Williams Admitted Students day - recommendations needed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP: this is a spinoff question for the Williams alums (OP hope you don’t mind)

Having gone to such a small undergrad in a remote location, do you sometimes wish you went to a larger college and had a larger friend pool to choose from?

Class of 1990 alum here. For me, the answer to your question is "no." My class had almost 500 people in it (not to mention the other classes around mine), so there were plenty of people to know and meet. And the size generates, in my perception anyway, a greater sense of community, both while at school and in the decades afterwards that I don't think people at larger schools have. So for me, the size was a big positive. I will note that the night before graduation in 1990, as I was standing around talking to my friends, I realized that I was ready for something different (I was headed to NYC for law school), but I never felt that way during my time at Williams. As I say to anyone who asks, its not for everyone (primarily because of its location), but for many (and for me), it was an amazing experience and education.

PP very helpful. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

How's it going?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a male, you don't want to go to Williams unless you're an athlete.

Tell us more!

I’m the PO who graduated from Williams, and this is just not true. Everyone finds their group there, but that group could be the kids who hang out in a programming lab or play ultimate frisbee obsessively. Yes there are lots of athletes percentage wise as the school fields teams in almost all collegiate sports from a small student body, but that doesn’t mean those athletes don’t socialize with everyone else. It’s not like a div 1 school where an athlete is all consumed in their sport all year and only socializes with other athletes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP: My heart breaks for DC. I know nothing is promised/guaranteed/entitled, but almost all DC's math friends (school, camp, etc) got into top schools (Ivys, MIT, Stanford, etc). Like, almost.every.single.friend (all of them are great kids, smart, worked hard. so did DC).

DC seems to be the only one not going to one.

DC's a tough cookie and a trooper. But I can see the disappointment. DC worked so hard (and has a 2+ plus commute to school everyday on top of the academics and ECs, all of which DC did because enjoyed them, and not for the sake of college).

I just don't understand why.

Sorry for the long vent. Thank you for listening. Need to get it out...

OP as a math major at Williams, I hate how you are implying that dc didn’t get into any top schools. I think you are missing that many people consider Williams & Rice top schools. I turned down Ivys, as did most of my Williams friends. This will be shocking to you, but a few friends were sad they didn’t get into Williams and ended up at an Ivy.
It doesn’t sound like Williams is the right fit for your family, and the spot probably should go to someone who is thrilled to be accepted. That said, one of the reasons I chose Williams was for the unprecedented professor access. The tenured professors teach even the freshman math classes, and you are invited to discuss anything in their office hours, assist with research, create your own independent study class, etc. I met with professors at Princeton, etc and the access and opportunities weren’t there in undergrad.

OP: Hi - I'm sorry if I/we came across as entitled or un-appreciative. I absolutely know DC has great choices. But yes, DC did have higher hopes (from peer pressure, influenced by prestige, etc). Not necessarily right, but it's what all the ambitious/driven kids want. DC knows 12 friends going to Princeton this year (yes 12!!! from school/summer camps/math comps/childhood friends/etc), Harvard, Stanford, Caltech, etc. You name it. There's at least a friend going.

I agree that name-chasing is not necessarily right, but DC feels inadequate (IMO wrongly so, to a certain extent). I think that's a valid feeling.

We're excited about Williams this weekend! All I've heard about Williams is the amazing undergrad focus and experience, and can't wait to hear more. Despite not having access to grad classes, I think Williams is a real contender and DC is still un-decided!

Williams *is* a prestigious school. It is not a harder acceptance than the Ivy League schools.

Your son's feelings of inadequacy are not valid because they are not based on facts. As a parent, I would never validate them.

Then again, as a parent, I would not encourage chasing schools for their name brands, either.

Thank you! I’m the PP alum who was annoyed by the OPs attitude. Even the OPs response is still based on invalid facts. I see why your DC feels how he does bc you seem to be validating his incorrect feelings.
As far as things to do if you can’t make the official admitted students weekend, if your DC has subject(s) they are most curious about, reach out to professors and see if you could meet with one or two or be put in touch with current students majoring. If you’re into outdoor stuff, reach out to the outing club for some suggested hikes. Otherwise the Clark art institute, Williams art museum and mass
Moca are great. Try to stay at the Williams Inn or somewhere else close to get a feel for the town and student life. Hope you have a great visit!

[Anonymous]

I’m an alum and to answer the previous question about running out of people to meet on campus…There were a lot of classmates whom I knew by face at graduation but had not really met. One nice thing about reunions has been talking to people with whom we didn’t have much interaction while we were on campus! Another nice thing has been being able to approach people wearing Williams gear (I live in a city with very few alums) and strike up an instant conversation without it being weird or awkward. Finally, I live in a city where there are very few Williams alums so I’ve been approached by Williams alums whom I had never met while we were on campus, looking for a connection in a new place. I think that’s one great thing about its small size.

[Anonymous]

Is it a campus where boarding schools/NYC elite private school kids keep to themselves? DC watched "Day in the life of a Williams student" type videos on Youtube; she said some kids seem nice but in a couple videos, kids talk and act like they're from Gossip Girl (according to DC. I didn't watch them).

[Anonymous]

Visited and can't for.the life of me tell what the dominant culture is. Clearly there are athletes, quirky kids, 'well bred' private school kids, evident money as well as many mentions of fgli experience. I'm puzzled

[Anonymous]

OP: hi everyone, we came back yesterday from Previews, and hubby and I are WOW'ed!

In short: the final choice is DC's 100% (and we've told DC many times so), but in our (hubby and I) opinion, we'd both rank the final two as CMU vs Williams (prior to visit, it was CMU vs Rice, and Williams a long third behind).

