I want transparency and accountability from UVA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:and as my mother always said…people in hell want ice water

Thanks for making me laugh! My mom always said this also

Why are you comparing UVA to hell? It is not funny

No. The people not in UVA are in hell.

It’s sorta funny in a dad joke sorta way.

[Anonymous]

Is Youngkin going to empower VA parents at UVA?

Will he put them on the admissions committee? Help define course catalog? Tell professors what they can teach?

Parents have get a voice, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we foreigners have been saying for years, OP. In the rest of the world, there is a formula, or at least much more of one than here. You have the grades, you get in, is what it essentially boils down to.

Here admissions committees are allowed to be racist, discriminatory, and they openly favor children of alumni, children of billionaire donors, and children with no particular academic strength who happen to be good at sports.

It's disgusting, and yet, the brain-washed American people continue to believe it's a great "holistic" system and they beggar themselves or their children to get in, instead of voting for politicians who might make university low-cost, like in other developed countries.

In other countries the state contribution to tuition is basically one hundred percent. There is no way that tax burden would be tolerated here.

Maybe, if you paired down colleges to what their European equivalents offer (in terms of housing, food, extra curricular, sports...) and cut the number of seats across the system starting in high school though graduate school to match systems that start weeding out far younger the costs might not be that different.

Are you saying European universities offer "paired down" housing compared to American universities? I find this surprising. When I was planning a trip to Scotland a few years ago, I remember seeing an economical option in some cities to stay in university dorms, since it was summer and there were no students. The accommodation offered in these dorms were FAR nicer than the dorms my kids have had in college--private rooms with larger beds, compared to the shared rooms/twin XL beds that US colleges have!

And good luck getting major universities to "pair down" football!

Football is a net positive for revenue. Swimming/Lacrosse/soccer... all lose money. If you were staying at Edinborough or St Andrews you were staying at very rich school well supported by foreigners paying tuition as well as centuries old endowments. Try doing the same at a more modern continental university.

I didn't actually stay in the dorms--it was just an option that I saw come up as I was searching. It would not have worked out for me because I was traveling with my (then) 17 year old son and it said that minors were not allowed to stay in a room on their own, and these were single rooms so we coudn't share.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is Youngkin going to empower VA parents at UVA?

Will he put them on the admissions committee? Help define course catalog? Tell professors what they can teach?

Parents have get a voice, right?

No need for stupid sarcasm.

It is a legitimate policy debate about how universities should admit students and whether transparent college admissions cutoffs using purely academic performance is in fact the most equitable and fair way to admit students and also the most socially-beneficial to motivate students to learn the most during high school.

Because actually every other country in the world, i.e. 94% of the world's population does it that way, including lots of multi-racial and multi-ethnic countries and many countries with Black majorities and many countries with Hispanic majorities, many countries with White majorities and all Asian countries as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is Youngkin going to empower VA parents at UVA?

Will he put them on the admissions committee? Help define course catalog? Tell professors what they can teach?

Parents have get a voice, right?

No need for stupid sarcasm.

It is a legitimate policy debate about how universities should admit students and whether transparent college admissions cutoffs using purely academic performance is in fact the most equitable and fair way to admit students and also the most socially-beneficial to motivate students to learn the most during high school.

Because actually every other country in the world, i.e. 94% of the world's population does it that way, including lots of multi-racial and multi-ethnic countries and many countries with Black majorities and many countries with Hispanic majorities, many countries with White majorities and all Asian countries as well.

And many countries with left-wing governments, with liberal governments, with conservative governments, with right-wing governments, etc...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we foreigners have been saying for years, OP. In the rest of the world, there is a formula, or at least much more of one than here. You have the grades, you get in, is what it essentially boils down to.

Here admissions committees are allowed to be racist, discriminatory, and they openly favor children of alumni, children of billionaire donors, and children with no particular academic strength who happen to be good at sports.

It's disgusting, and yet, the brain-washed American people continue to believe it's a great "holistic" system and they beggar themselves or their children to get in, instead of voting for politicians who might make university low-cost, like in other developed countries.

