Teachers, how would you take this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a teacher how would I take it?

Like it was mansplaining the problem to me.

Do I say thanks to a dad because pointing out all the inequities of the system I as a teacher have no control over, but am held accountable for and am operating within constantly?

I don’t know but we are all aware the system is broken. I guess the question is what is he going to do about beyond pointing out the issue. And will his advocacy lift up the people in the system or tear his kids team down?

What would your reaction have been if had been the mom who said this? Or if OP had not mentioned the gender of the parents in her description of the conversation? Would it still be mansplaining? Would you still be annoyed?

The weird part isn’t that the man said it. It is that (according to OP) he was silent through out the meeting and then chimed in at the end with a comment that boiled down to “I don’t think the teacher can really do this.”

If the mom was silent during the meeting, yes I would look at the comment as being manipulative because concerns should be addressed throughout. There are 2 options here for what he wanted:
- he was genuine concerned for the teacher’s workload. OR
- He is concerned his daughter isn’t/wont be getting real services.

He has set up the next meeting where he needs an advocate because he already voiced his concerns (At the very end of a meeting) and they weren’t met.

Sure, leave room for the possibility that he is acting out of concern for the well being of the kid or teacher. It could be!

It feels a bit patriarchal to have a Dad come in at the very end of the meeting (since mom chiming in during the entire meeting) to say “yeah, that probably won’t happen” without saying things throughout the meeting.

If Mom had done that, said nothing throughout the meeting and then was disparaging at the end, no it wouldnt’ be mansplaining, just manipulative. So, that’s my internalized misogyny using 2 different words to explain the same feeling that he isn’t trusting the teaching team.

Frankly, as a SPED parent and teacher I get where dad is coming from. Unfortunately we have the realities of a teaching crisis and not enough teachers as it is, so few kids are the most optimal development possible, but they are getting a basic education. This isn’t just a teaching crisis (see the Kaiser strike as an example) but in person workers everywhere are stressed. Maybe he was trying to fight for the teacher, but the way he did it was strange.

I don't know where people are getting that there was any concern (real or fake) for the teacher here. It clearly wasn't concern for the teacher herself, but rather concern about the teachers ability to actually do what they are assigned with doing.

Yes because the dad knew NO teacher could reasonably do what was in that IEP for his child while ALSO teaching an entire class of children, some of whom also have IEPs of their own. Saying “this isn’t possible for a teacher without support from admin” isn’t saying “this teacher sucks.” It’s saying “this is not realistic to be implemented, so what will admin be doing to make it possible?”

… and the only answer is the school has to expend extra $$$ to give the child a basic education or else they can expect another OCR complaint to US Ed Dept.

Then spending the money is what has to happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At every IEP meeting, the principal, sped teacher, and GenEd teacher have a preliminary meeting before the parents are invited in. It’s obvious that they already have a plan before the parent ever enters the room and is permitted to speak. Honestly, there’s not much air time given to the parent. And, it is obvious that they pre-decided everything ahead of the parent. It’s a frustrating process and a lot of hoop dee do.

I've taught for 20 years and been at three different schools....we never had a before meeting.

This is standard practice in FCPS. It’s arguably not legal.

No it isn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a teacher how would I take it?

Like it was mansplaining the problem to me.

Do I say thanks to a dad because pointing out all the inequities of the system I as a teacher have no control over, but am held accountable for and am operating within constantly?

I don’t know but we are all aware the system is broken. I guess the question is what is he going to do about beyond pointing out the issue. And will his advocacy lift up the people in the system or tear his kids team down?

What would your reaction have been if had been the mom who said this? Or if OP had not mentioned the gender of the parents in her description of the conversation? Would it still be mansplaining? Would you still be annoyed?

The weird part isn’t that the man said it. It is that (according to OP) he was silent through out the meeting and then chimed in at the end with a comment that boiled down to “I don’t think the teacher can really do this.”

