MCPS elementary, middle school students could get less homework under proposed policy update - How is this OK?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes homework is important and the quality of homework is important. It's about starting early and slowly building up their self study skills. What's going to happen to all these kids when they're in HS and have 2-4 hours of homework? Or in college when most of their work and study is outside of the classroom?

If MCPS adopts less homework policy, this won't be a problem in HS at least. College may not be so good though...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes homework is important and the quality of homework is important. It's about starting early and slowly building up their self study skills. What's going to happen to all these kids when they're in HS and have 2-4 hours of homework? Or in college when most of their work and study is outside of the classroom?

If MCPS adopts less homework policy, this won't be a problem in HS at least. College may not be so good though...

The proposed policy is only until 8th grade. So HS-ers are in for a major shock of being unprepared, especially those entering magnet programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes homework is important and the quality of homework is important. It's about starting early and slowly building up their self study skills. What's going to happen to all these kids when they're in HS and have 2-4 hours of homework? Or in college when most of their work and study is outside of the classroom?

If MCPS adopts less homework policy, this won't be a problem in HS at least. College may not be so good though...

The proposed policy is only until 8th grade. So HS-ers are in for a major shock of being unprepared, especially those entering magnet programs.

HS level classes in MS like Honors Geo or Honors Spanish 3 will give them a chance to get used to it...

[Anonymous]

Homework is already "graded for completion" rather than for content in ES, so this doesn't feel like a huge shift.

However, I think this is the wrong direction. The MCPS approach seems to be that homework is too hard for some kids to complete if their parents are not English speakers, or if there are generational trauma issues.

So, instead of working with families and re-emphasizing the importance of education, MCPS just "drops the rope."

Contrast this with DCPS and PGCPS, both of which also have issues of English language learners and generational poverty. Those districts double down on homework, and radically scale up parental engagement, rather than just throwing up their hands and deciding it is too hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes homework is important and the quality of homework is important. It's about starting early and slowly building up their self study skills. What's going to happen to all these kids when they're in HS and have 2-4 hours of homework? Or in college when most of their work and study is outside of the classroom?

If MCPS adopts less homework policy, this won't be a problem in HS at least. College may not be so good though...

The proposed policy is only until 8th grade. So HS-ers are in for a major shock of being unprepared, especially those entering magnet programs.

The proposed policy allows the teacher to decide on the frequency of homework.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Homework doesn’t work because kids just cheat. I’d rather see schools ban all devices and work with the kids in class to get work done.

The internet is a disaster for education.

It really is. Kids just google the answer to math problems or google the cliff notes to a book.

It is a disaster but what can one do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Homework is already "graded for completion" rather than for content in ES, so this doesn't feel like a huge shift.

However, I think this is the wrong direction. The MCPS approach seems to be that homework is too hard for some kids to complete if their parents are not English speakers, or if there are generational trauma issues.

So, instead of working with families and re-emphasizing the importance of education, MCPS just "drops the rope."

Contrast this with DCPS and PGCPS, both of which also have issues of English language learners and generational poverty. Those districts double down on homework, and radically scale up parental engagement, rather than just throwing up their hands and deciding it is too hard.

This is what is so insulting to so many poor families and Latino and Black families. It is so easy for the district to spin that we don't care about the importance of education when the homework that is given is not easy for a student or parent to understand and to complete independently. I pointed out in an earlier post the directions on one second grade assignment had a reading level of 7th grade. If the district merely sent home math fact practice of addition and subtraction in first and second grade and multiplication/division practice in third and fourth grade so that every student knew all their math facts instantaneously it would be immensely helpful for all students. Families would understand the homework and know how helpful it is to know math facts. Then add phonics homework in K-2/3. And reading comprehension sheets in upper elementary grades. Read a few paragraphs and answer questions at the level you are reading.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Homework is already "graded for completion" rather than for content in ES, so this doesn't feel like a huge shift.

However, I think this is the wrong direction. The MCPS approach seems to be that homework is too hard for some kids to complete if their parents are not English speakers, or if there are generational trauma issues.

So, instead of working with families and re-emphasizing the importance of education, MCPS just "drops the rope."

Contrast this with DCPS and PGCPS, both of which also have issues of English language learners and generational poverty. Those districts double down on homework, and radically scale up parental engagement, rather than just throwing up their hands and deciding it is too hard.

It’s too much of a liberal mindset in MCPS. The other districts are right to double down. There’s no evidence that minority kids or poor kids do worse .

My mom and dad were poor , immigrants, and not great English speakers at all.

