Accommodation requests for sitting for SAT and ACT college entrance and talent search examinations

[Anonymous]

The PSAT is not designed for 4th graders. If someone feels there child is so exceptional that they are prepared to take the test 6 or 7 years early, so be it. But if that child then needs accommodations to be successful, they should not have been taking it in the first place.

That would be like me saying I am ready to compete in the Olympics, but need a head start in every race to give me a chance.

[Anonymous]

I still haven't seen anyone reply to my earlier point about how this data, if accurate and not evidence of "gaming the system", does not provide direct evidence of the intellectual inferiority of white people.

[Anonymous]

If a 4th grader can't complete the PSAT without accommodations, it is unlikely that they are of the "exceptional" variety. There is no shame in this. But reality should be faced. If one needs accommodations to find success, one should not seek to hide this fact.

If a 10th grader can't complete the PSAT without accommodations, it is unlikely that they are of the "exceptional" variety. There is no shame in this. But reality should be faced. If one needs accommodations to find success, one should not seek to hide this fact. Sounds like the PP profound statement applies to many...including the gamers.



Do affluent families and students in area D.C. private schools game the national testing system (SAT/ACT) with special requests for accommodation (e.g. spurious diagnoses such as A.H.A.D.)?
...Testing organizations have long feared that unmerited accommodations, especially extra time, undermines their exams’ integrity.

A 2000 audit of California test takers showed a disproportionate number of white, affluent students receiving accommodations, igniting suspicions of exaggerated or nonexistent disabilities. Three years later, in the wake of a lawsuit, ACT and the College Board stopped flagging scores of accommodated students for admissions offices; with the stigma gone, the incentive grew to game the systemr[/b] can't complete the PSAT without accommodations, it is unlikely that they are of the "exceptional" variety. There is no shame in this. But reality should be faced. If one needs accommodations to find success, one should not seek to hide this fact"

[Anonymous]

The PSAT is not designed for 4th graders. If someone feels there child is so exceptional that they are prepared to take the test 6 or 7 years early, so be it. But if that child then needs accommodations to be successful, they should not have been taking it in the first place.

That would be like me saying I am ready to compete in the Olympics, but need a head start in every race to give me a chance.

Your reasoning is illogical.

Nobody in the Olympics gets a head start in every race (including the presumptive precocious athletes or the mature athletes) however there are students gaming the system for advantage and getting extra time to take the PSAT. Therefore, if 9th and 10 th graders get extra time to take the exam for advantage why can't a 4th grader or someone in middle school?

Your analogy about the Olympics weakens your argument. No one is getting accommodation and gaming the Olympics therefore I would not seek accommodation for a 4th grader at the Olympic games!

[Anonymous]

If 4th graders can play the violin and piano at a high or lofty level (or swim, play lacrosse, baseball, tennis, gulf and gymnastics at a lofty level) why can't a 4th grader perform an intellectual exercise at a high level?

No reason. The very rare and truly gifted student can not only perform, but can also excel at many intellectual exercises, to be sure. However, if this 4th grade phenom needs extended time to complete a test designed for 9th and 10th graders, then perhaps the 4th grader is just...average, and should be encouraged to develop their strengths for the future date when it is developmentally appropriate for them to take the test.

[Anonymous]

For all of you who doubt that learning issues just pop up in 10th grade -- what happens is with the advent of honors/AP classes, the traditional compensatory strategies are no longer effective and performance and self esteem begin to drop. Since there is no way a child with visual processing issues/graphomotor challenges (in addition to others) can keep up with the amount and intensity of work parents approach educational testing gingerly, since it is the final admission that something they may have always suspected about their child's learning issues is probably true. So the additional time allotted by the school/testing agencies is in fact something that the child needed along, but instead the child had to (or not) work 2 or 3 times as hard as other students. If schools did a better job of identifying learning challenges earlier, then more children would get the time they needed well before 10th grade and not appear to others as "gaming the system"

Nonsense. Have you heard of the Bell shaped curve in relation to populations. Some folk will always have to work harder than others. Some work less for the same output. That's life baby. The playing field is not level. I am not against accommodations but if you are going to be so sensitive to certain subsets of students why not just have accommodations for every one (including poor students). That would even out the playing field since no one would be gaming the system. Every one would have enough time as reasonably possible (without making it a take home exam turned in after a year) to finish all the sections! The results of such a strategy would probably still fall along the lines of a Bell shaped curve without the confounding due to the gamers (the rich kids)!

[Anonymous]

Therefore, if 9th and 10 th graders get extra time to take the exam for advantage why can't a 4th grader or someone in middle school?

Because extra time is not an accommodation "for advantage". It is meant to provide a level playing field for students with documented disabilities or learning issues.

[Anonymous]

No reason. The very rare and truly gifted student can not only perform, but can also excel at many intellectual exercises, to be sure. However, if this 4th grade phenom needs extended time to complete a test designed for 9th and 10th graders, then perhaps the 4th grader is just...average, and should be encouraged to develop their strengths for the future date when it is developmentally appropriate for them to take the test.