If the mom was silent during the meeting, yes I would look at the comment as being manipulative because concerns should be addressed throughout. There are 2 options here for what he wanted:
- he was genuine concerned for the teacher’s workload. OR
- He is concerned his daughter isn’t/wont be getting real services.

He has set up the next meeting where he needs an advocate because he already voiced his concerns (At the very end of a meeting) and they weren’t met.

Sure, leave room for the possibility that he is acting out of concern for the well being of the kid or teacher. It could be!

It feels a bit patriarchal to have a Dad come in at the very end of the meeting (since mom chiming in during the entire meeting) to say “yeah, that probably won’t happen” without saying things throughout the meeting.

If Mom had done that, said nothing throughout the meeting and then was disparaging at the end, no it wouldnt’ be mansplaining, just manipulative. So, that’s my internalized misogyny using 2 different words to explain the same feeling that he isn’t trusting the teaching team.

Frankly, as a SPED parent and teacher I get where dad is coming from. Unfortunately we have the realities of a teaching crisis and not enough teachers as it is, so few kids are the most optimal development possible, but they are getting a basic education. This isn’t just a teaching crisis (see the Kaiser strike as an example) but in person workers everywhere are stressed. Maybe he was trying to fight for the teacher, but the way he did it was strange.

I don't know where people are getting that there was any concern (real or fake) for the teacher here. It clearly wasn't concern for the teacher herself, but rather concern about the teachers ability to actually do what they are assigned with doing.

Yes because the dad knew NO teacher could reasonably do what was in that IEP for his child while ALSO teaching an entire class of children, some of whom also have IEPs of their own. Saying “this isn’t possible for a teacher without support from admin” isn’t saying “this teacher sucks.” It’s saying “this is not realistic to be implemented, so what will admin be doing to make it possible?”

… and the only answer is the school has to expend extra $$$ to give the child a basic education or else they can expect another OCR complaint to US Ed Dept.

Not true. OCR only cares about certain categories of students. Resources (in this case teacher time) can be shifted from gen ed students who DOE doesn't care about to students with IEPs whom OCR does care about.

[Anonymous]

Sounds to me like he's either been a teacher or talked to one. He said the part actual teachers kniw but can't say out loud.

[Anonymous]

This sounds like something my husband would ask. He actually used this very verbiage to convince me to pull daughter out of previous school and send her to Oakwood, because he told me, “It’s not that the teachers WON’T do this plan; it is that they CAN’T, and nothing we can say or do will change that.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
My husband does that sort of thing. He has a high IQ, but low processing speed. It takes time for everything to fall into place so he can formulate a response. So he would totally be the type to not say a word, then come out with a comment that pinpoints exactly the weakness in the plan. He doesn't not take into consideration anyone's feelings, and does not intend any offense. It's all a matter of who will do what and is that feasible with their existing workload. It's the the troubleshooting sort of discussion, not the aspirational sort of discussion.

If the Principal was offended, then he or she is just as stupid as a previous teacher PP.

My husband is exactly like this too. I will talk myself in circles over and over again, but in the end, he will pull out a pithy observation, summary, or question, and everybody who was talking (including me), will be like, “Ahhhh, yes, that * is* it!!” It is something I am always very grateful for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like something my husband would ask. He actually used this very verbiage to convince me to pull daughter out of previous school and send her to Oakwood, because he told me, “It’s not that the teachers WON’T do this plan; it is that they CAN’T, and nothing we can say or do will change that.”

Why do you believe they can’t execute as planned?
Why do you believe nothing you say or do will cause them to execute the plan?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like something my husband would ask. He actually used this very verbiage to convince me to pull daughter out of previous school and send her to Oakwood, because he told me, “It’s not that the teachers WON’T do this plan; it is that they CAN’T, and nothing we can say or do will change that.”

Why do you believe they can’t execute as planned?
Why do you believe nothing you say or do will cause them to execute the plan?

Because we cannot single-handedly reorganize a school’s priorities, students, teacher’s workload to suit just us.