FCPS comprehensive boundary review

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Many of the posts on this thread are from Langley families not wanting to be redistricted to Herndon or West Springfield families not wanting to be redistricted to Lewis.

They are prepared to throw the School Board a bone in the form of redistricting OTHER families in split feeders and attendance islands.

Those families may or may not want to be redistricted, or in some cases moving those families could weaken schools.

They should not move kids just so they can declare their boundary study a success while placating the noisiest parents from Langley and West Springfield.

I think rezoning kids in split feeders and attendance islands from West Springfield HS to equally desirable Lake Braddock is very different from what you are describing.

There is so much community overlap between LBSS and WSHS, and the schools are virtually equal in quality, rigor, facilities, sports, activities and academic programs.

It would not "weaken" either school, and it would benefit the Sangster families in that one neighborhood that goes to WSHS, as well as the one far off attendance island neighborhood that passes several elementary schools to get to Keene Mill, bringing it closer to both the elementary school, but also the middle and high school.

Advocating for that as a solution to avoid unwanted rezoning is not even a little bit of what you are implying.

It would be a non controversial rezoning that addresses WSHS capacity, closes split feeders and attendance islands, keeps kids in their communities and friend groups, gives families a truly equivalent school experience , and does not impact property values at all.

These are good points and if parents in those islands would happily move over to LBSS there is no reason not to clean up those boundaries.

Other situations may pose different issues, and people should pay attention. Because others may see themselves offered up against their will by people looking to throw the School Board members an opportunity to save face (while looking to avoid being redistricted themselves).

Like the hypocrite who is on BRAC and is on record being in favor of equity redistricting as long as it is not her kids?

Did I mention she’s a hypocrite?

Also, I wonder if the board is going to move Sandy Anderson’s kids or Kyle McDaniel’s? I won’t hold my breath.

This is the question that needs to be asked. How exactly will any proposed changes impact SB members' zoned schools or property values?

Isn’t Sandy zoned for Silverbrook/South County? Interesting to see if there are any proposals to move the Route 1 corridor area of Lorton from Hayfield to South County.

Anderson might have the ulterior motive of moving Hunt Valley to SoCo, not to Lewis as some on this board keep insisting is the plan. That would benefit SoCo, and in tbe end improve the housing value of homes zoned for SoCo. It is a much more likely scenario than moving low income, ESL Route 1 families to SoCo, as school board members are known to rezone neighborhoods to improve their own school rankings and home values.

But this does nothing to improve Lewis. What else can Lewis draw from?

Why does everything have to be about Lewis? Why is it the most important high school in the county? We don't care about improving Hayfield or other schools. What makes Lewis so unbelieveably special that we have to focus so much time, money and attention on it?

The one or two very loud posters on here who own homes zones for Lewis and want to see their property values go up if high income areas are rezoned into their school LOL.

But really - with Lewis’s small capacity, they can’t actually absorb that many more students to make the school’s demographics change all that much.

Property values between Lewis and WSHS are similar. No one is coveting your 70s split level.

Ok, then why are 1) certain people on here all up in their feelings about the importance of rezoning WSHS neighborhoods/schools to Lewis, and 2) insistent that it must be WS kids and not those from nearby Edison or Hayfield? It’s the property values and the perceived “prestige” of certain schools.

DP. I think it’s just because WS has over 1000 more kids than Lewis. Neither Edison nor Hayfield has as many kids in 9-12 as WSHS. If it were Edison rather than WS with 2800 kids now people would be bringing it up first.

Edisons buildings, particularly the square footage of individual classerroms, is much smaller than WSHS.

WSHS has larger classrooms, so they can fit more kids in the rooms without being or feeling overcrowded.

You are doing the simple math.

You cannot compare raw student body count, or even number of classrooms.

The square footage of the classrooms matter.

Lewis could have 1800 students, and feel far more crowded than WSHS at 2700 because of the size of the individual classrooms and hallways.

WSHS can easily handle 2800 students without trailers and without feeling overcrowded. Edison would have to bring in a complete fleet of trailers to squeeze in 2800 students.

I was just explaining why people tend to compare Lewis's situation with West Springfield, rather than with Edison or Hayfield.

You can agree or disagree. Personally, I hope that, if they do move any kids to Lewis, they take a hard look at enhancements to Lewis's programs that might make the school more attractive to rezoned families before doing anything.

Otherwise, it sounds like West Springfield got a nicer renovation than Edison, at a time when a West Springfield graduate (Jeff Platenberg) was heading Facilities and in charge of the renovations of both West Springfield and Edison. Meanwhile Lewis got nothing. Sounds like his favoritism towards his alma mater may come back to bite others in the ass if they get redistricted.

“An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.”

