Achievement gap continues to grow between high- and low-income schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:'they blend the classes together. Honors Science is a small section in each Science class. They get extra work, extra test questions but still have to sit in the class with the dumb disruptive kids. Sorry so harsh but in my child's middle school (JW) it does NOT work well."

I also have a kid at JW. In my child's experience almost every one is considered advanced and the teachers are sort of pressure to move kids up who don't start out that way. The degree of differentiation is teacher dependant. Not all middle schools are run this way. I agree it could be better..but your use of dumb and disuptive is inappropriate and offensive.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel your pain. We are in an area of Silver Spring with a crappy elementary school (it wasn't too bad when we bought our home 10 years ago but since then the number of FARMS has skyrocketed and, unfortunately, it's seems to have had an inverse relationship to school performance).

Anyway, my husband and I really struggle with what to do. We cannot afford a home in a nicer area of Silver Spring, we certainly cannot afford a private school or to move to Bethesda, Chevy Chase, etc. We're stuck. It certainly feels like MoCo is not only the county of haves and have nots (which I think it's always been, to some extent) but that the school system for those of us in my neck of the woods is broken.

I also agree with the PP that if there was some degree of tracking, I wouldn't worry. But a neighbor tells me that his 3rd grader is in a class with students who don't speak any English and spends his days doing busy work because the teacher is consumed with teaching to the 65% of her class that is still learning the language.

I love Silver Spring and I love this area of Maryland, but I'm looking for a job that will allow me to primarily telework so DH and I can move out of MoCo. We can't afford the nicer neighborhoods that feed into the decent schools. So depressing.

And I feel your pain.... Silver Spring is such a cool place and realizing that the schools just weren't an option - even when I was being as open-minded as possible - was depressing. We moved out of MoCo and it was the right choice for us. I think the whole discussion about the achievement gap sort of misses the point sometimes. Our schools needed more resources, they needed more parent involvement, they needed more programs tailored to address the language barriers, they needed more infrastructure to make the schools more attractive to everyone in the community. Who cares if the test scores are high enough? A look at what's happening "on the ground" shows that more basic issues need to be addressed before we even start talking about test performance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with focusing on the achievement gap is that it paradoxically increases it. I went to a low performing MCPS school in the late 1980's when there was real tracking and I was in accelerated classes with other like minded/ motivated students. If tracking existed like it did when I was in high school, I wouldn't be as concerned about my children attending the "best" school because I would know my children's needs could be met at most if not all MCPS schools. Today however, I know that I need my kids to be in the most affluent school possible so that there are resources to deal with acceleration. Since there are few bottom kids at my kids' school, I know my kids' teachers can focus on teaching my kids rather than giving them worksheets

No kid close to high school yet, but don't honors classes serve this purpose? Or are you looking for tracking beyond this?

they blend the classes together. Honors Science is a small section in each Science class. They get extra work, extra test questions but still have to sit in the class with the dumb disruptive kids. Sorry so harsh but in my child's middle school (JW) it does NOT work well.

Ah ok. While I may not agree with your phrasing, I understand it to an extent. Didn't grow up around here, but most of my high school courses had tracking. Those classes that didn't were not as productive because they were often a mix of unmotivated, disruptive kids (I would not use dumb because some of them were actually quite smart). I was a shy, nerdy kid who went through teasing (which i now recognize as bullying) during the awkward middle achool years and definitely felt more comfortable in classes with high-achievers. At the same time, it's tough because research has shown that putting all the low-achievers together isn't beneficial (there was a story on NPR recently but can't find the link).

[Anonymous]

Another SS dweller here! Same predicament here- we're educated, federal/contractor employees, but we were definitely priced out of a lot of areas. It's frustrating, and we have many friends/colleagues in the same boat. We've heard good things about our neighborhood ES, even if the test scores are average, so we'll see how it goes. If we can swing it, we'd eventually like to move to VA to give the kids more public university options anyway. But right now, we like our neighborhood and its convenient to our jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel your pain. We are in an area of Silver Spring with a crappy elementary school (it wasn't too bad when we bought our home 10 years ago but since then the number of FARMS has skyrocketed and, unfortunately, it's seems to have had an inverse relationship to school performance).

Anyway, my husband and I really struggle with what to do. We cannot afford a home in a nicer area of Silver Spring, we certainly cannot afford a private school or to move to Bethesda, Chevy Chase, etc. We're stuck. It certainly feels like MoCo is not only the county of haves and have nots (which I think it's always been, to some extent) but that the school system for those of us in my neck of the woods is broken.

I also agree with the PP that if there was some degree of tracking, I wouldn't worry. But a neighbor tells me that his 3rd grader is in a class with students who don't speak any English and spends his days doing busy work because the teacher is consumed with teaching to the 65% of her class that is still learning the language.

I love Silver Spring and I love this area of Maryland, but I'm looking for a job that will allow me to primarily telework so DH and I can move out of MoCo. We can't afford the nicer neighborhoods that feed into the decent schools. So depressing.

