Am I screwing us over for financial aid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From most private schools, you will get ~25k/year "merit" scholarship. This is basically school's way of giving you a "discount". The problem is that even with 25k, you still have to pay a lot. Did you not save 529?

Ha not at the Ivies or to T10/20s. No merit aid there when everyone had those high stars/scores and too many are trying to get in.

That’s what “most” means. There are 4000+ colleges/universities in the US. T20 represents only (~0.5%).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you’re grinding for savings, your assets might screw you over even if your HHI didn’t.

OP here. Yes, that's what I meant. We're racking up cash to pay for college, but wondering in hindsight if we needed to work so hard to do that or should have maintained and looked for strong aid packages.

Look for merit aid instead of need based aid. All you have to do is go below the top 25.

+1 my kids were not straight A students, but had SATs above 700 in both sections. We did not apply for financial aid, but every private school out of the top 25 offered merit aid, even an ED school.

OP here. I didn't realize merit aid was as easy to come by as some posters are suggesting. That's good to know. One of our DCs is a very strong motivated student, with a heavy course load and all As. Did well on PSAT too. So I will hope that will give her options via merit!

Token discount

If the $10K-$40K merit my kids were offerred is a mere token to you, then this conversation is not for you.

I am sure that’s not what pp meant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you’re grinding for savings, your assets might screw you over even if your HHI didn’t.

OP here. Yes, that's what I meant. We're racking up cash to pay for college, but wondering in hindsight if we needed to work so hard to do that or should have maintained and looked for strong aid packages.

Look for merit aid instead of need based aid. All you have to do is go below the top 25.

+1 my kids were not straight A students, but had SATs above 700 in both sections. We did not apply for financial aid, but every private school out of the top 25 offered merit aid, even an ED school.

OP here. I didn't realize merit aid was as easy to come by as some posters are suggesting. That's good to know. One of our DCs is a very strong motivated student, with a heavy course load and all As. Did well on PSAT too. So I will hope that will give her options via merit!

Token discount

OP, merit aid is a possibility ONLY if you are willing to drop down in the rankings below what institution your kid could get into, full pay. Do you want a sub-standard slac? Then, sure, you can get into innumerable struggling slacs like Otterbein or Occidental College and get "merit" aid (a paper subtraction off the $93K ask). But if they want T-25, then no, you aren't going to get it unless you are URM or first-generation, and even that is now fading away. We weren't willing to sacrifice that for our kid so paid full freight at the Ivies and slacs he got into. That has been the trade-off in college admissions for about a decade. The top schools don't have to give merit aid so they don't. The lesser schools offer merit in exchange for a) top GPA; b) top test scores; c) minority status; d) other hooked aspect that they can report to USNWR. It's really that simple. And, no, you won't get anything from FAFSA. Start running the calculators on the colleges pages and look seriously at your in-state options and start reading more, There are tons of resources on financial aid .

The real truth is there is nothing "lesser" about the schools that give merit or th ekids who choose to go there, but people will pay a premium to feel like their kid is better than others. YMMD

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Take your old job now, put your assets in a grandparent's name. EZ.

Sell your soul dot the Devil. Easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ my kids were full pay at Ivies. Grad school was free

What type of grad school ?

If law school, then which law school ?

If med school, unless it was NYU, then which med school offers free tuition ?

If grad school in the humanities, then it is just delaying the inevitable struggle to find a job that will enable one to earn a decent income.

The ability to pay for grad school or for professional school gives one options that are not realistic for most.

ThIS. Grad school is “free” only in the humanities. Law school is now $121k a year (Harvard) and Business school is equally as expensive. Same for medical and dental. That’s why we went with UVA, banked the $45k a year difference, let it compound and now can start to pay for law school.

[Anonymous]

I think this is a silly question because you are viewing it as just a question of "how much financial aid can we qualify for" as thought that's the only metric here. That's not how it works. Other PP's are right that even at that lower income, you might not have qualified for aid. Your entire life can't revolve around financial aid decisions.

Rather, this choice is instead a holistic choice about the kind of family life you want, and what you value most. I faced a similar decision to you and chose to stay in my lower paid position. But I didn't do it in the hopes of getting more financial aid. In fact, I did it understanding that this may limit our kids somewhat in college choices. If they do well enough to get into the kind of college that offers generous aid, I do think we could find a way to work that out. But more likely they will go to state schools and we will make practical choices with an eye towards avoiding loans.

This is a sacrifice, yes, and there is another version of our life in which we have a much higher income and don't have to make any hard choices about college. But the trade off is that I would spend decades in a career I hate, spend less time with my kids, have a more chaotic and stressful home life where we have to outsource a lot more, and also operating in a higher SES category where there are always more and more expectations for things like vacations and clothes and activities. It's not what I wanted, it's not what my spouse wanted, it's not how we wanted to raise our kids.

