3 killed in crash on River Road

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Do we know whether the speeder even had his lights on or not? He doesn't sound responsible enough for even that.

That model of BMW has automatic headlights, and daytime running lights. Some illumination would have been on. The crash report also states he flashed his high beams at the Volt (not clear if before it started to cross or not).

Okay, but usually, doesn't "flashing your lights" tell the other person to proceed (not a warning, but a "go ahead")? This kid isn't very smart.

Flashing your lights at someone on the highway means "get out of my way"....normally the car in front is going too slow for the car behind. I assume he was flashing the volt so it would stay out of the way...

No, flashing your lights at oncoming traffic does mean go ahead. If you are on a highway BEHIND someone and flash your lights, it is a (rude) signal for them to get into the righthand, slower lane so you can pass.

The article says he was frantically trying to avoid the crash once he saw the volt. I think accidentally hitting the flashers while frantically trying to avoid the crash is more likely than having the control to try to flash your high beams at the other driver as a warning.
In Turkey, you flash your lights to make the other driver or pedestrian aware of you. It doesn't mean go ahead, and it also doesn't mean I want to pass. It's kind of like a lower-key version of honking your horn. I mention this because the driver is Turkish.

His dad his from Turkey. He was born and raised here--and arrested in this country several times for reckless driving. Flashing at a car that's making a turn so they'll get out of the way is pointless if you're going 110 mph.

This isn't a cultural issue. The guy is an assh*le for driving way too fast. His parents are assh*les for letting this piece of crap have cars with this kind of horsepower after he'd been arrested so many times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He wasn't drunk but he's had NUMEROUS speeding, reckless driving, and substance charges since he was 17 years old. He's only 20. How many second chances does this guy deserve?

115 on RIVER ROAD? Are you out of your mind??? This is not "just a terrible mistake."

+1

[Anonymous]

Is anyone willing to contact the State's Attorney office and express your outrage that he has repeatedly gotten charges reduced or dropped? I'm trying to decide exactly what I want to say. I'm so angry that 3 members of an innocent family lost their lives due to this idiot that I cannot think well enough to compose my thoughts. I want the state to pursue a harsh sentence and a permanently revoked driver's license. (Is my DL idea even possible?) 2 years per person won't cut it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

You can acknowledge that he did a terrible thing that ruined four lives in addition to his own, that he deserves to be severely punished for that and not think he's a terrible person. A lot of 20 year old boys drive recklessly and the culture in Potomac with parents who equip these irresponsible kids with high powered vehicles contributes to this crap. He didn't set out to murder people, intent does matter when you're talking about the quality of a human being.

I am neither his parents nor mentally ill. What I am is someone who had three brothers grow up in that area and know exactly the type of stuff young privileged boys with loose supervision and fast cars can get into. My brothers never killed anyone but if you asked me if I thought they ever broke 100 on river when acting like stupid aholes? I'd probably bet on it. They're not bad people and would never do that today, but boys from age 14-25? They're reckless.

I think his life is ruined no matter how many years he gets considering the guilt he expressed at the scene and in his plea. And I think the girl's life is ruined no matter how much time he gets. Its a tragedy all around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

He obliterated a teenage girl's entire family and critically injured her. And he was intentionally driving 115mph on road that went past a HS. It would be like standing outside and shooting a gun w/o looking and then saying "Oh man. I'm so sorry!!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

You need to stop saying that. He wasn't just a young person who made a terrible mistake. You're misleading people into thinking that he was pretty innocent. You've said this several times and been taken to task for it; most disagree with you. Are you his mother?

But an adult who is 2 years out of high school who has had numerous driving incidents, hasn't cleaned up his act, hasn't tried to take a driving course, and then goes 80 miles over the speed limit on a local non-highway road, and kills 3 people is not just a terrible mistake. It's criminal negligence and should be treated the same as any other manslaughter case. Calling this a terrible mistake minimizes his fault in this. That suggests that he couldn't have thought that what he was doing would hurt someone. 15-20 miles over the speed limit that injures someone by accident is a terrible mistake. 80 miles over the speed limit on a local road with crossing traffic and traffic lights is homicidal and criminally negligent. Worlds apart.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

You can acknowledge that he did a terrible thing that ruined four lives in addition to his own, that he deserves to be severely punished for that and not think he's a terrible person. A lot of 20 year old boys drive recklessly and the culture in Potomac with parents who equip these irresponsible kids with high powered vehicles contributes to this crap. He didn't set out to murder people, intent does matter when you're talking about the quality of a human being.

