Wash Lil Caps No Longer Moving to St James?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who at STJ is responsible for cutting the A teams? Please get rid of that person, immediately. Little Caps had over a ywar to secure things for their team. What a complete mess/failure.

STJ made room to save the only T1 program in VA which had its home rink shut down, no one should be blaming them for being willing to do this. They didn't have to do it and may well take a financial loss just for trying. They did it because it should have made obvious sense to both sides. The responsibility is on WLC if they end up playing in Haymarket, which is a glorified lumber yard, instead of finding a way to agree on terms with STJ.

St James wasn't helping anyone out - they were in the process of buying Little Caps so that they would have the only T1 program in VA. They used the fact they were scrambling for a last minute home to try and buy them out. This wasn't charity, this was attempting to buy an asset low but completely fumbling the sale and messing over your own T2 program while you did it.

Nonsense. The WLC to STJ conversation has been on again off again for several years. No one suddenly swooped in here. There has probably even been threads on here about it, lol. It is the only real viable and quality option and once Ion fell apart it was a a no brainer. WLC is a c3 non-profit and not some lucrative enterprise STJ was after, lol, as anyone with any understanding of this situation would know. WLC spoke very highly about the move to STJ when they announced it and why it was so great for them.

the envy and pettiness in this thread is palpable

Went on for years but never went through because Little Caps didn't like the terms. But then they were seemingly within an inch of their life, and the for-profit thought they could finally get their T1 program. If Little Caps spoke so highly of the move, why did they jump at the opportunity to exit the deal?

That they spoke highly of the deal is not something debatable, just go read their quotes about it:

"We are thrilled to share the exciting news that WLC is relocating to The St. James, a state-of-the-art sports and wellness facility uniquely designed to support athlete development.

This important change marks a significant milestone in the Club's history and sets the stage for an expanded, holistic development program for players in the DMV and across the country. The partnership between the Washington Little Capitals and The St. James will be built on a shared vision of creating one of the preeminent hockey development programs in our nation."

That doesn't exactly sound like they were dragged kicking and screaming.

And they didn't "jump at the opportunity to exit the deal", at least that is not what they have been telling their families, it is not a quick and simple process - it could work out, it could not. Maybe if the only thing you know about something is a rumor just don't share it or at least understand it has very little value.

Have you never seen a press release before? You think they are going to tell their paying customers their real thoughts?

[Anonymous]

Have you never seen a press release before? You think they are going to tell their paying customers their real thoughts?

1. It wasn't from a press release but a SM post. 2. Yeah, I understand how this works, and anyone with a sense for how business works knows deliberately lying to your paying customers isn't a bright strategy either.

I get that there are lots of people here from competing T2 programs that don't want say anything nice about STJ or from the other T1 program that competes with WLC for players or even parents whose kids have been cut by one or both of those teams who have an axe to grind. But if people were honest with themselves and were thinking about what is best for WLC and for hockey in the area this is the easiest call of all time. STJ is an outstanding facility and is centrally located in the NOVA population. It puts everyone from Leesburg to Waldorf to Dale City within a comparable drive. No other location comes close to offering that. It is right at the highway juncture with access to express lanes in multiple directions. Making the top program more geographically accessible **to everyone** will make hockey stronger at every level because the kids that deserve to be there most but couldn't access it will now make the top teams and the kids that end up getting cut will be the top players on the T2 teams and so on. Now I get if maybe your kid is a bubble player this might be intimidating but people can't complain about the quality of AAA hockey here in the DC area AND not want to see it improve. This is a huge decision for WLC, STJ and PVAHA and it will shape the future of the program and youth hockey in this area for years. Any move of a program will be tough in the beginning but if decision makers are thinking about growth and success over the long term, not just for WLC but for hockey in the whole area, this is a slam dunk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh good, so 1 sheet of ice and a building the owners will continue to neglect. Great image for a Tier 1 program

From the figure skating rumor mill @ Ion. The owners are negotiating a sale to some sports group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I talked to an Ion coach who said Little Caps would be back for a 1 year extension.

Ion is still scheduled to shut down May 1st which is why they’ve already melted 1 sheet of ice. Also, investors filed a lawsuit because the owners have failed to make payments on a loan they took out in 2023 so things are going to get even messier.

Melted a sheet of ice? Have you physically been there lately? No ice has been melted, both sheets of ice are still currently in use.

I was there yesterday, one sheet of ice....practice rink is melted....tryouts are in the arena. Someone told me that owners are negotiating a sale of the rink (buyer unknown, but a large sports investor).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I talked to an Ion coach who said Little Caps would be back for a 1 year extension.

