Looks like the md AG is going after every Moco gun store

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

DP. I just returned from a pharmacy that's 8 miles away, because none of the closest pharmacies have the medication in stock that my child needs. So if you're looking for sympathy that it will now potentially be less convenient for you to buy the guns you collect for fun? You won't get it from me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

DP. I just returned from a pharmacy that's 8 miles away, because none of the closest pharmacies have the medication in stock that my child needs. So if you're looking for sympathy that it will now potentially be less convenient for you to buy the guns you collect for fun? You won't get it from me.

DP

Then perhaps the three closest ones that do have whatever the medication you need should be sued closed. Won’t hurt you to drive an extra hour each way. It builds humility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You should love gun elimination because it will drive up the value of your investments.

Then they’re not really an investment if they can’t be bought or sold, are they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

That is really, really, really not how the law works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

That is really, really, really not how the law works.

Yes it is. You don’t need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone actually broke a law in a civil suit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well they didn't go after the ones (two, I think, TK Defense in Gaithersburg and Optimal Zero in Rockville) that didn't repeatedly sell to a gun trafficker.

how do they know it’s a trafficker and why did the Feds approve the background check?

The only way to stop this is to stop selling to minorities.

And then Anthony Brown will sue the store for discrimination.

Seriously, it’s an impossible situation the FFL finds themselves in:

They have a repeat purchaser, who they probably suspect is a straw purchaser - but they have no proof of it. He has no criminal record, so he passes the federal and state background checks with no problem, and he signs a legal document each purchase that states he’s not engaging in a straw purchase.


What is the store supposed to do in that case? Seriously - what?

If they call the FBI, the FBI will tell them “he has no criminal record, he passed every NICS check we run”. If they call the Maryland State Police, they’ll say “he passed our state background and mental health checks, and has no criminal record”.


What is the shop supposed to do at that point? Decide not to tell to him because he’s black?

How would THAT go over here in DCUM-world? Seriously - what would all you folks with your yard signs think of that? You’d be calling the store racist and demanding it be shut down.

Sorta like you’re demanding it be shut down now.

It’s interesting with y’all. No matter what the problem is, the answer is always the same for you - shut the store down. How convenient, huh?

NP here:
I completely agree that its potentially a catch-22 for the FFL seller. The ATF is not allowed to analyze purchase history prior to gaining probably cause. Dealers are not allowed to see a buyers' history with other dealers. Maybe we should change the law to allow ATF and dealers to spot patterns?

That said, the defendant in the case - Demetrious Minor - purchased 25 handguns in 5 months from Engage Armaments in Rockvillle. He purchased 5 handguns over the span of a few weeks from United Gun Shop in Rockville. And then 4 handguns in 1 month from Atlantic Guns in Rockville.

This is clear straw buying behavior. Dealers are required by law to report suspicious activity, even if he has a clean background check. This guy kept buying the same handguns multiple times from individual shops in a short period of time. He wasn't a collector, buying a variety of weaponry which would give the dealer some degree of plausible deniability. He kept buying 9mm handguns over and over again.

Nothing about race in this instance. If someone is truly a collector, they are buying a variety of firearms.

Who is to say though? There are more firearms in the nation than humans, and it's like alcohol. A few people are responsible for most purchases.

I hate guns. But I don't see how these gun shops would have known - other than relying on implicit or explicit bias because of the purchaser's race. Is that what Maryland is trying to reinforce?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Easy solution.

Every gun owner should be subject to periodic inspection to ensure they still have control of the guns they purchased.

Okay if you think suspending the 4th amendment is okay doesn’t your right to privacy get impacted too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

That is really, really, really not how the law works.

Yes it is. You don’t need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone actually broke a law in a civil suit.

how do you prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the gun stores knew the buyer was breaking laws if the background check people didn’t know and kept approving the purchases?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

That is really, really, really not how the law works.

Yes it is. You don’t need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone actually broke a law in a civil suit.

how do you prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the gun stores knew the buyer was breaking laws if the background check people didn’t know and kept approving the purchases?

Seems like the background check authorities are at fault.

[Anonymous]

I just don't understand why they don't microchip guns. They should require periodic scanning of the microchip by the purchaser to prove that the buyer is still in possession of the gun. It'd make it much harder for straw purchases.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don't understand why they don't microchip guns. They should require periodic scanning of the microchip by the purchaser to prove that the buyer is still in possession of the gun. It'd make it much harder for straw purchases.

There are clearly about a million things we could do to better regulate guns in the US, but we will do none of them because gun nuts are in fact nuts and insist on no further regulation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know how many times these gun shops been broken into and guns stolen. They need to close them all down.

So where do I - a non criminal - buy my guns after you’ve shut down the shops because your police won’t control criminals?

I mean, as long as we’re eliminating each other’s rights, can we also close polling places because I don’t like the outcome of local elections? You’re cool with that in exchange for closing gun stores, right? Tit for tat, and all….