"When all you've ever known is privilege, equality feels like oppression."

You may be very surprised at how this all plays out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking last night about how disruptive the superintendent/school board's timeline is. My understanding is that they are potentially coming out with changes this spring to implement in the fall. Kids are choosing classes and meeting deadlines NOW. Moving kids to a different school in April means they are losing out on available electives, not having time to choose APs, not having time to try to pupil place at a different school if their APs/electives aren't offered at the new school. Even at the middle school level, which I've been less concerned about, they are doing middle school visits now, auditioning for band and orchestra placement, starting to readjust friend groups at split feeders to reflect which school kids go to.

Just really stinks all around. They should be required to let families know before winter break the year before they make any changes.

This is a very good point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some people here think very highly of themselves. Maybe a superiority complex. It just comes off like that. I hope I am wrong.

The school board wanting to move them to improve metrics etc. doesn't help with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

Really? Please explain what happens to Carson, Franklin, Holmes, Kilmer, Poe and Thoreau MS with no split feeders.

The school board assigns a high school for each MS to feed into. Some of them might feed into the same school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

I’ve HEARD through various channels that there are a few advocacy groups that are influential in keeping the AAP centers going. Fairfax County Association for the Gifted was one. They won’t be eliminated any time soon. It seems like the hope right now is getting LLIV into all schools, pushing for kids to stay at their local schools, and then maybe, eventually, 10-15+ years into the future, reducing the number of ES AAP centers. MS AAP may be eliminated sooner if the amount of honors classes increases.

With a very minimal exception, LLIV *is* in all elementary schools. They should focus on getting it into the ones that remain and then eliminate centers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

Really? Please explain what happens to Carson, Franklin, Holmes, Kilmer, Poe and Thoreau MS with no split feeders.

The school board assigns a high school for each MS to feed into. Some of them might feed into the same school.

"A" high school? Two middle schools near me both "feed" into four.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Many of the posts on this thread are from Langley families not wanting to be redistricted to Herndon or West Springfield families not wanting to be redistricted to Lewis.

They are prepared to throw the School Board a bone in the form of redistricting OTHER families in split feeders and attendance islands.

Those families may or may not want to be redistricted, or in some cases moving those families could weaken schools.

They should not move kids just so they can declare their boundary study a success while placating the noisiest parents from Langley and West Springfield.

Wtaf. Go back and read the last page and a half. No one from Langley is throwing anyone else under the bus.

We know you like to hate on Langley, but that’s pretty close to slander, my dear.

If you want to advocate to mess with other kids, whatever. But no need to LIE.

You know, I used to think the “noisiest voices” didn’t deserve to be placated. Then the last election happened and many USA citizens didn’t vote, and seemed to not care. Listening to people who don’t/can’t show up and guessing what is on their mind is impossible.

In our democracy showing up and using your voice is part of our job as citizens, not something to be derided.

Sure, speak up, be active, and work to crush this entire initiative if you think it's misguided.

But don't throw others under the redistricting bus just because you think they may be softer targets.

DP. Who are you even talking about? Where’s your evidence that anyone from Langley has “thrown others under the redistricting bus”? You have no idea who is posting here. And it seems like you’re the one advocating for “this entire initiative.”

She’s a troll that hates Langley. Makes crap up to try to bring readers to her side. No one from Langley is pushing boundary changes. We want this junk to go away.

+100
I don't want my kids rezoned; nor do I want anyone else's. There are certain people who are rabidly pushing rezoning and they clearly have ulterior motives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

I’ve HEARD through various channels that there are a few advocacy groups that are influential in keeping the AAP centers going. Fairfax County Association for the Gifted was one. They won’t be eliminated any time soon. It seems like the hope right now is getting LLIV into all schools, pushing for kids to stay at their local schools, and then maybe, eventually, 10-15+ years into the future, reducing the number of ES AAP centers. MS AAP may be eliminated sooner if the amount of honors classes increases.

Excellent! FCPS absolutely needs the centers to stay open in order to provide strong cohorts of advanced students for those who need it.

BS. These students can receive advanced instruction within their own neighborhood schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

I’ve HEARD through various channels that there are a few advocacy groups that are influential in keeping the AAP centers going. Fairfax County Association for the Gifted was one. They won’t be eliminated any time soon. It seems like the hope right now is getting LLIV into all schools, pushing for kids to stay at their local schools, and then maybe, eventually, 10-15+ years into the future, reducing the number of ES AAP centers. MS AAP may be eliminated sooner if the amount of honors classes increases.

Excellent! FCPS absolutely needs the centers to stay open in order to provide strong cohorts of advanced students for those who need it.

