Handmaid's Tale Season 3

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i wonder if June can stay in a house with a widowed man. Seems to me that’s a no. If kids cannot stay with a widowed woman then a single man and a handmaid in his house would be very improper

I thought the same things.

I feel like not enough time will go by for it to be an issue/he might just get another wife?

I don’t think that he would marry again if he could avoid it. Eleanor was clearly the only woman he would ever freely choose to be with. No telling what he might be forced to do, though. I wonder if handmaids can be elevated in status to commander’s wife? I would assume no, since Nick didn’t jump on the opportunity when he was promoted, but he wasn’t as senior as Lawrence.

June is technically married. I doubt they'd marry a handmaiden to a commander.

Technically married outside of Gilead. I doubt they would allow a handmaid to marry as well, since they are considered fallen women and not wife material, but wonder how much pull different commanders could have to break that rule, given that few of them actually care about the doctrine if it doesn’t serve their purposes. It seemed like Winslow, for example, was powerful enough to change the rules rather than just follow them.

The commander make the rules. They clearly don't follow them and rules don't apply to them.

[Anonymous]

I think it would be harder to control Handmaids if there was the possibility they could be elevated to Wives. How do you hold down a woman to be raped by your husband and then take away her newborn if you think that in two years, she might be your peer?

If you’ve ever read The Rainbow Cadenza
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rainbow_Cadenza
you’ll notice that the author avoided this problem, by forcing ALL women between certain ages serve a couple years as state sex slaves/comfort women. After this service, the women rose in social stature. The women who were shamed and punished were those who refused to serve. Thus, no animosity between the female governing elite (gynecracy?)

BTW, extreme trigger warning if you read The Rainbow Cadenza. Rape and sexual exploitation are at the heart of it. I read it along with THT in college and was physically ill for days afterwards. Sometimes, some incel asshole or the other proposes a system similar to that in the novel so be careful googling it, too.

[Anonymous]

Where is nick?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Where is nick?

Chicago

[Anonymous]

I wonder what would happen if June discovers that she is pregnant with Lawrence’s baby; if that would change her mind about staying in Gilead for Hannah. Who knows who the baby would be given to if she stayed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

Yes, Tuello said something to Serena when he was trying to get her to break out of Gilead about having given up the possibility of having a baby that was all her own, but that if she went to the US/Canada maybe she could. I interpreted this as if she hadn't gone to play for the enemy, she probably could have been with a husband who would have been able to give her a child, as the Canadians and Americans seem to know it is the men who are sterile.

This is an instance where the TV show and the book deviate. I was kind of horrified when they chose a then 32 yr old actress as Serena and made the whole Commander class fairly young and the women of a fertile age. The book makes it very clear that most of the Commanders and their wives are 50+, so the fertility of the Commander's wives is not in question. In a way it adds something to the future plot that Serena might have no fertility issues at all.

I don't remember where I heard this, but I must have read somewhere they were planning for about 7 seasons. If that's really the case, they're going to need more twists like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

Yes, Tuello said something to Serena when he was trying to get her to break out of Gilead about having given up the possibility of having a baby that was all her own, but that if she went to the US/Canada maybe she could. I interpreted this as if she hadn't gone to play for the enemy, she probably could have been with a husband who would have been able to give her a child, as the Canadians and Americans seem to know it is the men who are sterile.

This is an instance where the TV show and the book deviate. I was kind of horrified when they chose a then 32 yr old actress as Serena and made the whole Commander class fairly young and the women of a fertile age. The book makes it very clear that most of the Commanders and their wives are 50+, so the fertility of the Commander's wives is not in question. In a way it adds something to the future plot that Serena might have no fertility issues at all.

I don't remember where I heard this, but I must have read somewhere they were planning for about 7 seasons. If that's really the case, they're going to need more twists like that.

I assumed that when Serena was shot in the lower abdomen pre-Gilead, she would have been fully informed by the doctors how the injury affected her fertility (did she require a full hysterectomy, etc.) I don’t think that the show has really touched on that again, possibly because no matter what Serena wasn’t going to have children by Fred so it was a moot point up to this point.

I would love a few more seasons. There is so much potential there; a dive into the rise of Gilead, ripple effects of Gilead on the rest of the world, how Gilead comes to an end, rebuilding... and that doesn’t even touch on the characters and how they rebuild their lives or meet with justice post-Gilead. Maybe see what Hannah’s world is like when she’s June’s age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

Yes, Tuello said something to Serena when he was trying to get her to break out of Gilead about having given up the possibility of having a baby that was all her own, but that if she went to the US/Canada maybe she could. I interpreted this as if she hadn't gone to play for the enemy, she probably could have been with a husband who would have been able to give her a child, as the Canadians and Americans seem to know it is the men who are sterile.