I am neither his parents nor mentally ill. What I am is someone who had three brothers grow up in that area and know exactly the type of stuff young privileged boys with loose supervision and fast cars can get into. My brothers never killed anyone but if you asked me if I thought they ever broke 100 on river when acting like stupid aholes? I'd probably bet on it. They're not bad people and would never do that today, but boys from age 14-25? They're reckless.

I think his life is ruined no matter how many years he gets considering the guilt he expressed at the scene and in his plea. And I think the girl's life is ruined no matter how much time he gets. Its a tragedy all around.

A 14 year old is a boy. A 20 year old man is not a boy anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

You need to stop saying that. He wasn't just a young person who made a terrible mistake. You're misleading people into thinking that he was pretty innocent. You've said this several times and been taken to task for it; most disagree with you. Are you his mother?

But an adult who is 2 years out of high school who has had numerous driving incidents, hasn't cleaned up his act, hasn't tried to take a driving course, and then goes 80 miles over the speed limit on a local non-highway road, and kills 3 people is not just a terrible mistake. It's criminal negligence and should be treated the same as any other manslaughter case. Calling this a terrible mistake minimizes his fault in this. That suggests that he couldn't have thought that what he was doing would hurt someone. 15-20 miles over the speed limit that injures someone by accident is a terrible mistake. 80 miles over the speed limit on a local road with crossing traffic and traffic lights is homicidal and criminally negligent. Worlds apart.

This.

[Anonymous]

To 17:41... I'm happy your brothers never killed anyone. However, if they had, they would have been guilty of a horrific offense. Not a terrible lapse in judgement.

I'm happy your brothers never killed anyone not for their sake. Or yours. Or your parents. But the INNOCENT PEOPLE who would have paid the price for their dumb-assness.

And many more than 4 lives were ruined. The 3 people who paid the ultimate price. The daughter. The grandparents she is now living with lost a child & their spouse and grandson. The many friends that Tommy must have had at school. He had a bright future. Perhaps the citizens of our state/country lost out as well.

Have you ever been through loss? You don't "get over" people being gone. You just learn to deal with it.

Hopefully, other lives that have been ruined include this dude's parents who enabled him time and time again. And the family's attorney who got him off so many charges. Oh, and this dude, too. But honestly, he is a waste of air.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

You need to stop saying that. He wasn't just a young person who made a terrible mistake. You're misleading people into thinking that he was pretty innocent. You've said this several times and been taken to task for it; most disagree with you. Are you his mother?

But an adult who is 2 years out of high school who has had numerous driving incidents, hasn't cleaned up his act, hasn't tried to take a driving course, and then goes 80 miles over the speed limit on a local non-highway road, and kills 3 people is not just a terrible mistake. It's criminal negligence and should be treated the same as any other manslaughter case. Calling this a terrible mistake minimizes his fault in this. That suggests that he couldn't have thought that what he was doing would hurt someone. 15-20 miles over the speed limit that injures someone by accident is a terrible mistake. 80 miles over the speed limit on a local road with crossing traffic and traffic lights is homicidal and criminally negligent. Worlds apart.

That was my first post on this thread since the initial incident (ask Jeff). I haven't even read the other responses but I'm sorry if knowing multiple people (who aren't related to victim or perpetrator) think this.

I'm not minimizing fault. It wasn't intentional therefore it was a mistake. A horrible one he deserves to pay for. But accidentally killing three people and feeling terrible about it describes a different kind of human than one that purposefully kills three people or who accidentally killed people and feels no remorse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

You can acknowledge that he did a terrible thing that ruined four lives in addition to his own, that he deserves to be severely punished for that and not think he's a terrible person. A lot of 20 year old boys drive recklessly and the culture in Potomac with parents who equip these irresponsible kids with high powered vehicles contributes to this crap. He didn't set out to murder people, intent does matter when you're talking about the quality of a human being.

I am neither his parents nor mentally ill. What I am is someone who had three brothers grow up in that area and know exactly the type of stuff young privileged boys with loose supervision and fast cars can get into. My brothers never killed anyone but if you asked me if I thought they ever broke 100 on river when acting like stupid aholes? I'd probably bet on it. They're not bad people and would never do that today, but boys from age 14-25? They're reckless.

I think his life is ruined no matter how many years he gets considering the guilt he expressed at the scene and in his plea. And I think the girl's life is ruined no matter how much time he gets. Its a tragedy all around.