And in the rest of the world, those who attend a school that grades a bit tougher are out of luck. Those who have to work to help their families survive and thus have less time to devote to studying are out of luck. Those who have any interest outside of studying, studying, studying are out of luck. Those who volunteer their time to help others are out of luck. Etc...

The US system is vastly superior to the above. It's not like kids with a 3.0 and 1100 SATs are getting into UVa in large numbers. We're talking almost exclusively about kids with a bit lower numbers and something major going on outside of perfecting their GPA and test scores.

Vastly superior, lol.

You don’t fix income inequalities by messing with college admissions. You need to do it much earlier in child’s life. And volunteering for the sake of being competitive for college admissions is not volunteering at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we foreigners have been saying for years, OP. In the rest of the world, there is a formula, or at least much more of one than here. You have the grades, you get in, is what it essentially boils down to.

Here admissions committees are allowed to be racist, discriminatory, and they openly favor children of alumni, children of billionaire donors, and children with no particular academic strength who happen to be good at sports.

It's disgusting, and yet, the brain-washed American people continue to believe it's a great "holistic" system and they beggar themselves or their children to get in, instead of voting for politicians who might make university low-cost, like in other developed countries.

In other countries the state contribution to tuition is basically one hundred percent. There is no way that tax burden would be tolerated here.

Maybe, if you paired down colleges to what their European equivalents offer (in terms of housing, food, extra curricular, sports...) and cut the number of seats across the system starting in high school though graduate school to match systems that start weeding out far younger the costs might not be that different.

Yes, this is the biggest difference for me. Students here (incl. my DC) are way more coddled by colleges here than their European counterparts. All the amenities not relevant to the actual academia, gone or greatly reduced. Including on-campus housing. This reflects in college services one has to pay for like cafeterias. Think $2.50 per meal or less.
The sorting happens usually in 5th grade and sets the track. This does not mean there isn't a way for late bloomers, but they will have to show initiative to pursue the non regular track (kids of friends have done so succssfully). Not everybody can (academically) or wants to pursue academia and that is absolutely fine, for those trade & vocational schools offer a track, without a stigma (they form the majority of the workforce).

[Anonymous]

What?? SFHs in nova aren’t sold with a guarantee of UVA admission (or W&M)??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we foreigners have been saying for years, OP. In the rest of the world, there is a formula, or at least much more of one than here. You have the grades, you get in, is what it essentially boils down to.

Here admissions committees are allowed to be racist, discriminatory, and they openly favor children of alumni, children of billionaire donors, and children with no particular academic strength who happen to be good at sports.

It's disgusting, and yet, the brain-washed American people continue to believe it's a great "holistic" system and they beggar themselves or their children to get in, instead of voting for politicians who might make university low-cost, like in other developed countries.

In other countries the state contribution to tuition is basically one hundred percent. There is no way that tax burden would be tolerated here.

Maybe, if you paired down colleges to what their European equivalents offer (in terms of housing, food, extra curricular, sports...) and cut the number of seats across the system starting in high school though graduate school to match systems that start weeding out far younger the costs might not be that different.

Yes, this is the biggest difference for me. Students here (incl. my DC) are way more coddled by colleges here than their European counterparts. All the amenities not relevant to the actual academia, gone or greatly reduced. Including on-campus housing. This reflects in college services one has to pay for like cafeterias. Think $2.50 per meal or less.
The sorting happens usually in 5th grade and sets the track. This does not mean there isn't a way for late bloomers, but they will have to show initiative to pursue the non regular track (kids of friends have done so succssfully). Not everybody can (academically) or wants to pursue academia and that is absolutely fine, for those trade & vocational schools offer a track, without a stigma (they form the majority of the workforce).

Hard tracking in Grade 5 only happens in the german and austro-hungarian -derived countries. But fair score-based academic admissions is much more widespread than early tracking. Let's not change the debate into grade-5 exam-based tracking rather than transparent university admissions based on fair,comparabe academic criteria that are individual performance-based rather than "adjusted" for racial, and socio-economic or caste factors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want Dean J’s cute little videos about their holistic approach and how they want to see this and that from a student. I don’t need dean j at all. For in state admissions I want a formula. Kid took these classes, got these grades, got that SAT, then guaranteed admission to UVA or WM or Vtech or whatever other VA state school, end of story. Otherwise you are not getting my tax dollars.

