ruined because the teachers would not take out the one child who cried and made it so the rest of us couldn't hear" if the child hadn't been taken out)

Exactly, OP please don't put someone's job on the line because you feel the teacher wasn't loving or sensitive enough. If you really felt something was off, why didn't you speak up while you were watching this unfold?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She basically carried her, crying, back into the classroom. She's my son's best friend, very shy and anxious. She was crying because our school was having a sing a long and didn't want to sing. Barely any social-emotional tools used during the 5 minutes spent trying to calm the child. After five minutes she just said "come on, back inside" picked up the crying child and walked into the classroom with her. Five minutes later the same girl came back outside with the other teacher, crying, but finally calmed down 5 minutes later as the teacher used breathing exercises to calm her. Should I be reporting this to someone? Telling her parents? My gut says yes but I'm a first time elementary parent so maybe this is normal? Thanks for your two cents.

Mind your own business. She didn't threaten the child. She didn't hit the child.

SEL - lol! Tell me what you know first about CASEL's competencies before you throw around SEL, you novice.

[Anonymous]

Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

Your child likely has a behavior problem. Maybe the head drop knocked some sense into her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

Your child likely has a behavior problem. Maybe the head drop knocked some sense into her.

Even if a kid (and a young kid at that) is behaving in a way that's challenging or causing a problem, they still don't deserve to be hurt. Seriously, that's your response?

I was slightly on the teacher's side before, but if that sort of callous casual disregard for children is what people think and are prepared to tolerate (PP said it, and thus far it has gone unchallenged), I may well be inclined to agree with the posters who were originally agains this practice. Kindly and compassionately solving a problem in the moment is one thing, but given what it can lead to...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

Your child likely has a behavior problem. Maybe the head drop knocked some sense into her.

Even if a kid (and a young kid at that) is behaving in a way that's challenging or causing a problem, they still don't deserve to be hurt. Seriously, that's your response?

I was slightly on the teacher's side before, but if that sort of callous casual disregard for children is what people think and are prepared to tolerate (PP said it, and thus far it has gone unchallenged), I may well be inclined to agree with the posters who were originally agains this practice. Kindly and compassionately solving a problem in the moment is one thing, but given what it can lead to...

NP. Come on lady.any and everybody who can read could tell that PP was trolling. Common sense goes a very long way in the real world, but not too far on DCUM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

Your child likely has a behavior problem. Maybe the head drop knocked some sense into her.

Even if a kid (and a young kid at that) is behaving in a way that's challenging or causing a problem, they still don't deserve to be hurt. Seriously, that's your response?

I was slightly on the teacher's side before, but if that sort of callous casual disregard for children is what people think and are prepared to tolerate (PP said it, and thus far it has gone unchallenged), I may well be inclined to agree with the posters who were originally agains this practice. Kindly and compassionately solving a problem in the moment is one thing, but given what it can lead to...

NP. Come on lady.any and everybody who can read could tell that PP was trolling. Common sense goes a very long way in the real world, but not too far on DCUM

I wish. Unfortunately, I've heard at least one person seriously make a similar statement in real life. I'm slowly becoming alarmed at how little regard our society seems to have for children as people with basic rights. Sure, by and large in this area we spoil our kids, but do we treat them well and properly?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please report this, OP. Another staff member told us that our child was being carried in this way when it was unnecessary and dropped DC on the head. They also did not take DC to the nurse to get checked out after this happened so they wouldn't have a report. She was alarmed and told us. We later found out the school has had a lot of issues covering up things and the staff member involved was encouraged to find another job.
This is a supposedly good elementary in the W cluster.

Your child likely has a behavior problem. Maybe the head drop knocked some sense into her.

Even if a kid (and a young kid at that) is behaving in a way that's challenging or causing a problem, they still don't deserve to be hurt. Seriously, that's your response?

I was slightly on the teacher's side before, but if that sort of callous casual disregard for children is what people think and are prepared to tolerate (PP said it, and thus far it has gone unchallenged), I may well be inclined to agree with the posters who were originally agains this practice. Kindly and compassionately solving a problem in the moment is one thing, but given what it can lead to...

NP. Come on lady.any and everybody who can read could tell that PP was trolling. Common sense goes a very long way in the real world, but not too far on DCUM

I wish. Unfortunately, I've heard at least one person seriously make a similar statement in real life. I'm slowly becoming alarmed at how little regard our society seems to have for children as people with basic rights. Sure, by and large in this area we spoil our kids, but do we treat them well and properly?

Pick up your mantle and start the crusade to save the children!

[Anonymous]

Wonder what OP would think if the child had decided to run out the door? Teacher couldn't restrain the kid? Wow.

Maybe OP has a very well behaved kid, but I can tell you that some K kids throw tantrums. I had one that did--not at school, thankfully. It is also possible that this is typical behavior on the part of this child.