University Of California Reaches Final Decision: No More Standardized Admission Testing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The fewer objective measurements, the more opaque cherry-picking they can do.

And in the near future, you'll wonder why they have way fewer Asian students graduates...

It’s not objective. You can game the test, pay for test tutoring and increase scores. The only proven correlation between SATs and ACTs is income.

That isn’t true, the UC system itself recently produced research showing high correlation between SAT scores and performance in college. It’s more predictive than high school grades. Hi

link?

Halfway through the bullet points— “without controlling for demographics,” SAT/ACT score are a better predictor of college grades than high school gpa. https://www.ucop.edu/institutional-research-academic-planning/_files/sat-act-study-report.pdf

but like...demographics exist?

Maybe actually read the report?

They also concluded that adding sat/act to high school gpa materially improved ability to predict college performance.

Without controlling for student demographics, SAT/ACT scores are a stronger predictor of freshman GPA when compared to HSGPA, but have almost the same explanatory power of graduation GPA, first year retention and graduation. After controlling for student demographics, HSGPA and test scores have the same explanatory power of the freshman GPA for 2015, the latest year included in this study, but HSGPA is a stronger predictor of the first year retention, graduation GPA and four-year graduation.

Right, so the goal isn’t to admit the most qualified students who will perform the best in college, just admit a cohort that will make it to graduation.

This is the frustration with wokeness in public education.

And you choosing to ignore the fact that the study found gpa plus sat best predictor of college performance.

HSGPA is a stronger prediction of graduation GPA. --I guess you missed that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The fewer objective measurements, the more opaque cherry-picking they can do.

And in the near future, you'll wonder why they have way fewer Asian students graduates...

It’s not objective. You can game the test, pay for test tutoring and increase scores. The only proven correlation between SATs and ACTs is income.

That isn’t true, the UC system itself recently produced research showing high correlation between SAT scores and performance in college. It’s more predictive than high school grades. Hi

link?

Halfway through the bullet points— “without controlling for demographics,” SAT/ACT score are a better predictor of college grades than high school gpa. https://www.ucop.edu/institutional-research-academic-planning/_files/sat-act-study-report.pdf

but like...demographics exist?

Maybe actually read the report?

They also concluded that adding sat/act to high school gpa materially improved ability to predict college performance.

Without controlling for student demographics, SAT/ACT scores are a stronger predictor of freshman GPA when compared to HSGPA, but have almost the same explanatory power of graduation GPA, first year retention and graduation. After controlling for student demographics, HSGPA and test scores have the same explanatory power of the freshman GPA for 2015, the latest year included in this study, but HSGPA is a stronger predictor of the first year retention, graduation GPA and four-year graduation.

Right, so the goal isn’t to admit the most qualified students who will perform the best in college, just admit a cohort that will make it to graduation.

This is the frustration with wokeness in public education.

And you choosing to ignore the fact that the study found gpa plus sat best predictor of college performance.

HSGPA is a stronger prediction of graduation GPA. --I guess you missed that?

Than SAT only but the most predictive is gpa plus SAT. Guess you missed that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

Come on, people with 1500+ scores are objectively smarter than people with 1100.

I disagree. Half of the SAT is math. I’m a successful middle aged professional and haven’t used math formally in 25 years. Intelligence is not math.

DP. Completely agree. I imagine many people who don't do well on the SAT/ACT due to the math section could write circles around those who do. Frankly, I wish a timed writing sample was part of admissions, like the SAT/ACT writing section which has been discontinued.

[Anonymous]

I’ll just state the obvious....consideration of standardized tests doesn’t yield the desired color composition of incoming classes so it had to be eliminated. The cal system will continue to tinker with admissions criteria until it admits exactly 12% blacks because that’s proportionate with the population. Forget the merit of applicants, the overriding consideration is race. MLK is rolling over in his grave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

This will hurt immigrant and low-SES kids who have the smarts to do well on the SAT.

- Ivy League grad immigrant kid who’s parents didn’t go past grade school

No, it won't. It'll help them.

Says who? Do you even know any immigrant parents?!

yes.

Ok how will it help them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So who does this help? (I have a kid in both scenarios).

1)Public schools where kids all have a 4.3, 4.4, 4.5. I have a kid in DCPS. Due to endless retakes, lax grading every kid in my kid's social circle has straight As. There are dozens if not hundreds. I imagine this is true across Fairfax/Mont Co. too.
2)Private school kids with imperfect grades from elite schools known for rigor. No-one has perfect grades but academic standards are very high.

Are you full pay?

yes, as are all these kids. I'm just wondering what you all think is the better scenario or an upper-middle class white kid from the DMV given these options.

I also have both. I think private school kids will get screwed for admissions to state schools. They will look at GPA. I think smaller private schools can look beyond just grades more easily and so private kids will be fine there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

This will hurt immigrant and low-SES kids who have the smarts to do well on the SAT.

- Ivy League grad immigrant kid who’s parents didn’t go past grade school

Exactly!

I am a black immigrant who scored high on the SAT and so did my children. No more standardized admission testing will negatively impact many immigrants. Shame on UC! It hurts me to no end to see the culture of low expectations or the dumbing down of black students in this country. It's like if you are a black student who values education and score high on tests UC will penalized you and regulate a black student to low performing status. It's Absurd!

