What makes a classroom education elite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oftentimes, you can access course syllabus’s online. Try to find a similar course, like intro micro or macro, and compare course pace, material studied, and course requirements. Generally, the better schools will cover more material overall and more primary material, and require more papers. This reflects the caliber of the students, who can move through the material quickly, unpack material themselves, and make sophisticated written arguments about the material.

Small classes encourage more participation and direct professor involvement. Professors (not graduate students) teach and provide context and sophisticated insights into the material, and sometimes invite esteemed individuals to discuss class-relevant material.

Overall - both faculty and students - are working at a higher level and faster pace because they’re smart, motivated, curious, and want to make a difference in the world.

People at the best schools are not interested in just making a living/money in an ordinary career/job; they want to work on bigger issues on a bigger stage to make a difference in the world. So, another part of the difference is the overall motivation and attitude of everyone on campus, which will impact your student because students tend to look to faculty and peers, among others, for role models.

Is that why so many of them go into consulting and high finance?

Yes, because both paths provide great training for starting your own thing, going into government, jumping into senior leadership in industry, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Transplant to DC from Western Europe with kids in middle school. I am trying to learn more about college/university life in the US since it is so different from back home.

There is a lot of discussion on this forum about elite schools and the various opportunities they offer outside the classroom, especially professionally. But what I am trying to understand, since I’ll be paying for an education, is what is it about the classroom experience at these schools that provides kids with an elite education? If economics, for example, is taught from the same textbook at Princeton vs Penn State, what makes the Princeton classroom experience elite?

It's the peers and the faculty. Real example: DC at an ivy, best friend from high school at a LAC between 20 and 30. Course was a humanities course with a different name, used the same text. Both courses had 12-18 students. LAC course discussed the text readings throughout the semester, covered almost all of the textbook, wrote 3 papers, had great discussions. DC's professor assigned readings such that they finished the entire textbook in the first 6 weeks, spent the rest of the time reading and analyzing primary sources comparing and contrasting the points in the text and reasoning through the details. The depth of discussion was deeper. Papers required were over double the length required at the LAC, the reading per week expected was triple that of the LAC.
For stem: compare and contrast syllabi, p-sets and exams from multivariable calc or organic chem at a regular college vs an elite: it is night and day as far as the pace, depth, breadth and complexity covered. Knowing a professor who has taught at both is helpful. We have an ivy professor in the family. Their insight into students and expectations across different schools (their phd, post docs, guest lecturer and now tenure spot were different places).

A textbook? Or a book book?

Same question here from a history/poli sci major at HYPSM. I don't recall any textbooks. A typical class would have up to 12 books.

+1

That was my experience as well. And, of course, you had the required reading of 12 books plus the additional recommended reading of 20+ books

Yes! Memories! I never touched the recommended readings, and I always wondering if anyone else did. I also learned the open secret that you didn't even need to read all of the "required" reading either. And that learning what to read and what you could skim/skip was a useful and necessary skill. But I digress.

I read all the readings at my LAC. Lots of reading, but not an unreasonable amount. No need to skim/skip until grad school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Transplant to DC from Western Europe with kids in middle school. I am trying to learn more about college/university life in the US since it is so different from back home.

There is a lot of discussion on this forum about elite schools and the various opportunities they offer outside the classroom, especially professionally. But what I am trying to understand, since I’ll be paying for an education, is what is it about the classroom experience at these schools that provides kids with an elite education? If economics, for example, is taught from the same textbook at Princeton vs Penn State, what makes the Princeton classroom experience elite?

It's the peers and the faculty. Real example: DC at an ivy, best friend from high school at a LAC between 20 and 30. Course was a humanities course with a different name, used the same text. Both courses had 12-18 students. LAC course discussed the text readings throughout the semester, covered almost all of the textbook, wrote 3 papers, had great discussions. DC's professor assigned readings such that they finished the entire textbook in the first 6 weeks, spent the rest of the time reading and analyzing primary sources comparing and contrasting the points in the text and reasoning through the details. The depth of discussion was deeper. Papers required were over double the length required at the LAC, the reading per week expected was triple that of the LAC.
For stem: compare and contrast syllabi, p-sets and exams from multivariable calc or organic chem at a regular college vs an elite: it is night and day as far as the pace, depth, breadth and complexity covered. Knowing a professor who has taught at both is helpful. We have an ivy professor in the family. Their insight into students and expectations across different schools (their phd, post docs, guest lecturer and now tenure spot were different places).

A textbook? Or a book book?

Same question here from a history/poli sci major at HYPSM. I don't recall any textbooks. A typical class would have up to 12 books.

+1

That was my experience as well. And, of course, you had the required reading of 12 books plus the additional recommended reading of 20+ books

Yes! Memories! I never touched the recommended readings, and I always wondering if anyone else did. I also learned the open secret that you didn't even need to read all of the "required" reading either. And that learning what to read and what you could skim/skip was a useful and necessary skill. But I digress.

I read all the readings at my LAC. Lots of reading, but not an unreasonable amount. No need to skim/skip until grad school.

And honestly, then it was skimming, not skipping. What's elite about an education where faking your way through is the norm?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oftentimes, you can access course syllabus’s online. Try to find a similar course, like intro micro or macro, and compare course pace, material studied, and course requirements. Generally, the better schools will cover more material overall and more primary material, and require more papers. This reflects the caliber of the students, who can move through the material quickly, unpack material themselves, and make sophisticated written arguments about the material.

Small classes encourage more participation and direct professor involvement. Professors (not graduate students) teach and provide context and sophisticated insights into the material, and sometimes invite esteemed individuals to discuss class-relevant material.

Overall - both faculty and students - are working at a higher level and faster pace because they’re smart, motivated, curious, and want to make a difference in the world.

People at the best schools are not interested in just making a living/money in an ordinary career/job; they want to work on bigger issues on a bigger stage to make a difference in the world. So, another part of the difference is the overall motivation and attitude of everyone on campus, which will impact your student because students tend to look to faculty and peers, among others, for role models.

Is that why so many of them go into consulting and high finance?

Yes, because both paths provide great training for starting your own thing, going into government, jumping into senior leadership in industry, etc.

+1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_former_employees_of_McKinsey_%26_Company