Will they resent us later for not having more money for college? Maybe -- they are bright kids and definitely college bound and I hope they don't get their hearts set on schools that might be out of reach for us financially. But realistically, I don't think this is going to be that big of a deal. We have a great family dynamic with good relationships, my kids are practical people who seem to have absorbed our values of caring more about having time together as a family and an enjoyable lifestyle over a rat race mentality of more, more, more.

It's really not about financial aid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you’re grinding for savings, your assets might screw you over even if your HHI didn’t.

OP here. Yes, that's what I meant. We're racking up cash to pay for college, but wondering in hindsight if we needed to work so hard to do that or should have maintained and looked for strong aid packages.

Look for merit aid instead of need based aid. All you have to do is go below the top 25.

+1 my kids were not straight A students, but had SATs above 700 in both sections. We did not apply for financial aid, but every private school out of the top 25 offered merit aid, even an ED school.

OP here. I didn't realize merit aid was as easy to come by as some posters are suggesting. That's good to know. One of our DCs is a very strong motivated student, with a heavy course load and all As. Did well on PSAT too. So I will hope that will give her options via merit!

Token discount

OP, merit aid is a possibility ONLY if you are willing to drop down in the rankings below what institution your kid could get into, full pay. Do you want a sub-standard slac? Then, sure, you can get into innumerable struggling slacs like Otterbein or Occidental College and get "merit" aid (a paper subtraction off the $93K ask). But if they want T-25, then no, you aren't going to get it unless you are URM or first-generation, and even that is now fading away. We weren't willing to sacrifice that for our kid so paid full freight at the Ivies and slacs he got into. That has been the trade-off in college admissions for about a decade. The top schools don't have to give merit aid so they don't. The lesser schools offer merit in exchange for a) top GPA; b) top test scores; c) minority status; d) other hooked aspect that they can report to USNWR. It's really that simple. And, no, you won't get anything from FAFSA. Start running the calculators on the colleges pages and look seriously at your in-state options and start reading more, There are tons of resources on financial aid .

The real truth is there is nothing "lesser" about the schools that give merit [b]or th ekids who choose to go there, but people will pay a premium to feel like their kid is better than others. YMMD

They are most certainly “lesser” in the sense of USNWR rank, prestige, grad school placement, connections, job placement, alumni network, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why do I think this thread is one of those "I'm a lawyer, look at me, threads?" The answers are obvious if you spend 10 seconds googling. No you won't get FAFSA loans if you make $225K. Yes, there are NPCs. Yes, you should be using them. Yes, there is merit aid but at a price. Yes, in-state is a great option. Yes, you should be reading and educating yourself more instead of saying "look at me" on a mommy board.

OP here. I thought it was clear, but I'm not talking about FAFSA loans. I'm talking about getting aid from schools that claim they will provide up to the amount of any families' need. In some cases, this means providing full tuition if the family makes less than $150,000 or 200,000, but for families over that threshold, these schools claim they will make up any gap in ability to pay the very high amount for the 4 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you’re grinding for savings, your assets might screw you over even if your HHI didn’t.

OP here. Yes, that's what I meant. We're racking up cash to pay for college, but wondering in hindsight if we needed to work so hard to do that or should have maintained and looked for strong aid packages.

Look for merit aid instead of need based aid. All you have to do is go below the top 25.

+1 my kids were not straight A students, but had SATs above 700 in both sections. We did not apply for financial aid, but every private school out of the top 25 offered merit aid, even an ED school.

OP here. I didn't realize merit aid was as easy to come by as some posters are suggesting. That's good to know. One of our DCs is a very strong motivated student, with a heavy course load and all As. Did well on PSAT too. So I will hope that will give her options via merit!

Token discount

OP, merit aid is a possibility ONLY if you are willing to drop down in the rankings below what institution your kid could get into, full pay. Do you want a sub-standard slac? Then, sure, you can get into innumerable struggling slacs like Otterbein or Occidental College and get "merit" aid (a paper subtraction off the $93K ask). But if they want T-25, then no, you aren't going to get it unless you are URM or first-generation, and even that is now fading away. We weren't willing to sacrifice that for our kid so paid full freight at the Ivies and slacs he got into. That has been the trade-off in college admissions for about a decade. The top schools don't have to give merit aid so they don't. The lesser schools offer merit in exchange for a) top GPA; b) top test scores; c) minority status; d) other hooked aspect that they can report to USNWR. It's really that simple. And, no, you won't get anything from FAFSA. Start running the calculators on the colleges pages and look seriously at your in-state options and start reading more, There are tons of resources on financial aid .

The real truth is there is nothing "lesser" about the schools that give merit [b]or th ekids who choose to go there, but people will pay a premium to feel like their kid is better than others. YMMD

They are most certainly “lesser” in the sense of USNWR rank, prestige, grad school placement, connections, job placement, alumni network, etc.

Fake rank and "prestige" sure -- the rest? No. The first two are what you are paying that premium for. Job and grad school stats are published by every college, and every college has a n alumni network, obviously. As for connections, you either have them or you don't -- ask the unconnected Harvard kids.