You pretty much ARE guaranteed a spot at a Virginia public school if you really want one. But a lot of people are too name obsessed to consider some of them. There are too many people to let all high school graduates have a spot at the three big names, of course.

Who is making you watch Dean J's videos? If you don't want them, don't watch them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What?? SFHs in nova aren’t sold with a guarantee of UVA admission (or W&M)??

Only the most expensive SFHs. Don’t want any poors at The University. Thomas Jefferson had standards.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want Dean J’s cute little videos about their holistic approach and how they want to see this and that from a student. I don’t need dean j at all. For in state admissions I want a formula. Kid took these classes, got these grades, got that SAT, then guaranteed admission to UVA or WM or Vtech or whatever other VA state school, end of story. Otherwise you are not getting my tax dollars.

You pretty much ARE guaranteed a spot at a Virginia public school if you really want one. But a lot of people are too name obsessed to consider some of them. There are too many people to let all high school graduates have a spot at the three big names, of course.

Who is making you watch Dean J's videos? If you don't want them, don't watch them.

+1. Please show me a DCUM kid that was shut out of the VA state system completely. Most of the schools have very high acceptance rates. Everyone on this thread wants UVA. That is the problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want Dean J’s cute little videos about their holistic approach and how they want to see this and that from a student. I don’t need dean j at all. For in state admissions I want a formula. Kid took these classes, got these grades, got that SAT, then guaranteed admission to UVA or WM or Vtech or whatever other VA state school, end of story. Otherwise you are not getting my tax dollars.

You pretty much ARE guaranteed a spot at a Virginia public school if you really want one. But a lot of people are too name obsessed to consider some of them. There are too many people to let all high school graduates have a spot at the three big names, of course.

Who is making you watch Dean J's videos? If you don't want them, don't watch them.

+1. Please show me a DCUM kid that was shut out of the VA state system completely. Most of the schools have very high acceptance rates. Everyone on this thread wants UVA. That is the problem.

Nah, quoting a PP, I’d like transparent university admissions based on fair,comparabe academic criteria that are individual performance-based rather than "adjusted" for racial, and socio-economic or caste factors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want Dean J’s cute little videos about their holistic approach and how they want to see this and that from a student. I don’t need dean j at all. For in state admissions I want a formula. Kid took these classes, got these grades, got that SAT, then guaranteed admission to UVA or WM or Vtech or whatever other VA state school, end of story. Otherwise you are not getting my tax dollars.

You pretty much ARE guaranteed a spot at a Virginia public school if you really want one. But a lot of people are too name obsessed to consider some of them. There are too many people to let all high school graduates have a spot at the three big names, of course.

Who is making you watch Dean J's videos? If you don't want them, don't watch them.

+1. Please show me a DCUM kid that was shut out of the VA state system completely. Most of the schools have very high acceptance rates. Everyone on this thread wants UVA. That is the problem.

I remembered this thread from May and I can't find it, but there was a list of schools that still had open spots and were taking applications. There were lots of Maryland and Virginia public colleges on it. Just not the big names.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want Dean J’s cute little videos about their holistic approach and how they want to see this and that from a student. I don’t need dean j at all. For in state admissions I want a formula. Kid took these classes, got these grades, got that SAT, then guaranteed admission to UVA or WM or Vtech or whatever other VA state school, end of story. Otherwise you are not getting my tax dollars.

You pretty much ARE guaranteed a spot at a Virginia public school if you really want one. But a lot of people are too name obsessed to consider some of them. There are too many people to let all high school graduates have a spot at the three big names, of course.

Who is making you watch Dean J's videos? If you don't want them, don't watch them.

+1. Please show me a DCUM kid that was shut out of the VA state system completely. Most of the schools have very high acceptance rates. Everyone on this thread wants UVA. That is the problem.

+1 to all this. Plenty of good schools in Virginia but most kids and parents are hung up on a few. My kid didn’t apply to UVA or W&M and only applied to VT on a whim but it’s not her top choice. She has two other solid choices in-state that have already accepted her and are frankly stronger in her major.