This is an instance where the TV show and the book deviate. I was kind of horrified when they chose a then 32 yr old actress as Serena and made the whole Commander class fairly young and the women of a fertile age. The book makes it very clear that most of the Commanders and their wives are 50+, so the fertility of the Commander's wives is not in question. In a way it adds something to the future plot that Serena might have no fertility issues at all.

I don't remember where I heard this, but I must have read somewhere they were planning for about 7 seasons. If that's really the case, they're going to need more twists like that.

I assumed that when Serena was shot in the lower abdomen pre-Gilead, she would have been fully informed by the doctors how the injury affected her fertility (did she require a full hysterectomy, etc.) I don’t think that the show has really touched on that again, possibly because no matter what Serena wasn’t going to have children by Fred so it was a moot point up to this point.

I would love a few more seasons. There is so much potential there; a dive into the rise of Gilead, ripple effects of Gilead on the rest of the world, how Gilead comes to an end, rebuilding... and that doesn’t even touch on the characters and how they rebuild their lives or meet with justice post-Gilead. Maybe see what Hannah’s world is like when she’s June’s age.

Oh, you are so right! I completely forgot that Serena had also been shot in the abdomen and that could have been a complicating factor, no doubt! But I think you're right, they wouldn't have explored that aspect more as her reproducing was basically off the table entirely as long as she was married to Fred.

There is a lot more potential and I would like to see them explore that. I just need their writing to keep up so it doesn't feel like it is just a cash cow that drags things along. I thought this season was not great. The past few episodes have been good, but there was a LOT of fluff. I still have so many questions and they spent 60% of the season doing...not much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ugh. It seems like there are so many things that just aren't that well thought out or inconsistent.

So the plan was to get Mrs. Lawrence out of Gilead because there was no medication to treat her mental illness, but somehow she has access to enough pills to overdose??

I thought that too. It may have been sleeping or other pills and not the mental health ones. It did seem odd.

They'd established that the Martha's had been smuggling pills for her so I just assumed she had hoarded some of them, or she ran out of some before others. It didn't bother me tbh as much as the sort of vagueness about her mental illness in general and why it would explain (with all the trauma of course) her behavior.

Yes, and I'd say this about Janine too--was never clear what sort of mental illness either one was supposed to have (and I'm a mental health professional!). It's as if the show writers/producers had this idea that people with mental illness are just sort of childlike and confused. I can't imagine they consulted any mental health experts when crafting these characters.

I always assumed that she had a mental breakdown and just never fully recovered. But brain damage makes sense. I doubt they were gentle when removing an eye. And likely beat her also.

I haven't read the book, though--is Janine's portrayal pretty close to the book?

Janine came into the Red Center that first time like a bada$$, and not a dimwit. Heckling the Aunts got her a severe punishment, and her behavior was forever altered after that. I have always wondered if she was brain damaged, deliberately or otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Janine didn’t cause problems and didn’t lose an eye at the Red Center in the book.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

Between the commanders and older wives? Why do you think that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

The wives aren’t necessarily infertile. They are just the Gilead elite who either helped bring Gilead to power or married someone who did. Most of them are infertile, and they have the power to force fertile “fallen” women to breed for them. There are also the econowives, who are not considered fallen, may or may not be infertile, and don’t have the power to force anyone to breed for them.

I think once Nick became a commander he no longer was subject to forced marriage, but would be considered a good catch for one of the other commander’s daughters, probably.

They only check the woman and assume the men are fertile. So in less the woman has an affair, if she is with an infertile man, she will be deemed infertile and the blame. Many are older woman who are past their prime years of having kids.

I think most are arranged marriages.

I don’t think we’ve met any commanders except for Nick who weren’t married pre-Gilead.

Between the commanders and older wives? Why do you think that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

There was an episode last season about a commander that had gotten his wife pregnant. He was promoted. I don't think we have seen them this season though. It was the only commander who was not white that we have seen I think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought Wives were all infertile. Have we ever seen a life with biological children. I doubt they’d give up a breeding woman to the exclusive use of a single Commander. That’s a good incentive for marrying off the young Daughters to young loyal men like Nick.

There was an episode last season about a commander that had gotten his wife pregnant. He was promoted. I don't think we have seen them this season though. It was the only commander who was not white that we have seen I think.

Thanks! Interesting. Were they younger than the Waterfords?