A 14 year old is a boy. A 20 year old man is not a boy anymore.

It's on the edge and if you don't think that you don't know many 20 year old boys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To 17:41... I'm happy your brothers never killed anyone. However, if they had, they would have been guilty of a horrific offense. Not a terrible lapse in judgement.

I'm happy your brothers never killed anyone not for their sake. Or yours. Or your parents. But the INNOCENT PEOPLE who would have paid the price for their dumb-assness.

And many more than 4 lives were ruined. The 3 people who paid the ultimate price. The daughter. The grandparents she is now living with lost a child & their spouse and grandson. The many friends that Tommy must have had at school. He had a bright future. Perhaps the citizens of our state/country lost out as well.

Have you ever been through loss? You don't "get over" people being gone. You just learn to deal with it.

Hopefully, other lives that have been ruined include this dude's parents who enabled him time and time again. And the family's attorney who got him off so many charges. Oh, and this dude, too. But honestly, he is a waste of air.

I have been through loss. I said all their lives were ruined, does that imply getting over it?

I don't know what the difference is between "offense" and "lack of judgment." Acting recklessly is simply not the same as acting with intent.

I find it strange that someone expressing sadness over the entire situation makes you all so angry. None of you have ever texted while driving? Drove home after one too many? Took your eyes off the road while your kid screamed at you? Drive too fast? I'm not saying the kid should get off or get a light sentence. But you all should be grateful that in one of your less attentive moments you didn't accidentally kill someone. It happens everyday. Acknowledging this persons' humanity isn't a betrayal to the victims. He should pay, but he's also a person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Do we know whether the speeder even had his lights on or not? He doesn't sound responsible enough for even that.

That model of BMW has automatic headlights, and daytime running lights. Some illumination would have been on. The crash report also states he flashed his high beams at the Volt (not clear if before it started to cross or not).

Okay, but usually, doesn't "flashing your lights" tell the other person to proceed (not a warning, but a "go ahead")? This kid isn't very smart.

Flashing your lights at someone on the highway means "get out of my way"....normally the car in front is going too slow for the car behind. I assume he was flashing the volt so it would stay out of the way...

No, flashing your lights at oncoming traffic does mean go ahead. If you are on a highway BEHIND someone and flash your lights, it is a (rude) signal for them to get into the righthand, slower lane so you can pass.

It's actually not rude. What's rude is camping in the left lane like it's your birthright. I'm especially looking at you, Maryland drivers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Post article says the plea is not binding and he could back out on August 8. Hopefully he will not go to trial and hopefully the judge gives him at least the 30 years. And hopefully his family's attorney doesn't somehow get this overturned or reduced to 2 days or something.

Could he get a jury trial? Sorry if this was already covered.

Assuming he backs out of his guilty plea, of course. A defendant is entitled to a trial by jury. In his case, however, I would waive that right and ask for a bench trial.

The post also says he's completely distressed, admitted at the scene that it was all his fault and is willingly facing the consequences. It was a terrible accident and it sounds like he's going to live with it for the rest of his life (rightfully).

I bet he gets a moderate/light sentence. Remorse goes a long way with judges. And he wasn't drunk

Honestly it doesn't seem like he's a terrible person, just that he made a terrible mistake.

Are you this young man's parents or are you just mentally ill? He is a repeat offender who wiggled away each time till he murdered three innocent people.

You can acknowledge that he did a terrible thing that ruined four lives in addition to his own, that he deserves to be severely punished for that and not think he's a terrible person. A lot of 20 year old boys drive recklessly and the culture in Potomac with parents who equip these irresponsible kids with high powered vehicles contributes to this crap. He didn't set out to murder people, intent does matter when you're talking about the quality of a human being.

I am neither his parents nor mentally ill. What I am is someone who had three brothers grow up in that area and know exactly the type of stuff young privileged boys with loose supervision and fast cars can get into. My brothers never killed anyone but if you asked me if I thought they ever broke 100 on river when acting like stupid aholes? I'd probably bet on it. They're not bad people and would never do that today, but boys from age 14-25? They're reckless.

I think his life is ruined no matter how many years he gets considering the guilt he expressed at the scene and in his plea. And I think the girl's life is ruined no matter how much time he gets. Its a tragedy all around.

Excellent post re why parents need to be PARENTS and not just friends handing out expensive gifts, ignoring bad behavior, and using their money to prevent their teenagers from accepting responsibility when needed.