Looks like the md AG is going after every Moco gun store

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

"The Maryland Attorney General's Office joined a lawsuit against three Maryland gun shops that sold dozens of firearms to a man who trafficked them in and around Washington, D.C.

Several of the guns were recovered at crime scenes or with suspects wanted on warrants for violent crimes, Washington, D.C. Attorney General Brian Schwalb said at a press conference on Tuesday.

This lengthy lawsuit by the Maryland and D.C. attorneys general, as well as Everytown Law, accuses Engage Armament, LLC, United Gun Shop and Atlantic Guns, Inc. of ignoring clear signs of illegal gun sales. The lawsuit claims the purchases happened in Montgomery County, but led to gun violence across the area."

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

The fact that none of the stores were charged criminally is a good indicator that none of them violated any state or federal laws.

Indictments are generally easily for prosecutors to get. The Grand Jury process is heavily weighted in favor of the state. If there was even a possibility of a viable criminal charge coming from the actions of the stores, these AG’s would’ve put it in front of a Grand Jury, and gotten an indictment for applicable criminal charges.

But they didn’t even attempt to go that route.

If the civil court system is not about laws and violating laws, what do we even have it for?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

The fact that none of the stores were charged criminally is a good indicator that none of them violated any state or federal laws.

Indictments are generally easily for prosecutors to get. The Grand Jury process is heavily weighted in favor of the state. If there was even a possibility of a viable criminal charge coming from the actions of the stores, these AG’s would’ve put it in front of a Grand Jury, and gotten an indictment for applicable criminal charges.

But they didn’t even attempt to go that route.

If the civil court system is not about laws and violating laws, what do we even have it for?

Criminal violations are not the purview of the civil court system.

The verdicts of criminal courts may factor into civil proceedings, but civil courts are not for the prosecution of crimes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

"The Maryland Attorney General's Office joined a lawsuit against three Maryland gun shops that sold dozens of firearms to a man who trafficked them in and around Washington, D.C.

Several of the guns were recovered at crime scenes or with suspects wanted on warrants for violent crimes, Washington, D.C. Attorney General Brian Schwalb said at a press conference on Tuesday.

This lengthy lawsuit by the Maryland and D.C. attorneys general, as well as Everytown Law, accuses Engage Armament, LLC, United Gun Shop and Atlantic Guns, Inc. of ignoring clear signs of illegal gun sales. The lawsuit claims the purchases happened in Montgomery County, but led to gun violence across the area."

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

So what are the “clear signs of illegal gun sales”?

Does that mean “a young black man with plenty of money buying lots of guns”?

Yeah, let’s see what happens when a retailer of any kind starts refusing to serve customers because they’re young black men. Let’s see how THAT goes over here on DCUM. The same people blaming the store for selling the guns would be screeching and hissing about racism if the stores had refused to sell to them.

Totally impossible situation for them to be in. Screwed either way, by the same people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

The fact that none of the stores were charged criminally is a good indicator that none of them violated any state or federal laws.

Indictments are generally easily for prosecutors to get. The Grand Jury process is heavily weighted in favor of the state. If there was even a possibility of a viable criminal charge coming from the actions of the stores, these AG’s would’ve put it in front of a Grand Jury, and gotten an indictment for applicable criminal charges.

But they didn’t even attempt to go that route.

If the civil court system is not about laws and violating laws, what do we even have it for?

Criminal violations are not the purview of the civil court system.

The verdicts of criminal courts may factor into civil proceedings, but civil courts are not for the prosecution of crimes.

You're moving the goalposts. All criminal offenses are violations of the law, but not all violations of the law are criminal offenses. It is possible to violate the law without committing a criminal offense. The basis of the civil lawsuit is that the gun stores violated the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

"The Maryland Attorney General's Office joined a lawsuit against three Maryland gun shops that sold dozens of firearms to a man who trafficked them in and around Washington, D.C.

Several of the guns were recovered at crime scenes or with suspects wanted on warrants for violent crimes, Washington, D.C. Attorney General Brian Schwalb said at a press conference on Tuesday.

This lengthy lawsuit by the Maryland and D.C. attorneys general, as well as Everytown Law, accuses Engage Armament, LLC, United Gun Shop and Atlantic Guns, Inc. of ignoring clear signs of illegal gun sales. The lawsuit claims the purchases happened in Montgomery County, but led to gun violence across the area."

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

So what are the “clear signs of illegal gun sales”?

Does that mean “a young black man with plenty of money buying lots of guns”?

Yeah, let’s see what happens when a retailer of any kind starts refusing to serve customers because they’re young black men. Let’s see how THAT goes over here on DCUM. The same people blaming the store for selling the guns would be screeching and hissing about racism if the stores had refused to sell to them.

Totally impossible situation for them to be in. Screwed either way, by the same people.

The three gun shops allegedly participated in what's known as straw selling, which is when a shop sells a firearm to a customer who is buying it for another person, who is likely not allowed to own a gun.

"Those transactions are illegal and gun shop owners have a responsibility to enforce the law," Brown said.

The stores are in Rockville and are federally licensed. Over seven months in 2021, the stores sold 34 semiautomatic pistols to Demetrius Minor who sold them to others. Minor was sentenced to 18 months in federal prison for dealing firearms without a license.