Nonsense. If a 9th or 10th grader games the system for advantage by getting extra time to complete the PSAT why can't others, even if they are younger and in a lower grade? What does "developmentally appropriate" mean? Are you saying that all 9th and 10th graders are "developmentally appropriate" and therefore if they cannot finish all the 4 sections of the exam they are eligible for accommodations and 4th graders are "developmentally inappropriate" and ineligible for special advantage and accommodation?

What does rare, truly gifted have to do with the discussion of gaming the PSAT exam for advantage? Are you saying that truly gifted students should not be given accommodation but all others that are not gifted are eligible to game the system? What does rare and truly gifted have to do with anything? Please how do you define and pin point who is "truly gifted"?

[Anonymous]

No reason. The very rare and truly gifted student can not only perform, but can also excel at many intellectual exercises, to be sure. However, if this 4th grade phenom needs extended time to complete a test designed for 9th and 10th graders, then perhaps the 4th grader is just...average, and should be encouraged to develop their strengths for the future date when it is developmentally appropriate for them to take the test.

Do you dispute the College Board findings about gaming the testing system and the NY Times article?

[Anonymous]

Because extra time is not an accommodation "for advantage". It is meant to provide a level playing field for students with documented disabilities or learning issues.

I know where you are going in theory. Let's get back to the real world here. Do you dispute the research findings of the College Board regarding affluent white families gaming their testing system through bogus requests for accommodation (and bogus support from their schools, college advisors and "psychologists")? Have you read the NY Times article?

One way to get around the gamers is to extend time for everyone. This will truely level the playing field. Everyone gets a reasonable chance to finish all sections.

[Anonymous]

Do you dispute the College Board findings about gaming the testing system and the NY Times article?

Not at all. I am sure there is gaming going on in the system and I don't support it. I also don't support 4th graders taking a test meant for college admissions if they need extended time, because there is no way to really know if that child is just too young and lacks the fluency of reading and responding to a test above their admitted grade level (4th grade, rather than an 8 year old 10th grader) or if there is a real learning disability that requires accommodation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The PSAT is not designed for 4th graders. If someone feels there child is so exceptional that they are prepared to take the test 6 or 7 years early, so be it. But if that child then needs accommodations to be successful, they should not have been taking it in the first place.

That would be like me saying I am ready to compete in the Olympics, but need a head start in every race to give me a chance.

Your reasoning is illogical.

Nobody in the Olympics gets a head start in every race (including the presumptive precocious athletes or the mature athletes) however there are students gaming the system for advantage and getting extra time to take the PSAT. Therefore, if 9th and 10 th graders get extra time to take the exam for advantage why can't a 4th grader or someone in middle school?

Your analogy about the Olympics weakens your argument. No one is getting accommodation and gaming the Olympics therefore I would not seek accommodation for a 4th grader at the Olympic games!

You are not following my argument. Please apply some basic reading comprehension before critiquing my reasoning. I said nothing about 9th or 10th graders. If 9th or 10th grade students have genuine needs that make necessary additional time for the PSAT, then they should receive that. But 4th graders shouldn't be taking the PSAT at all. There is no reason to. Should an exception arise and a 4th grader presents as so exceptional as to make it appropriate that they take the test, they should not require additional time. If they did they shouldn't be taking the test in the first place. Was that so hard to follow?

[Anonymous]

For some students, the time is legitimate and necessary. The issue here is students who don't have a legitimate need but otherwise fake one to get additional time. This is ethically repugnant.

[Anonymous]

A fourth grader would qualify for extra time by performing poorly on diagnostic tests compared to other fourth grade-aged kids. So, for example, on the WISC the fourth grader would have a processing speed at the 10th percentile, compared to other 9-year-olds. How the fourth graders processing speed is compared to tenth graders is not relevant.

A tenth grader would qualify for extra time by performing poorly on diagnostic tests compared to other 15-year-olds.

A fourth grader can take as many PSATs or SATs as s/he or his/her parents want, but doesn't deserve extra time unless s/he is slow compared to other kids of the same age.

[Anonymous]

I know where you are going in theory. Let's get back to the real world here. Do you dispute the research findings of the College Board regarding affluent white families gaming their testing system through bogus requests for accommodation (and bogus support from their schools, college advisors and "psychologists")? Have you read the NY Times article?

One way to get around the gamers is to extend time for everyone. This will truely level the playing field. Everyone gets a reasonable chance to finish all sections.

While I have issues with you suggesting that I'm not living in the real world, I'll say that we agree on the basics. I read the NYTimes article and I don't dispute the findings; my professional experience validates these findings. Further, I agree that extending time for everyone is a good first step. Go ahead and google (scholar) the connection between timed tests and achievement. And, you're right. It would certainly get around the gamers.