Screw them!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

This will hurt immigrant and low-SES kids who have the smarts to do well on the SAT.

- Ivy League grad immigrant kid who’s parents didn’t go past grade school

Exactly!

I am a black immigrant who scored high on the SAT and so did my children. No more standardized admission testing will negatively impact many immigrants. Shame on UC! It hurts me to no end to see the culture of low expectations or the dumbing down of black students in this country. It's like if you are a black student who values education and score high on tests UC will penalized you and regulate a black student to low performing status. It's Absurd!

Screw them!

If you are black person that scores in the 90th percentile or above on test scores there is zero reason to attend a UC.

One of the private T20 schools will take you and it’s a better deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So who does this help? (I have a kid in both scenarios).

1)Public schools where kids all have a 4.3, 4.4, 4.5. I have a kid in DCPS. Due to endless retakes, lax grading every kid in my kid's social circle has straight As. There are dozens if not hundreds. I imagine this is true across Fairfax/Mont Co. too.
2)Private school kids with imperfect grades from elite schools known for rigor. No-one has perfect grades but academic standards are very high.

Are you full pay?

yes, as are all these kids. I'm just wondering what you all think is the better scenario or an upper-middle class white kid from the DMV given these options.

I also have both. I think private school kids will get screwed for admissions to state schools. They will look at GPA. I think smaller private schools can look beyond just grades more easily and so private kids will be fine there.

In a non standardized test environment you err to the side of the name/rep of the school….private schools with known track records will become more valuable if there are no standardized tests.

Standardized tests are more useful for the 95% of Public HS that aren’t Whitman or Langley.

Removing standardized testing is just a method of entrenching privilege at the top buttressed by black and pseudo-Latin chosen few

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The ACT ranges of a few UC schools for fall 2019 admits

UC San Diego: 26-31
UC Irvine: 24-31
UC Davis: 24-31

https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/san-diego/freshman-admission-profile.html
https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/irvine/freshman-admission-profile.html
https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/davis/freshman-admission-profile.html

I have no idea how they made the t50 list with those averages
UC San Diego (#34) UC Irvine (#36) UC Davis (#38)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

This will hurt immigrant and low-SES kids who have the smarts to do well on the SAT.

- Ivy League grad immigrant kid who’s parents didn’t go past grade school

Exactly!

I am a black immigrant who scored high on the SAT and so did my children. No more standardized admission testing will negatively impact many immigrants. Shame on UC! It hurts me to no end to see the culture of low expectations or the dumbing down of black students in this country. It's like if you are a black student who values education and score high on tests UC will penalized you and regulate a black student to low performing status. It's Absurd!

Screw them!

If you are black person that scores in the 90th percentile or above on test scores there is zero reason to attend a UC.

One of the private T20 schools will take you and it’s a better deal.

but as a PP stated, other schools are also doing away with SATs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

Come on, people with 1500+ scores are objectively smarter than people with 1100.

I disagree. Half of the SAT is math. I’m a successful middle aged professional and haven’t used math formally in 25 years. Intelligence is not math.

DP. Completely agree. I imagine many people who don't do well on the SAT/ACT due to the math section could write circles around those who do. Frankly, I wish a timed writing sample was part of admissions, like the SAT/ACT writing section which has been discontinued.

Except there are plenty of people who ace math and English portions of SAT/ACT

like it or not, standardized tests are to some extent intelligence measures. getting rid of them means excluding some very smart kids for whom HS did not totally click.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

This will hurt immigrant and low-SES kids who have the smarts to do well on the SAT.

- Ivy League grad immigrant kid who’s parents didn’t go past grade school

Exactly!

I am a black immigrant who scored high on the SAT and so did my children. No more standardized admission testing will negatively impact many immigrants. Shame on UC! It hurts me to no end to see the culture of low expectations or the dumbing down of black students in this country. It's like if you are a black student who values education and score high on tests UC will penalized you and regulate a black student to low performing status. It's Absurd!

Screw them!

If you are black person that scores in the 90th percentile or above on test scores there is zero reason to attend a UC.

One of the private T20 schools will take you and it’s a better deal.

but as a PP stated, other schools are also doing away with SATs.

That isn’t correct, no one other than uc schools are test blind. Others are test optional, in which case, good test scores can still help an applicant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The ACT ranges of a few UC schools for fall 2019 admits

UC San Diego: 26-31
UC Irvine: 24-31
UC Davis: 24-31

https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/san-diego/freshman-admission-profile.html
https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/irvine/freshman-admission-profile.html
https://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/campuses-majors/davis/freshman-admission-profile.html

I have no idea how they made the t50 list with those averages
UC San Diego (#34) UC Irvine (#36) UC Davis (#38)

Other factors, like Pell grant recipients, cause higher rankings for UCs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fantastic. Study after study after study has confirmed the high correlation between family income and parental education and SAT and ACT scores. Generally speaking, high scores were born on third base. It doesn't make them any smarter.

Have you ever heard of IQ tests? What do you think SAT and ACT measure, if not IQ? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6963451/