Have you ever maintained a relationship/friendship with someone...

[Anonymous]

No, I don't overlook things. A friend of mine liked to drink and drive, became a drug addict. I can't be friends with someone who put theirs children's lives in danger. Not to mention the innocent other drivers on the road. I do not support people like this.

[Anonymous]

I am good friends with a woman who is knowingly the "other woman" to a man who has been married with several kids for decades. She justifies her role in the affair because she didn't make any commitment to his wife, and they are having a lot of fun without anything heavy. I find this abhorrent but we have also been friends for a long time

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This question itself is folly because a lot of people say will they do one thing, then do another. Look at all the accounts of abortion providers saying that women who are out yelling “whore!” and “baby killer” at women going into the clinic, but the quietly get an appointment themselves.

Cognitive dissonance is real. Throw in Epstein’s money and blackmail and it makes it a lot harder to do the right thing.

I mean, yeah, lots of people are hypocrites. And people lie to themselves all the time. People are also really, really good at rationalizing their own behavior.

But it's still a worthwhile question, even though you won't always get honest answers. We're talking about some fundamental stuff, the kinds of questions Plato and Socrates explores. Kant spent his life trying to tease the nuance out of this specific question. It's worth thinking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am good friends with a woman who is knowingly the "other woman" to a man who has been married with several kids for decades. She justifies her role in the affair because she didn't make any commitment to his wife, and they are having a lot of fun without anything heavy. I find this abhorrent but we have also been friends for a long time

I would not be able to do this. Not just because it would ultimately completely destroy my perception of her, but because you even say "I find this abhorrent." It's like bad energy you are letting into your life by keeping this woman and her "abhorrent" behavior close to you.

I didn't use to be the kind of person who used phrases like "bad energy" but that's changed in the last few year. I have just become so much more aware of how the people and, for lack of a better word, *vibes* around me impact my mental health, even my physical health. A friend doing what your friend is doing, without remorse, and with my full knowledge, would feel like a little bundle of lies, negativity, and hurt in that corner of my life. I would kick it out.

[Anonymous]

Sometimes you've just known them since elementary school. The person you see spans decades.

[Anonymous]

I did for a while. She was a whore, then became a cheating whore. I stopped being friends with her when she became a lying, cheating whore and I was involuntarily used as a decoy/alibi for lying, cheating and whoring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have friendships with people who have cheated. I also have a friend who had a relationship with a married man.

I try not to reduce people to their worst decisions. I can acknowledge harm without pretending I’m morally superior or pretending I’ve never made mistakes. That said, if someone consistently shows a lack of integrity, that does affect how close I allow them to be.

Do you actually acknowledge the harm to the people your friends hurt though? Like your friends who cheated -- do you know their spouses? Do their spouses know they were cheated on? Did you hold your friends accountable in any way? Do you think if the people they hurt?

I'm not PP but my friend cheated on her husband. I know him, and have for almost 20 years. He's not a bad guy and I've never disliked him and I also don't think he deserved to be cheated on (I'm not saying anyone does, or I'm not saying that they don't, that isn't the point of this). I held my friend accountable by saying that I did not condone her behavior. Beyond that, we've been friends for 30 years and I'm not going to write her off because of what she did. I listened to what she had to say about it and while I don't agree with her decision, I'm also not going to sit in judgment of her or end our friendship over it. Could there be different facts with another friend that could lead me to a different conclusion? Possibly. Probably. But this is one my data point and in this case I have maintained my friendship with her for the last five years since it happened.

I had a friend who cheated on her husband and it did end our friendship. I felt it put me in a terrible position, because she'd bring her boyfriend as a date to things I invited her to, and expected me to cover for her with her husband if he asked. Maybe we would have stayed friends if she's kept her cheating contained within her own sphere and not made me a party to it the way she did. But I still think I would have distanced myself from her even in that scenario. Maybe we could have picked the friendship back up once she actually divorced her husband (which she did) and thus was no longer actively cheating. But I didn't want that in my life. To me it is similar to if a friend was using illegal drugs. I don't want to be around it. IME when people are willing to cross certain thresholds of decision making, they are more likely to cross others. I just don't live my life that way. I have a strong moral compass and I don't want to spend my time around people who are good at rationalizing harmful choices.