And I feel your pain.... Silver Spring is such a cool place and realizing that the schools just weren't an option - even when I was being as open-minded as possible - was depressing. We moved out of MoCo and it was the right choice for us. I think the whole discussion about the achievement gap sort of misses the point sometimes. Our schools needed more resources, they needed more parent involvement, they needed more programs tailored to address the language barriers, they needed more infrastructure to make the schools more attractive to everyone in the community. Who cares if the test scores are high enough? A look at what's happening "on the ground" shows that more basic issues need to be addressed before we even start talking about test performance.

I just posted elsewhere that I am a minority that loves Silver Spring and enjoyed Takoma Park. However, after taking a look at the DCC high schools (especially the leaders) we moved. We looked at Blair long and hard over a long period of time and met many who were satisfied with the education in the DCC. But the quality of education that satisfied them was way below what we expected and now get for our children in another county.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel your pain. We are in an area of Silver Spring with a crappy elementary school (it wasn't too bad when we bought our home 10 years ago but since then the number of FARMS has skyrocketed and, unfortunately, it's seems to have had an inverse relationship to school performance).

Anyway, my husband and I really struggle with what to do. We cannot afford a home in a nicer area of Silver Spring, we certainly cannot afford a private school or to move to Bethesda, Chevy Chase, etc. We're stuck. It certainly feels like MoCo is not only the county of haves and have nots (which I think it's always been, to some extent) but that the school system for those of us in my neck of the woods is broken.

I also agree with the PP that if there was some degree of tracking, I wouldn't worry. But a neighbor tells me that his 3rd grader is in a class with students who don't speak any English and spends his days doing busy work because the teacher is consumed with teaching to the 65% of her class that is still learning the language.

I love Silver Spring and I love this area of Maryland, but I'm looking for a job that will allow me to primarily telework so DH and I can move out of MoCo. We can't afford the nicer neighborhoods that feed into the decent schools. So depressing.

And I feel your pain.... Silver Spring is such a cool place and realizing that the schools just weren't an option - even when I was being as open-minded as possible - was depressing. We moved out of MoCo and it was the right choice for us. I think the whole discussion about the achievement gap sort of misses the point sometimes. Our schools needed more resources, they needed more parent involvement, they needed more programs tailored to address the language barriers, they needed more infrastructure to make the schools more attractive to everyone in the community. Who cares if the test scores are high enough? A look at what's happening "on the ground" shows that more basic issues need to be addressed before we even start talking about test performance.

I just posted elsewhere that I am a minority that loves Silver Spring and enjoyed Takoma Park. However, after taking a look at the DCC high schools (especially the leaders) we moved. We looked at Blair long and hard over a long period of time and met many who were satisfied with the education in the DCC. But the quality of education that satisfied them was way below what we expected and now get for our children in another county.

Just curious- what county did you move to? We live TP/SS as well, but do worry long term about the HS options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel your pain. We are in an area of Silver Spring with a crappy elementary school (it wasn't too bad when we bought our home 10 years ago but since then the number of FARMS has skyrocketed and, unfortunately, it's seems to have had an inverse relationship to school performance).

Anyway, my husband and I really struggle with what to do. We cannot afford a home in a nicer area of Silver Spring, we certainly cannot afford a private school or to move to Bethesda, Chevy Chase, etc. We're stuck. It certainly feels like MoCo is not only the county of haves and have nots (which I think it's always been, to some extent) but that the school system for those of us in my neck of the woods is broken.

I also agree with the PP that if there was some degree of tracking, I wouldn't worry. But a neighbor tells me that his 3rd grader is in a class with students who don't speak any English and spends his days doing busy work because the teacher is consumed with teaching to the 65% of her class that is still learning the language.

I love Silver Spring and I love this area of Maryland, but I'm looking for a job that will allow me to primarily telework so DH and I can move out of MoCo. We can't afford the nicer neighborhoods that feed into the decent schools. So depressing.

Apply to private and request financial aid. We did that for our oldest because our middle school is awful and like another poster mentioned, they do not track the kids and there was bullying about wanting to raise your hand and do well in school. I mean REAL bullying. The mixing of students does not work. My child was in a great track math class but the rest were bad. The teachers do not like it, the parents do not like it and the kids HATE it.

There are so many privates in this area for that very reason. If your child is smart, works hard, has a couple of triggers like art, instrument, sports - getting into a at least one private is pretty easy. It has made all the difference for us. We get a 66% FA package and it is very doable and well worth the 33% we put into it.

[Anonymous]

The recent study seems to allow people in eastern MoCo to let loose with their concerns and dissatisfaction with the schools. If someone who moved to Bethesda made the same observations, people in Silver Spring would be saying their schools are great and people in Bethesda and Potomac are snobs.

[Anonymous]

Get liberals out and have conservatives run the schools with the right to kick out kids who don't want or try to learn.

Put those kids in vocational school or boarding school.

Watch the results increase . The problem is liberalism ... Expensive and lousy results every time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I feel your pain. We are in an area of Silver Spring with a crappy elementary school (it wasn't too bad when we bought our home 10 years ago but since then the number of FARMS has skyrocketed and, unfortunately, it's seems to have had an inverse relationship to school performance).