In lieu of writing a book here of our visit, some quick highlights:
- campus is gorgeous, despite it SNOWED on Monday, multiple times
- One thing that stood out was that at Rice, the math building felt old and neglected, but at Williams, it is a new, world-class building/floor. It was clear Williams is throwing/investing money in their math department. This matters a lot.
- every student we spoke with had nothing but good things to say about Williams (where at most other schools, we'd hear both sides of the story from different kids), and really love everything they're doing at Williams
- of course: love all the support and focus on undergrads, and the school focuses on creating opportunities for the kids there

I now understand why Williams has such a reputation and following.

For DC, the decision is really up to him. It's absolutely NOT about which one is better than the other (because each school stands out in different ways), but more about whether he want a more intense environment (CMU) or more laid back (comparatively speaking) and higher quality of life environment at Williams.

I can write more but will stop here. Happy to answer any questions (esp other parents who may be considering Williams)!!!

[Anonymous]

snow is not normal this time of year. it's not just Williamstown. it was - and is - v cold in Boston this week. ridiculous

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP: hi everyone, we came back yesterday from Previews, and hubby and I are WOW'ed!

In short: the final choice is DC's 100% (and we've told DC many times so), but in our (hubby and I) opinion, we'd both rank the final two as CMU vs Williams (prior to visit, it was CMU vs Rice, and Williams a long third behind).

In lieu of writing a book here of our visit, some quick highlights:
- campus is gorgeous, despite it SNOWED on Monday, multiple times
- One thing that stood out was that at Rice, the math building felt old and neglected, but at Williams, it is a new, world-class building/floor. It was clear Williams is throwing/investing money in their math department. This matters a lot.
- every student we spoke with had nothing but good things to say about Williams (where at most other schools, we'd hear both sides of the story from different kids), and really love everything they're doing at Williams
- of course: love all the support and focus on undergrads, and the school focuses on creating opportunities for the kids there

I now understand why Williams has such a reputation and following.

For DC, the decision is really up to him. It's absolutely NOT about which one is better than the other (because each school stands out in different ways), but more about whether he want a more intense environment (CMU) or more laid back (comparatively speaking) and higher quality of life environment at Williams.

I can write more but will stop here. Happy to answer any questions (esp other parents who may be considering Williams)!!!

Two observations:
1) Condition of buildings (math building) at Williams v Rice, doesn't mean the math dept is better at Williams. It's probably not. It just could mean that Rice is investing more in salaries or professor comp (Houston is a much more expensive city to live in, and real estate/maintenance etc is more expensive too than Williamsburg, MA). Don't be dazzled by edifices alone.
2) Be wary if you only ever hear positive things from students and their answers are too polished. It is not authentic for young people to be able to come up with no cons or downsides, just pros. It also sets up your student for false expectations when they go if no current students have realistic convos with them in advance. It also signals to me that it's possible the students who speak on admitted student day are scripted.

Good luck OP!

[Anonymous]

we loved our visit to Williams. we saw a lot we hadn't seen on the regular tour - which is as it should be.

my son spoke to zero kids who were on panels, only students who were in classes with him. or friends of friends who are already there. since all classes were open, it would have been hard to script this. they seemed really happy to be there.

it's the only small school he's considering, but he said he's not going to run out of classes to take or things to learn at any of the schools on this list, which is true. I wish we didn't have to do this at the very last minute, but he'll make a decision and won't look back which is what matters.

I was worried about athlete divide, which I didn't really see. A lot of mixing. I did overhear some visitors who seemed to know each other from .. New York City privates, I'm guessing. I bet that's a thing. But .. eh, we're also coming from a private so how can I complain.

[Anonymous]

I was there too...OP is not exaggerating, its magical and the math department absolutely inspiring. The kids seem genuinely authentically happy there. Snow though omg

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP: hi everyone, we came back yesterday from Previews, and hubby and I are WOW'ed!

In short: the final choice is DC's 100% (and we've told DC many times so), but in our (hubby and I) opinion, we'd both rank the final two as CMU vs Williams (prior to visit, it was CMU vs Rice, and Williams a long third behind).

In lieu of writing a book here of our visit, some quick highlights:
- campus is gorgeous, despite it SNOWED on Monday, multiple times
- One thing that stood out was that at Rice, the math building felt old and neglected, but at Williams, it is a new, world-class building/floor. It was clear Williams is throwing/investing money in their math department. This matters a lot.
- every student we spoke with had nothing but good things to say about Williams (where at most other schools, we'd hear both sides of the story from different kids), and really love everything they're doing at Williams
- of course: love all the support and focus on undergrads, and the school focuses on creating opportunities for the kids there

I now understand why Williams has such a reputation and following.

For DC, the decision is really up to him. It's absolutely NOT about which one is better than the other (because each school stands out in different ways), but more about whether he want a more intense environment (CMU) or more laid back (comparatively speaking) and higher quality of life environment at Williams.

I can write more but will stop here. Happy to answer any questions (esp other parents who may be considering Williams)!!!

Two observations:
1) Condition of buildings (math building) at Williams v Rice, doesn't mean the math dept is better at Williams. It's probably not. It just could mean that Rice is investing more in salaries or professor comp (Houston is a much more expensive city to live in, and real estate/maintenance etc is more expensive too than Williamsburg, MA). Don't be dazzled by edifices alone.
2) Be wary if you only ever hear positive things from students and their answers are too polished. It is not authentic for young people to be able to come up with no cons or downsides, just pros. It also sets up your student for false expectations when they go if no current students have realistic convos with them in advance. It also signals to me that it's possible the students who speak on admitted student day are scripted.

Good luck OP!

This is spot on.

[Anonymous]

Snow in late April????

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Snow in late April????

OP: yes! very unusual weather on the east coast in general (80F last weekend, and 30F the last few days). Not the norm!