"IME when people are willing to cross certain thresholds of decision making, they are more likely to cross others. I just don't live my life that way. I have a strong moral compass and I don't want to spend my time around people who are good at rationalizing harmful choices."

I totally agree, very well said. If you have friends making choices like these you will be next in line.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am good friends with a woman who is knowingly the "other woman" to a man who has been married with several kids for decades. She justifies her role in the affair because she didn't make any commitment to his wife, and they are having a lot of fun without anything heavy. I find this abhorrent but we have also been friends for a long time

You're going to stay friends with her? How can you trust her not to f your husband?! Sorry not sorry I would not be friends with someone like that. They're selfish and heartless. Think of this mans kids too. She's a witch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am good friends with a woman who is knowingly the "other woman" to a man who has been married with several kids for decades. She justifies her role in the affair because she didn't make any commitment to his wife, and they are having a lot of fun without anything heavy. I find this abhorrent but we have also been friends for a long time

I would not be able to do this. Not just because it would ultimately completely destroy my perception of her, but because you even say "I find this abhorrent." It's like bad energy you are letting into your life by keeping this woman and her "abhorrent" behavior close to you.

I didn't use to be the kind of person who used phrases like "bad energy" but that's changed in the last few year. I have just become so much more aware of how the people and, for lack of a better word, *vibes* around me impact my mental health, even my physical health. A friend doing what your friend is doing, without remorse, and with my full knowledge, would feel like a little bundle of lies, negativity, and hurt in that corner of my life. I would kick it out.

I agree this situation brings negative crap/bad energy into your life, crap you didn't ask for and will still bring you down no matter what. Cut it loose. I guarantee you will feel better and not worse when you do. It will be freeing to be away from this imposed negative energy in your world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I did for a while. She was a whore, then became a cheating whore. I stopped being friends with her when she became a lying, cheating whore and I was involuntarily used as a decoy/alibi for lying, cheating and whoring.

Yup this is what happens. Cut if off at the jump.

[Anonymous]

I used to try not to judge people engaging in ethically questionable activity. But I learned the hard way if they do it to them, eventually they will do it to you. Better to befriend people whose ethics align with your own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am good friends with a woman who is knowingly the "other woman" to a man who has been married with several kids for decades. She justifies her role in the affair because she didn't make any commitment to his wife, and they are having a lot of fun without anything heavy. I find this abhorrent but we have also been friends for a long time

You're going to stay friends with her? How can you trust her not to f your husband?! Sorry not sorry I would not be friends with someone like that. They're selfish and heartless. Think of this mans kids too. She's a witch.

Because I trust my husband?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I did for a while. She was a whore, then became a cheating whore. I stopped being friends with her when she became a lying, cheating whore and I was involuntarily used as a decoy/alibi for lying, cheating and whoring.

Sounds like you are referencing my STBXW, I am sorry your friend put you in that position.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I used to try not to judge people engaging in ethically questionable activity. But I learned the hard way if they do it to them, eventually they will do it to you. Better to befriend people whose ethics align with your own.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:...who has done terrible things to other people?

It doesn't have to be Epstein-level crimes. Hopefully the number of people that evil are somewhat limited. Doesn't even have to be crimes. Maybe they cheat on their spouse, or are an abusive boss. Maybe they are cruel gossips. Anything that causes harm to other people.

Do you overlook behavior that harms others as long as the person isn't harming you?

Why?

Nope. Evil people hurt people because that's what evil people do. If you stick around, they'll ALWAYS get around to you eventually. I've seen it over and over again, and it's hard to feel sorry for the cronies who eventually become targets.

Nah, humanity isn't this black/white. It's way too easy, and intellectually lazy, to label people "evil". We've all got the capacity for evil, and we've all caused harm.

This. I grew up with judgmental parents, it was toxic. I met a woman at 30 who said she would disown any friend who cheated. I stopped talking to her. I wasn’t planning on cheating, and hadn’t, but I don’t need blanket judgements in gray world. Also, that harm isn’t the same as a politician saying racist shit, or a boss who is faithful but makes lewd comments with his friends and doesn’t promote women.

Tell me your spouse has not cheated on you without telling me your spouse has not cheated on you. The world is black and white, but you gray world is simply justifications and minimizations of what you know is wrong. You don’t have to condemn all people who do wrong, but justifying it doesn’t make it kind of good.