My mom was a housekeeper but she used to make me read newspapers encyclopedias and dictionaries she got from her employer to her (showing my
Age here ) under the guise I’m teaching HER language skills she needed for .

She knew the school wasn’t going to teach me a thing . It’s best to make a reader out of your child at home. Granted I think it may be easier for girls.

My youngest brother is 2 years younger never read much of anything without a fuss and I did all his homework and the teachers (which were the same teachers I had) all Noticed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework obviously didn't teach OP how to think.

Why does a parent need a school to assign homework?! You are the PARENT. If you want you to do more homework, assign it.

But I don't think a parent is involved at all. This smells like a thinly veiled cookie cutter talking point slogan thet certain groups repeat ad nauseum in response to all news without regard to the actual issue at hand. It doesn't work because you already have all the morons in your camp, and the rest of us see through you.

This is OP. As a parent, I am supposed to assign homework? LOL

I have had kids in both MCPS and private. When my youngest was in private elementary school, she had homework every night. Mostly math and reading and also studying for spelling tests. The math is the most time consuming, as it should be. Math is an important subject that requires practice. The short amount of time spent in school on math is not enough for a student to master it. Now MCPS teachers want parents to assign the math homework. I guess public schools are self service institutions now. This is one of the many reasons I pulled my kids out of MCPS and so glad I did.

Public school students run rings around private school students in math.

One example:

https://bpb-us-e1.wpmucdn.com/blog.umd.edu/dist/f/613/files/2023/12/2023-Winners.pdf

There will always be a tiny select group of exceptional students, but by and large, students performance in public schools is mediocre at best.

Nevertheles, the PP's point is valid. Public schools students run rings around private in math.

Let's be honest and tell it like it is. Asian students run rings around everyone else in math. Look at the winners and they are almost all Asian. Asian parents put their kids in the most competitive public schools to get the best education they can for their children. It doesn't have anything to do with public school math being better in elementary schools. Then in secondary there is a demand for higher level math because so many students have studied math outside of school.

This is why the no homework/less homework is really an awful way to increase equity for poor students as well as Latino and Black students. I was the third grade teacher who made sure my students really learned math facts. When I was growing up I lived in a city with many Asian immigrants. My Latino parents thought the schools were in charge of education and they didn't need to do extra. I always excelled in math so I was in the top math groups. By high school I started thinking maybe I wasn't that good in math, but finally realized that many of my Asian classmates were going to Saturday language and math school as well as private summer math classes run by members of their ethnic groups. They had access to the math instructors textbook to check all of their answers. They could keep working at a problem until they got the correct answer.

So when I became a third grade teacher I wanted to be able for my students to have extra work as well. Besides math facts I offered extra math work to anyone who wanted it. Many of my top students and their parents loved getting extra work- maybe 5 out of 25 students. Just because others didn't want to do or were unable to do the extra work shouldn't mean no one gets the opportunity to get extra work. In 4th grade a teacher from Peru who worked at my school did the same. By the time they were in 5th grade and math tracking started our students were excelling in math. So many of the students who went from my class to the Peruvian teacher's class were the top students in the grade. If we could have continued helping these families supplement in math, these kids would could have ensured theses students stayed in the top math classes when they went on to the junior high and were combined with higher income kids with more resources.

If instead of paying for all this equity training for teachers and having countless administrators if school districts paid for any FARM student to enroll in Kumon then AOPS they would see so many underrepresented students excel. It also should be a requirement that every math curriculum used has WORKED EXAMPLES so that if a student is absent or they don't understand the problems or weren't paying attention they can still go home and look at the worked examples and figure out what to do. Or their parents can figure out how to help them. Eureka math for the most part does NOT have worked examples. It makes absolutely no sense that students do not have math textbooks besides workbooks.

Eureka has a homework helper for every class that provides detailed examples of how to complete problems. As a parent, I found this very helpful if my kid had questions - I could point her to the homework helper and she usually figured it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework obviously didn't teach OP how to think.

Why does a parent need a school to assign homework?! You are the PARENT. If you want you to do more homework, assign it.

But I don't think a parent is involved at all. This smells like a thinly veiled cookie cutter talking point slogan thet certain groups repeat ad nauseum in response to all news without regard to the actual issue at hand. It doesn't work because you already have all the morons in your camp, and the rest of us see through you.

This is OP. As a parent, I am supposed to assign homework? LOL

I have had kids in both MCPS and private. When my youngest was in private elementary school, she had homework every night. Mostly math and reading and also studying for spelling tests. The math is the most time consuming, as it should be. Math is an important subject that requires practice. The short amount of time spent in school on math is not enough for a student to master it. Now MCPS teachers want parents to assign the math homework. I guess public schools are self service institutions now. This is one of the many reasons I pulled my kids out of MCPS and so glad I did.