Anyway, my husband and I really struggle with what to do. We cannot afford a home in a nicer area of Silver Spring, we certainly cannot afford a private school or to move to Bethesda, Chevy Chase, etc. We're stuck. It certainly feels like MoCo is not only the county of haves and have nots (which I think it's always been, to some extent) but that the school system for those of us in my neck of the woods is broken.

I also agree with the PP that if there was some degree of tracking, I wouldn't worry. But a neighbor tells me that his 3rd grader is in a class with students who don't speak any English and spends his days doing busy work because the teacher is consumed with teaching to the 65% of her class that is still learning the language.

I love Silver Spring and I love this area of Maryland, but I'm looking for a job that will allow me to primarily telework so DH and I can move out of MoCo. We can't afford the nicer neighborhoods that feed into the decent schools. So depressing.

And I feel your pain.... Silver Spring is such a cool place and realizing that the schools just weren't an option - even when I was being as open-minded as possible - was depressing. We moved out of MoCo and it was the right choice for us. I think the whole discussion about the achievement gap sort of misses the point sometimes. Our schools needed more resources, they needed more parent involvement, they needed more programs tailored to address the language barriers, they needed more infrastructure to make the schools more attractive to everyone in the community. Who cares if the test scores are high enough? A look at what's happening "on the ground" shows that more basic issues need to be addressed before we even start talking about test performance.

The more illegal immigrants that come to MOCO, the worse it will get. More resources go to ESOL and FARMS than ever. This is money in the school budget set aside JUST to get them to speak English and get fed. That is a lot of money taking away from the classrooms. Has your school been losing paraeducators in the class? Ours has and it is because we now have 3 ESOL teachers to the 1 we had when my 14yr old was there. Parent involvement? Are you kidding. They don't even speak English, would never show up for a PTA meeting and don't volunteer their time at anything. The schools are plummeting and the state/county welcomes them but can not afford them. It is a huge problem that people seem to not want to speak of because it is not politically correct. Our county is #2 in the COUNTRY for increased illegal immigration. It will only get worse. In 2009 it was estimated that $966 million was spent on educating illegal aliens in the state of MD. An additional $250 million for ESL. Since MOCO has 70% of the state's illegal immigrants you can see how this eats up the budget a little. And that was 5yrs ago. And you do realize they actually don't pay taxes so they don't contribute to the American education system in anyway. But..... it is not nice to say anything like this so let's keep trying to figure out a plan that works while they keep coming.

[Anonymous]

Uniforms, year round school, strict discipline. Vocational, boarding or military school for problem kids with chances to earn their way back to the mainstream school to pick up where they left off. Teachers wear business attire.

Or... You can spend truckloads of money and suck. Know all about racism , Martin Luther King, global warming and diversity.
Unfortunately .... Not be able to add or read.

[Anonymous]

English as a prerequisite to enter school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Achievement Gap can not be closed. There are too many factors that do not have to do with education and school that come into play that create the Achievement Gap.

Schools in our area waste inordinate resources trying to achieve something that can no be achieved at any dollar amount.

Striving to narrow the gap a marginal amount each year is a much better use of money and time.

In our area one thing that social service organizations and schools could do that would directly impact the ESL students and most likely help narrow the gap for that segment is to regularly urge and stress to parents [b]the need to always speak in English to their children as much as they are capable and to learn English themselves as much as they are capable. Yes, I know about all the benefits of bilingualism and bilingual education but those benefits do not likely extend to those parents who did not attain a higher education in their native language or may not be literate in their native language.

It will help if parents who speak English badly (or not at all) speak in English to their children?

If you learned to speak [language that is not English] from parents who didn't go to college, it doesn't count?

You'd be appalled at the poor grammar and verbage that some parent(s) speak to their children with, in "English" or their native language.
Just generating more of the same.

Do you propose the government care for these children 24/7? Open you pocketbook more montgomery county
Case de Maryland would be more than happy to help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Get liberals out and have conservatives run the schools with the right to kick out kids who don't want or try to learn.

Put those kids in vocational school or boarding school.

Watch the results increase . The problem is liberalism ... Expensive and lousy results every time.

Who pays for these boarding schools you want to send problem students to? What are the costs of staffing, training, maintaining the physical plant, providing 3 squares & basic furniture? My cousin went to boarding school for a year when both his parents were deployed. $49k and that was during Gulf War I so imagine the cost now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I agree with the need for mixed housing. Not everyone wants or needs to live in a huge house. I'd be happy with a small apartment that fed into Churchill. Instead I am down county and in a small apartment to close the gap between FA and tuition at DD's private. Still cheaper than our second choice public after finding out we'd pay as much for an apartment in WJ's catchment as we were paying for a SFH in the DCC.

But the people who live in Potomac do not want apartments in their neighborhoods.

Ah yes, let's add some super dense apartment projects and then build larger schools and programs for these subsidized people.