How many guns does a non-criminal like you need?

I collect guns. Just like some people collect stamps or beanie babies or pointless Masters degrees. I enjoy it.

The guns I choose to collect are already expensive, and get more expensive each year, so it’s also a stable asset that continually appreciates.

But in order to purchase them, they MUST be purchased through an FFL. But you want to shut down FFL’s.

So where does that leave me?

You register as a collector.

I already AM a designated collector with the state of Maryland.

That just means I can purchase multiple guns at time, rather than the current one-per-month that most Maryland residents are limited to. I registered as a designated collector because I frequently acquire multiple guns estate sales, where keeping a specific lot of guns together as part of their own collection is vital to maintaining the collective value of them as a set.


But even as a collector, I still need to go through a dealer to transfer them to me. If there are no gun dealers left because they’ve all been sued by a punitive AG, that’s a serious problem. Not just for me as a collector, but for ANY person who wants to acquire a gun legally and above board.

If you close gun dealers, you will basically force all gun transactions underground. Is that really the solution you want? Because then there’s no records, no background checks, no waiting periods, nothing. I don’t we’d be better served in that world that some of you seem to want to create by shutting down gun stores.

The AG sued 3 gun dealers in Rockville for obvious straw buying.

According to this website for FFLs, there's over 2000 federal dealers in Maryland: https://www.ffl123.com/ffl-dealers-per-state-by-population/

Stop shouting, chicken little. You still have 2000+ dealers to choose from in MD. No lack of options.

There are ~2,000 FFL holders in Maryland - that’s ALL types of FFL’s, of which there are many. Only a tiny fraction of that number are retail gun sales locations, however.


There are FFL’s required for:

Gun sales (like stores, obviously)

but also:

Gun repair/refinishing
Manufacturing
Collection of Curio and Relic guns
Explosive manufacturing
Destructive Device manufacturing
Ammunition manufacturing
Fireworks manufacturing
Fireworks sales
Fireworks distribution


So there might be over 2,000 FFL’s in Maryland, yes. But probably less than 200 are retail sales locations that sell guns to the public. The rest are industrial FFL’s held by businesses that work in areas requiring a FFL.

Lockheed Martin in Bethesda, for example, holds at least 6 different FFL’s at its facility in Bethesda. But NOT because they sell guns.

You should educate yourself about stuff like this, then you wouldn’t look so laughably uninformed and foolish when you blather things like “you still have 2,000 dealers to choose from chicken little”.

So you're hyperventilating about 3 shops that arguably were not following the law when you - self admittedly - have 200+ other retail locations to choose from?

Chill.

Those three dealers being unfairly targeted by the AG in this frivolous suit are the three closest ones to my home. I’m a regular customer at all three of them.

Your flippancy puzzles me.

What if the AG decided to sue your closest three pharmacies because people with illegally obtained prescriptions were buying narcotic drugs there and reselling them to kids? No big deal, right? You can just drive another 20 minutes to find another pharmacy, right?

Every comment makes you look nuttier.

The only thing nutty here is the politically motivated litigiousness of a state employee with aspirations of higher office.

These three stores violated no laws. They committed no crime. Had they, they would be in criminal court, not civil. But that they ARE in civil court is proof positive they broke no laws.

Still, I don’t think the there’s much chance Brown will even be able to reach the preponderance of evidence threshold. But that doesn’t matter - the whole point is to bankrupt stores with legal fees. To use lawfare paid for by the taxpayers to drive a legally operatng store out of business.



I don’t think my posts sound nutty - but your smarmy one-line retorts bely your having nothing substantive to say. So you resort to personal attacks.

That is really, really, really not how the law works.

Yes it is. You don’t need to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that someone actually broke a law in a civil suit.

how do you prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the gun stores knew the buyer was breaking laws if the background check people didn’t know and kept approving the purchases?

Seems like the background check authorities are at fault.

Yes, this should be explored. I worked for the State for 20 years and their data systems are so behind. I would not be surprised if a lack of funding has delayed or completely blocked better automated flagging capabilities in their systems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don't understand why they don't microchip guns. They should require periodic scanning of the microchip by the purchaser to prove that the buyer is still in possession of the gun. It'd make it much harder for straw purchases.

It would be easier and simpler to just chip the "teens" instead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don't understand why they don't microchip guns. They should require periodic scanning of the microchip by the purchaser to prove that the buyer is still in possession of the gun. It'd make it much harder for straw purchases.

There are clearly about a million things we could do to better regulate guns in the US, but we will do none of them because gun nuts are in fact nuts and insist on no further regulation.

And the vitriol oozing out of the last part of your last sentence is why otherwise reasonable and logical people who would otherwise be willing to work for solutions, instead shut down, dig their heels in, and fight ANY measure you might suggest. They KNOW you hate them. Therefore, they’re not going to listen to you, and will fight you at every turn. This is their hill. They will fight for it. We don’t have effective gun safety because of people like you. This is YOUR fault.