Ion is still scheduled to shut down May 1st which is why they’ve already melted 1 sheet of ice. Also, investors filed a lawsuit because the owners have failed to make payments on a loan they took out in 2023 so things are going to get even messier.

Melted a sheet of ice? Have you physically been there lately? No ice has been melted, both sheets of ice are still currently in use.

I was there as recently as late last week and physically saw the practice rink entirely melted. It was a lake. All the power to that side was off too. I get it, why spend that money when you are shutting down and massively in debt to begin with. Maybe they froze it back up but the people running that place are not the type to spend a penny unless they absolutely have to.

Tryouts were yesterday, today and tomorrow on 1 sheet and the other sheet is being used by freestyle skaters. I can tell by the lines that the ice was never melted as it looks exactly the same as it always has.

[Anonymous]

What did tryout numbers look like?

Has the St. James made any public announcements? Any word on whether they continue with a scaled back travel program?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I talked to an Ion coach who said Little Caps would be back for a 1 year extension.

Ion is still scheduled to shut down May 1st which is why they’ve already melted 1 sheet of ice. Also, investors filed a lawsuit because the owners have failed to make payments on a loan they took out in 2023 so things are going to get even messier.

Melted a sheet of ice? Have you physically been there lately? No ice has been melted, both sheets of ice are still currently in use.

I was there yesterday, one sheet of ice....practice rink is melted....tryouts are in the arena. Someone told me that owners are negotiating a sale of the rink (buyer unknown, but a large sports investor).

Yup, the ice is melted and the power isn't functioning properly on one side. Rumors about a sale have been around for a couple years too. It never materialized because people with that kind of money don't end up with that kind of money by making the kind of terrible investment decisions this would be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What did tryout numbers look like?

Has the St. James made any public announcements? Any word on whether they continue with a scaled back travel program?

Same as usual. About 30 kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What did tryout numbers look like?

Has the St. James made any public announcements? Any word on whether they continue with a scaled back travel program?

They still have Little Caps on their website. Don't know if that is because they haven't gotten around to it or they still think it's likely a go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Have you never seen a press release before? You think they are going to tell their paying customers their real thoughts?

1. It wasn't from a press release but a SM post. 2. Yeah, I understand how this works, and anyone with a sense for how business works knows deliberately lying to your paying customers isn't a bright strategy either.

I get that there are lots of people here from competing T2 programs that don't want say anything nice about STJ or from the other T1 program that competes with WLC for players or even parents whose kids have been cut by one or both of those teams who have an axe to grind. But if people were honest with themselves and were thinking about what is best for WLC and for hockey in the area this is the easiest call of all time. STJ is an outstanding facility and is centrally located in the NOVA population. It puts everyone from Leesburg to Waldorf to Dale City within a comparable drive. No other location comes close to offering that. It is right at the highway juncture with access to express lanes in multiple directions. Making the top program more geographically accessible **to everyone** will make hockey stronger at every level because the kids that deserve to be there most but couldn't access it will now make the top teams and the kids that end up getting cut will be the top players on the T2 teams and so on. Now I get if maybe your kid is a bubble player this might be intimidating but people can't complain about the quality of AAA hockey here in the DC area AND not want to see it improve. This is a huge decision for WLC, STJ and PVAHA and it will shape the future of the program and youth hockey in this area for years. Any move of a program will be tough in the beginning but if decision makers are thinking about growth and success over the long term, not just for WLC but for hockey in the whole area, this is a slam dunk.

There are downsides - we saw in the recent WLC peewee tryouts the influence SJ had over team selections. Not sure the central location will override the future bias towards SJ players.

[Anonymous]

One sheet of ice was definitely melted. We’ve been weekly for Tier 1 training now there this week for try outs. 1 sheet of ice.

They are talking about refreezing that sheet in hopes of some undisclosed sports group buying it. But who knows what will happen with the current owners and their history of mismanagement and broken promises

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Have you never seen a press release before? You think they are going to tell their paying customers their real thoughts?

1. It wasn't from a press release but a SM post. 2. Yeah, I understand how this works, and anyone with a sense for how business works knows deliberately lying to your paying customers isn't a bright strategy either.