Public school students run rings around private school students in math.

One example:

https://bpb-us-e1.wpmucdn.com/blog.umd.edu/dist/f/613/files/2023/12/2023-Winners.pdf

There will always be a tiny select group of exceptional students, but by and large, students performance in public schools is mediocre at best.

Nevertheles, the PP's point is valid. Public schools students run rings around private in math.

Let's be honest and tell it like it is. Asian students run rings around everyone else in math. Look at the winners and they are almost all Asian. Asian parents put their kids in the most competitive public schools to get the best education they can for their children. It doesn't have anything to do with public school math being better in elementary schools. Then in secondary there is a demand for higher level math because so many students have studied math outside of school.

This is why the no homework/less homework is really an awful way to increase equity for poor students as well as Latino and Black students. I was the third grade teacher who made sure my students really learned math facts. When I was growing up I lived in a city with many Asian immigrants. My Latino parents thought the schools were in charge of education and they didn't need to do extra. I always excelled in math so I was in the top math groups. By high school I started thinking maybe I wasn't that good in math, but finally realized that many of my Asian classmates were going to Saturday language and math school as well as private summer math classes run by members of their ethnic groups. They had access to the math instructors textbook to check all of their answers. They could keep working at a problem until they got the correct answer.

So when I became a third grade teacher I wanted to be able for my students to have extra work as well. Besides math facts I offered extra math work to anyone who wanted it. Many of my top students and their parents loved getting extra work- maybe 5 out of 25 students. Just because others didn't want to do or were unable to do the extra work shouldn't mean no one gets the opportunity to get extra work. In 4th grade a teacher from Peru who worked at my school did the same. By the time they were in 5th grade and math tracking started our students were excelling in math. So many of the students who went from my class to the Peruvian teacher's class were the top students in the grade. If we could have continued helping these families supplement in math, these kids would could have ensured theses students stayed in the top math classes when they went on to the junior high and were combined with higher income kids with more resources.

If instead of paying for all this equity training for teachers and having countless administrators if school districts paid for any FARM student to enroll in Kumon then AOPS they would see so many underrepresented students excel. It also should be a requirement that every math curriculum used has WORKED EXAMPLES so that if a student is absent or they don't understand the problems or weren't paying attention they can still go home and look at the worked examples and figure out what to do. Or their parents can figure out how to help them. Eureka math for the most part does NOT have worked examples. It makes absolutely no sense that students do not have math textbooks besides workbooks.

Eureka has a homework helper for every class that provides detailed examples of how to complete problems. As a parent, I found this very helpful if my kid had questions - I could point her to the homework helper and she usually figured it out.

That would require our teacher to communicate what they were doing in class. I've written a few times to ask but it's tough to get straight answers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework isn’t equitable.

LOL!

What do you disagree with in PP's statement? Poor kids often can't do homework because reasons so assigning homework that poor kids can't or won't do isn't equitable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework isn’t equitable.

LOL!

What do you disagree with in PP's statement? Poor kids often can't do homework because reasons so assigning homework that poor kids can't or won't do isn't equitable.

No, actually equitable would be to offer after school homework help or peer buddies or audiobook pairing options with novels. You know, to help them succeed rather than expect them to fail. How insulting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework isn’t equitable.

LOL!

What do you disagree with in PP's statement? Poor kids often can't do homework because reasons so assigning homework that poor kids can't or won't do isn't equitable.

No, actually equitable would be to offer after school homework help or peer buddies or audiobook pairing options with novels. You know, to help them succeed rather than expect them to fail. How insulting.

That would be one way. But MCPS knows most poor kids won't take advantage of these things so they do the only thing they can to help close the gap which is to get rid of anything that makes kids who care about education excel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework doesn’t work because kids just cheat. I’d rather see schools ban all devices and work with the kids in class to get work done.

The internet is a disaster for education.

It really is. Kids just google the answer to math problems or google the cliff notes to a book.

It is a disaster but what can one do?

integrity helps

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Homework isn’t equitable.

LOL!

What do you disagree with in PP's statement? Poor kids often can't do homework because reasons so assigning homework that poor kids can't or won't do isn't equitable.

No, actually equitable would be to offer after school homework help or peer buddies or audiobook pairing options with novels. You know, to help them succeed rather than expect them to fail. How insulting.

That would be one way. But MCPS knows most poor kids won't take advantage of these things so they do the only thing they can to help close the gap which is to get rid of anything that makes kids who care about education excel.

Yes, this is the way top-down equity works.