You do not need centers to have a good cohort of advanced students. If you need centers, go back to the GT program. AAP is not that.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

I’ve HEARD through various channels that there are a few advocacy groups that are influential in keeping the AAP centers going. Fairfax County Association for the Gifted was one. They won’t be eliminated any time soon. It seems like the hope right now is getting LLIV into all schools, pushing for kids to stay at their local schools, and then maybe, eventually, 10-15+ years into the future, reducing the number of ES AAP centers. MS AAP may be eliminated sooner if the amount of honors classes increases.

Excellent! FCPS absolutely needs the centers to stay open in order to provide strong cohorts of advanced students for those who need it.

BS. These students can receive advanced instruction within their own neighborhood schools.

Nope. Centers are superior to the local level IV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO, they should eliminate all AAP centers and all split feeders. Make each school a neighborhood school. Have AP in all schools. Changing boundaries shouldn’t even be a discussion until those things are complete.

I’ve HEARD through various channels that there are a few advocacy groups that are influential in keeping the AAP centers going. Fairfax County Association for the Gifted was one. They won’t be eliminated any time soon. It seems like the hope right now is getting LLIV into all schools, pushing for kids to stay at their local schools, and then maybe, eventually, 10-15+ years into the future, reducing the number of ES AAP centers. MS AAP may be eliminated sooner if the amount of honors classes increases.

Excellent! FCPS absolutely needs the centers to stay open in order to provide strong cohorts of advanced students for those who need it.

You do not need centers to have a good cohort of advanced students. If you need centers, go back to the GT program. AAP is not that.

Yes centers are needed. Most schools do not have enough kids to qualify as advanced to make a solid cohort and definitely not enough to make up a class without inviting other non advanced students to make up the difference.

No, what each school needs is a flexible grouping system - advanced, grade-level, remedial - for all four core subjects. Students should be able to move up (or down) as needed. There are plenty of kids who are "non-advanced" across the board, and many of those kids are actually in AAP, which is ridiculous. Every child has strengths and weaknesses, and flexible groupings would allow *everyone* to receive appropriate instruction.
DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people here think very highly of themselves. Maybe a superiority complex. It just comes off like that. I hope I am wrong.

The school board wanting to move them to improve metrics etc. doesn't help with that.

The bar is low for what will improve those schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Foe thise that keep repeating they left the Dem party because of boundaries, or are staunch repub and against "equity ".....i really belive you'll be shocked at the outcomes. Dems might care a little bit about your feelings and the fact that you bought your house for a school, but repubs will be ruthless and make it painful for all. Will say that a few years of pain is worth it to right size everything.
Translation = don't care about you or your house value or why you bought your house, and don't even think about grandfathering. Will really just look at numbers and cut and move students to course correct.

Signed,
An independent that sees false grandstanding on both sides of the political spectrum

Word salad. Everyone with kids buys their house with the school district in mind. That's a fact across the nation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of the posts on this thread are from Langley families not wanting to be redistricted to Herndon or West Springfield families not wanting to be redistricted to Lewis.

They are prepared to throw the School Board a bone in the form of redistricting OTHER families in split feeders and attendance islands.

Those families may or may not want to be redistricted, or in some cases moving those families could weaken schools.

They should not move kids just so they can declare their boundary study a success while placating the noisiest parents from Langley and West Springfield.

I think rezoning kids in split feeders and attendance islands from West Springfield HS to equally desirable Lake Braddock is very different from what you are describing.

There is so much community overlap between LBSS and WSHS, and the schools are virtually equal in quality, rigor, facilities, sports, activities and academic programs.

It would not "weaken" either school, and it would benefit the Sangster families in that one neighborhood that goes to WSHS, as well as the one far off attendance island neighborhood that passes several elementary schools to get to Keene Mill, bringing it closer to both the elementary school, but also the middle and high school.

Advocating for that as a solution to avoid unwanted rezoning is not even a little bit of what you are implying.

It would be a non controversial rezoning that addresses WSHS capacity, closes split feeders and attendance islands, keeps kids in their communities and friend groups, gives families a truly equivalent school experience , and does not impact property values at all.

These are good points and if parents in those islands would happily move over to LBSS there is no reason not to clean up those boundaries.

Other situations may pose different issues, and people should pay attention. Because others may see themselves offered up against their will by people looking to throw the School Board members an opportunity to save face (while looking to avoid being redistricted themselves).

Like the hypocrite who is on BRAC and is on record being in favor of equity redistricting as long as it is not her kids?

Did I mention she’s a hypocrite?

Also, I wonder if the board is going to move Sandy Anderson’s kids or Kyle McDaniel’s? I won’t hold my breath.

This is the question that needs to be asked. How exactly will any proposed changes impact SB members' zoned schools or property values?

Isn’t Sandy zoned for Silverbrook/South County? Interesting to see if there are any proposals to move the Route 1 corridor area of Lorton from Hayfield to South County.