I get that there are lots of people here from competing T2 programs that don't want say anything nice about STJ or from the other T1 program that competes with WLC for players or even parents whose kids have been cut by one or both of those teams who have an axe to grind. But if people were honest with themselves and were thinking about what is best for WLC and for hockey in the area this is the easiest call of all time. STJ is an outstanding facility and is centrally located in the NOVA population. It puts everyone from Leesburg to Waldorf to Dale City within a comparable drive. No other location comes close to offering that. It is right at the highway juncture with access to express lanes in multiple directions. Making the top program more geographically accessible **to everyone** will make hockey stronger at every level because the kids that deserve to be there most but couldn't access it will now make the top teams and the kids that end up getting cut will be the top players on the T2 teams and so on. Now I get if maybe your kid is a bubble player this might be intimidating but people can't complain about the quality of AAA hockey here in the DC area AND not want to see it improve. This is a huge decision for WLC, STJ and PVAHA and it will shape the future of the program and youth hockey in this area for years. Any move of a program will be tough in the beginning but if decision makers are thinking about growth and success over the long term, not just for WLC but for hockey in the whole area, this is a slam dunk.

There are downsides - we saw in the recent WLC peewee tryouts the influence SJ had over team selections. Not sure the central location will override the future bias towards SJ players.

Any time more than one program is under the same roof some people will think there is an inside track. The kids at Loudoun Knights didn't have an inside track to WLC but their kids were the easiest for WLC to scout because the coaches were in the same building and sometimes sharing ice. That will happen anywhere. Still all programs have a financial interest in producing the most competitive teams at each level, otherwise why would anyone pay more for the higher level of competition. The best way to do this is to make the programs more accessible to more people. More kids to pick from = Stronger teams. This isn't Minnesota or Massachusetts, hockey has grown here but it doesn't have that kind of depth of talent, which is all the more reason why the T1 program should not be located far from a large chunk of the population.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Have you never seen a press release before? You think they are going to tell their paying customers their real thoughts?

1. It wasn't from a press release but a SM post. 2. Yeah, I understand how this works, and anyone with a sense for how business works knows deliberately lying to your paying customers isn't a bright strategy either.

I get that there are lots of people here from competing T2 programs that don't want say anything nice about STJ or from the other T1 program that competes with WLC for players or even parents whose kids have been cut by one or both of those teams who have an axe to grind. But if people were honest with themselves and were thinking about what is best for WLC and for hockey in the area this is the easiest call of all time. STJ is an outstanding facility and is centrally located in the NOVA population. It puts everyone from Leesburg to Waldorf to Dale City within a comparable drive. No other location comes close to offering that. It is right at the highway juncture with access to express lanes in multiple directions. Making the top program more geographically accessible **to everyone** will make hockey stronger at every level because the kids that deserve to be there most but couldn't access it will now make the top teams and the kids that end up getting cut will be the top players on the T2 teams and so on. Now I get if maybe your kid is a bubble player this might be intimidating but people can't complain about the quality of AAA hockey here in the DC area AND not want to see it improve. This is a huge decision for WLC, STJ and PVAHA and it will shape the future of the program and youth hockey in this area for years. Any move of a program will be tough in the beginning but if decision makers are thinking about growth and success over the long term, not just for WLC but for hockey in the whole area, this is a slam dunk.

There are downsides - we saw in the recent WLC peewee tryouts the influence SJ had over team selections. Not sure the central location will override the future bias towards SJ players.

Any time more than one program is under the same roof some people will think there is an inside track. The kids at Loudoun Knights didn't have an inside track to WLC but their kids were the easiest for WLC to scout because the coaches were in the same building and sometimes sharing ice. That will happen anywhere. Still all programs have a financial interest in producing the most competitive teams at each level, otherwise why would anyone pay more for the higher level of competition. The best way to do this is to make the programs more accessible to more people. More kids to pick from = Stronger teams. This isn't Minnesota or Massachusetts, hockey has grown here but it doesn't have that kind of depth of talent, which is all the more reason why the T1 program should not be located far from a large chunk of the population.


I agree in theory you'd think they would want their teams to be as strong as possible, but as an observer for many years now, I would say that clearly there are often other things besides talent that influence decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I agree in theory you'd think they would want their teams to be as strong as possible, but as an observer for many years now, I would say that clearly there are often other things besides talent that influence decisions.

But where is that not a thing? That is just youth sports in every sport and in every part of the country. There are always going to be questions about this bubble kid or that, why they really made it over someone else, etc. It happens in every program in this area and at every level. At the end of the day though you cant get away with too much of that because you have to put together competitive teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I agree in theory you'd think they would want their teams to be as strong as possible, but as an observer for many years now, I would say that clearly there are often other things besides talent that influence decisions.

But where is that not a thing? That is just youth sports in every sport and in every part of the country. There are always going to be questions about this bubble kid or that, why they really made it over someone else, etc. It happens in every program in this area and at every level. At the end of the day though you cant get away with too much of that because you have to put together competitive teams.

Ok, then I guess it's just fine then.