I know someone will respond and say this or that NY employer ONLY hires from five prestigious schools. While that is untrue to begin with, it is also irrelevant to the 99.99% of people what have no interest in working there. This conversation is for those people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do I think this thread is one of those "I'm a lawyer, look at me, threads?" The answers are obvious if you spend 10 seconds googling. No you won't get FAFSA loans if you make $225K. Yes, there are NPCs. Yes, you should be using them. Yes, there is merit aid but at a price. Yes, in-state is a great option. Yes, you should be reading and educating yourself more instead of saying "look at me" on a mommy board.

OP here. I thought it was clear, but I'm not talking about FAFSA loans. I'm talking about getting aid from schools that claim they will provide up to the amount of any families' need. In some cases, this means providing full tuition if the family makes less than $150,000 or 200,000, but for families over that threshold, these schools claim they will make up any gap in ability to pay the very high amount for the 4 years.

DP: That is a tiny number of very hard to get into schools that reject over 90% of qualified applicants. Do not arrange your life chasing this unicorn.

[Anonymous]

I am a biglaw partner. My kid is going to school practically for free because of merit aid. We weren't counting on this, of course, but she worked hard and was interested in a particular program in a particular school and the school really wanted her.

What I am trying to say here is that unless you are dead set on an Ivy/T20/expensive LAC, you might not need need-based aid. And those of us in the know do know that biglaw is soul-sucking and not for everyone. So if you really want to quit, you should.

[Anonymous]

225k isn't going to get you much, if any, grant aid. Plenty of loan offers though. 225k would be roughly 50k fasfa. School then tack on another roughly 15k in loan offers...so roughly 65k expected on your side before need need grant would be offered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those who are currently in the middle of this (kids applying to colleges/ financial aid or with current college students), tell me your thoughts. DH is a gov employee (makes about $175,000), and I started out as a biglaw attorney but then significantly downshifted to a legal writing role for lower pay ($50,000) for many years while my kids were young. I've gone back to biglaw as college comes closer (first kid will go in 2 years) to rack up our savings. If we keep grinding, we could have enough to send both kids to any school they choose. However, I HATE my job, and it costs me quality time with my family. I've begun wondering if we'd stayed in a much lower income bracket ($225,000 combined income vs. $500,000+), if we may have qualified for aid at some of these more expensive private schools that are now offering essentially to give aid up to a family's demonstrated need. Am I wrong in second guessing? Is $225,000 still too much to actually garner any aid? If we'd gone that route, we would have had essentially no savings aside from $150,000 per kid in 529 accounts and our retirement savings. I'm just dreaming of my old job and the better balance it gave me with family and worrying I gave up that life for essentially no benefit.

It depends on your “other” assets. We have a HHI less than half of that $225K and received no financial aid.

+1 The "with typical assets" clause will render many families ineligible for aid. So the family earning $175 with $400K in savings isn't getting aid.

OP, run the NPC for any schools your kid is interested in. You can change the numbers for different scenarios to see if it would make a difference. That said, I think you should figure out whatever job situation makes the most sense for your family and let the FA chips fall where they may.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do I think this thread is one of those "I'm a lawyer, look at me, threads?" The answers are obvious if you spend 10 seconds googling. No you won't get FAFSA loans if you make $225K. Yes, there are NPCs. Yes, you should be using them. Yes, there is merit aid but at a price. Yes, in-state is a great option. Yes, you should be reading and educating yourself more instead of saying "look at me" on a mommy board.

OP here. I thought it was clear, but I'm not talking about FAFSA loans. I'm talking about getting aid from schools that claim they will provide up to the amount of any families' need. In some cases, this means providing full tuition if the family makes less than $150,000 or 200,000, but for families over that threshold, these schools claim they will make up any gap in ability to pay the very high amount for the 4 years.

Don’t worry about this. Be more worried that you hate your job.

We are going through applications now and have a pretty high HHI. Most of the NPC top out at around 100k so we didn’t bother filing the fafsa. It is completely random which schools are throwing merit money to being the cost way down. Our kids aren’t applying to those 90k+ schools. My senior has decent but not amazing grades and went TO.

Now, my sister and her family have a much lower HHI than us and still come up with no federal aid on any NPC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ my kids were full pay at Ivies. Grad school was free

What type of grad school ?

If law school, then which law school ?

If med school, unless it was NYU, then which med school offers free tuition ?

If grad school in the humanities, then it is just delaying the inevitable struggle to find a job that will enable one to earn a decent income.

The ability to pay for grad school or for professional school gives one options that are not realistic for most.

ThIS. Grad school is “free” only in the humanities. Law school is now $121k a year (Harvard) and Business school is equally as expensive. Same for medical and dental. That’s why we went with UVA, banked the $45k a year difference, let it compound and now can start to pay for law school.

Law schools are pretty generous with merit aid at T14 schools besides HYS.