Anderson might have the ulterior motive of moving Hunt Valley to SoCo, not to Lewis as some on this board keep insisting is the plan. That would benefit SoCo, and in tbe end improve the housing value of homes zoned for SoCo. It is a much more likely scenario than moving low income, ESL Route 1 families to SoCo, as school board members are known to rezone neighborhoods to improve their own school rankings and home values.

But this does nothing to improve Lewis. What else can Lewis draw from?

Why does everything have to be about Lewis? Why is it the most important high school in the county? We don't care about improving Hayfield or other schools. What makes Lewis so unbelieveably special that we have to focus so much time, money and attention on it?

The one or two very loud posters on here who own homes zones for Lewis and want to see their property values go up if high income areas are rezoned into their school LOL.

But really - with Lewis’s small capacity, they can’t actually absorb that many more students to make the school’s demographics change all that much.

Property values between Lewis and WSHS are similar. No one is coveting your 70s split level.

Ok, then why are 1) certain people on here all up in their feelings about the importance of rezoning WSHS neighborhoods/schools to Lewis, and 2) insistent that it must be WS kids and not those from nearby Edison or Hayfield? It’s the property values and the perceived “prestige” of certain schools.

DP. I think it’s just because WS has over 1000 more kids than Lewis. Neither Edison nor Hayfield has as many kids in 9-12 as WSHS. If it were Edison rather than WS with 2800 kids now people would be bringing it up first.

Edisons buildings, particularly the square footage of individual classerroms, is much smaller than WSHS.

WSHS has larger classrooms, so they can fit more kids in the rooms without being or feeling overcrowded.

You are doing the simple math.

You cannot compare raw student body count, or even number of classrooms.

The square footage of the classrooms matter.

Lewis could have 1800 students, and feel far more crowded than WSHS at 2700 because of the size of the individual classrooms and hallways.

WSHS can easily handle 2800 students without trailers and without feeling overcrowded. Edison would have to bring in a complete fleet of trailers to squeeze in 2800 students.

I was just explaining why people tend to compare Lewis's situation with West Springfield, rather than with Edison or Hayfield.

You can agree or disagree. Personally, I hope that, if they do move any kids to Lewis, they take a hard look at enhancements to Lewis's programs that might make the school more attractive to rezoned families before doing anything.

Otherwise, it sounds like West Springfield got a nicer renovation than Edison, at a time when a West Springfield graduate (Jeff Platenberg) was heading Facilities and in charge of the renovations of both West Springfield and Edison. Meanwhile Lewis got nothing. Sounds like his favoritism towards his alma mater may come back to bite others in the ass if they get redistricted.

“An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.”

"When all you've ever known is privilege, equality feels like oppression."

Oh dear. You are saying it “sounds like” West Springfield got a “nicer” renovation that Edison because some weird alumni thing you have, but it seems you haven’t even seen either school to compare and are blaming and naming some FCPS official. And then you are happy that kids are going to pay the price for “favoritism”. That isn’t right and I’m calling you out on it.

Me? I teach low income children in APS in a run down mouse infested building last outfitted in the 1980s. Our HVAC breaks, the carpet stinks, but we still manage to have a good time and learn. We do this even though big shiny new schools like Discovery elementary look much better. Bitterness only works if you agree to it and think your allotment is bad. Don’t take your bitterness out on kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Foe thise that keep repeating they left the Dem party because of boundaries, or are staunch repub and against "equity ".....i really belive you'll be shocked at the outcomes. Dems might care a little bit about your feelings and the fact that you bought your house for a school, but repubs will be ruthless and make it painful for all. Will say that a few years of pain is worth it to right size everything.
Translation = don't care about you or your house value or why you bought your house, and don't even think about grandfathering. Will really just look at numbers and cut and move students to course correct.

Signed,
An independent that sees false grandstanding on both sides of the political spectrum

If the all Democratic school board is going to sabotage my family’s choice of school pyramid, then I’ll happily support the alternative party that defunds public schools to give me more money when I send my kids elsewhere.

It’s the adult version of taking my ball and going home. Thing is, the Dems absolutely need families like mine to make public schools work, and we are the exact families that they are targeting with the boundary changes.

Righ, take your ball and go home....and find out you'll get $100 per kid as a voucher. Good luck with the wishful thinking.

All the while private schools will just raise their tuitions, to make more money, and to keep out those who really could not afford it in the first place.

I'm not the PP taking his ball and going home but there is a segment of public school families like ours who could easily afford private but choose not to pull our kids for various reasons. For those families, the amount of the voucher is irrelevant. The lever of control is having enough families pulling the dollars away from FCPS to affect change.

+1
Well said.