According to the lawsuit, Minor was buying the guns for Donald Willis, who was living in Washington, D.C. with a record of violent felonies, which would prohibit him from purchasing his gun.

The lawsuit says there is no "plausible lawful explanation" for why Minor purchased that many firearms in such a short period. The attorneys general spoke outside of the federal court building in D.C. on Tuesday, saying that these gun shops prioritize profits over the law.

"It doesn't take a lot of common sense to figure out that someone trying to repeatedly buy the same semi-automatic handgun over a short period of time is a straw purchaser," Schwalb said.
Guns found at crime scenes

At least nine of the weapons purchased by Minor were found at crime scenes in Maryland and D.C, according to the lawsuit.

According to court documents, only 5.2% of guns recovered at crime scenes were possessed by the person who purchased the gun from a licensed dealer. The lawsuit also says 95% of firearms recovered in D.C. were originally purchased outside of the district.

"These are the illegal guns that are fueling the deadly, horrific gun violence that has wreaked havoc on so many of our neighbors and so many of our neighborhoods," Schwalb said.
Gun shops accused of negligence

The lawsuit, filed in Montgomery County Circuit Court, accuses the three stores of negligence and public nuisance.

This joint lawsuit by two attorneys general is the first of its kind, according to Everytown Law.

"This is the first time that two neighboring attorney generals have come together to bring a case like this, and we know how important that is, because gun trafficking does not stop at state lines," said Eric Tirschwell, chief litigation counsel for Everytown Law.

The lawsuit is asking for monetary and punitive damages, which can include restrictions on the stores or a complete shutdown of the facility.

The ATF has the final say if a store loses its federal license to sell firearms.

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

[Anonymous]

Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

"The Maryland Attorney General's Office joined a lawsuit against three Maryland gun shops that sold dozens of firearms to a man who trafficked them in and around Washington, D.C.

Several of the guns were recovered at crime scenes or with suspects wanted on warrants for violent crimes, Washington, D.C. Attorney General Brian Schwalb said at a press conference on Tuesday.

This lengthy lawsuit by the Maryland and D.C. attorneys general, as well as Everytown Law, accuses Engage Armament, LLC, United Gun Shop and Atlantic Guns, Inc. of ignoring clear signs of illegal gun sales. The lawsuit claims the purchases happened in Montgomery County, but led to gun violence across the area."

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

Seems like a good initiative to me and proactive in trying to address the root enablers of crime. I can't understand the posts on these threads, but don't often meet people complaining about protecting the rights of people trying to buy guns in bulk to sell off to other people who can't buy them legally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

It does. You just don't like the answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

It does. You just don't like the answer.

+1 Sorry you find a prosecutor going after shady people distasteful. Don't complain to us about criminal activity in your area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused. Were they following the law and if so, why are they getting charged? Or does the states attorney not like how the law was followed?

"The Maryland Attorney General's Office joined a lawsuit against three Maryland gun shops that sold dozens of firearms to a man who trafficked them in and around Washington, D.C.

Several of the guns were recovered at crime scenes or with suspects wanted on warrants for violent crimes, Washington, D.C. Attorney General Brian Schwalb said at a press conference on Tuesday.

This lengthy lawsuit by the Maryland and D.C. attorneys general, as well as Everytown Law, accuses Engage Armament, LLC, United Gun Shop and Atlantic Guns, Inc. of ignoring clear signs of illegal gun sales. The lawsuit claims the purchases happened in Montgomery County, but led to gun violence across the area."

https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/maryland-gun-stores-sued-for-facilitating-illegal-gun-trafficking-in-the-dmv/

Seems like a good initiative to me and proactive in trying to address the root enablers of crime. I can't understand the posts on these threads, but don't often meet people complaining about protecting the rights of people trying to buy guns in bulk to sell off to other people who can't buy them legally.

Literally *no one* here in this thread is advocating for people to straw purchase dozens of guns and then sell them illegally to people who cannot purchase a gun legally themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

It does. You just don't like the answer.

Sorry, but it doesn’t. You failed (chose not to, rather) to answer my very simple question, which I will put to you again:

Are the stores supposed to refuse to sell guns to young black men because they might be a straw buyer? Do you think that’s a wise decision?


That’s the question you chose not to answer. So please, if you would - answer it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

It does. You just don't like the answer.

Sorry, but it doesn’t. You failed (chose not to, rather) to answer my very simple question, which I will put to you again:

Are the stores supposed to refuse to sell guns to young black men because they might be a straw buyer? Do you think that’s a wise decision?


That’s the question you chose not to answer. So please, if you would - answer it?

There's no point in answering a question that has a false premise.

[Anonymous]

^^^actually multiple false premises

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reposting a press release doesn’t address the question.

It does. You just don't like the answer.

+1 Sorry you find a prosecutor going after shady people distasteful. Don't complain to us about criminal activity in your area.

The only shady person here is the criminal straw buyer - who NO ONE here seems to have any interest in whatsoever.

The three shops are victimized parties, being pursued by politically motivated state politicians, despite being in compliance with all state and federal laws.