US News 2020 rankings

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier I idiots: Trump, Giuliani.

Tier II idiots: DCUMers posting their college tiers.

If I knew how I would engrave this on a bronze plaque and hang next to my monitor. lol +1M

But the tippy toppy tier would be reserved for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier I idiots: Trump, Giuliani.

Tier II idiots: DCUMers posting their college tiers.

If I knew how I would engrave this on a bronze plaque and hang next to my monitor. lol +1M

But the tippy toppy tier would be reserved for you.

Ha ha! This made me even happier to know the other comments got under your skin so much!

[Anonymous]

Many, if not all, of the best public universities have fallen considerably in the USN rankings over the years. In '83 and '85 when they first came out they ranked the following public schools this way:

Berkeley 5/7
Michigan 7/8
Illinois 8
Wisconsin 13
Texas (Austin) 25
William and Mary 22
North Carolina 9/11
UCLA 21
UVA 15

UCLA is the only one still about where it was and is the highest ranked public on the 2020 list. So what's changed?

[Anonymous]

The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many, if not all, of the best public universities have fallen considerably in the USN rankings over the years. In '83 and '85 when they first came out they ranked the following public schools this way:

Berkeley 5/7
Michigan 7/8
Illinois 8
Wisconsin 13
Texas (Austin) 25
William and Mary 22
North Carolina 9/11
UCLA 21
UVA 15

UCLA is the only one still about where it was and is the highest ranked public on the 2020 list. So what's changed?

The private schools rate higher in resource based metrics. Also, public funding has declined, so that has exacerbated it. Back in the first ratings it was all based on a few inputs from counselors, etc. All the schools can manipulate many of the metrics, so the top 20 has gotten baked in largely excluding publics. The UC schools have risen recently because they have improved graduation rates, which at one time significantly lagged schools like UVA and William & Mary, and also because they have a high percentage of Pell Grant recipients, which helps with the new mobility component.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tier I idiots: Trump, Giuliani.

Tier II idiots: DCUMers posting their college tiers.

If I knew how I would engrave this on a bronze plaque and hang next to my monitor. lol +1M

But the tippy toppy tier would be reserved for you.

Tippy tip imbecile......congrats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many, if not all, of the best public universities have fallen considerably in the USN rankings over the years. In '83 and '85 when they first came out they ranked the following public schools this way:

Berkeley 5/7
Michigan 7/8
Illinois 8
Wisconsin 13
Texas (Austin) 25
William and Mary 22
North Carolina 9/11
UCLA 21
UVA 15

UCLA is the only one still about where it was and is the highest ranked public on the 2020 list. So what's changed?

Wow at Ut Austin? Very hard to believe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many, if not all, of the best public universities have fallen considerably in the USN rankings over the years. In '83 and '85 when they first came out they ranked the following public schools this way:

Berkeley 5/7
Michigan 7/8
Illinois 8
Wisconsin 13
Texas (Austin) 25
William and Mary 22
North Carolina 9/11
UCLA 21
UVA 15

UCLA is the only one still about where it was and is the highest ranked public on the 2020 list. So what's changed?

Wow at Ut Austin? Very hard to believe.

UT Austin has great programs in engineering, CS, business, architecture, education, honors, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

Do note that nothing you said is applicable to top private schools. Again, a donut hole perspective, talking about matters that are not relevant to elite schools . If you go to a top college almost everyone graduates and generally within 4 not six years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

Do note that nothing you said is applicable to top private schools. Again, a donut hole perspective, talking about matters that are not relevant to elite schools . If you go to a top college almost everyone graduates and generally within 4 not six years.

No, different parts apply. The rapid increase in cost of U.S. universities since circa 1980 and the overall highest cost in the world are in part attributable to elite schools raising the ceiling of what can be charged. They have done this in pursuit of prestige (e.g. USNWR rankings) and it has contributed to the massive increase in student debt to $1.6T and increasing default rates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

Yes but its important to note where the spending is coming from if you are linking attainment to spending. The US, unlike most OECD countries, relies heavily on private/household expenditures for higher education (which just means families with money end up spending more to attend expensive schools with fancy dorms, new buildings and all the extras). The countries that are seeing their attainment levels increase are making large, PUBLIC investment in higher education so more of their citizens can afford to go.

https://jobmarketmonitor.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/capture-d_c3a9cran-2016-05-23-c3a0-08-40-41.png?w=750&h=426" border="0" class="embeddedImage" />

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

Yes but its important to note where the spending is coming from if you are linking attainment to spending. The US, unlike most OECD countries, relies heavily on private/household expenditures for higher education (which just means families with money end up spending more to attend expensive schools with fancy dorms, new buildings and all the extras). The countries that are seeing their attainment levels increase are making large, PUBLIC investment in higher education so more of their citizens can afford to go.

https://jobmarketmonitor.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/capture-d_c3a9cran-2016-05-23-c3a0-08-40-41.png?w=750&h=426" border="0" class="embeddedImage" />

https://jobmarketmonitor.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/capture-d_c3a9cran-2016-05-23-c3a0-08-40-41.png?w=750&h=426

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The public stopped funding state schools and private schools made huge investments in everything. State schools got left behind and except for donut holes top students stopped going to state schools. Also the Ivy League and other elite colleges opened up admissions to non boarding/private school kids (which to this day is very sad for the graduates of private and boarding schools). DCUM posters seemed to have missed this and other factors that have made state schools less competitive and less prestigious.

Another interpretation of what you say would be that colleges have overspent and under-delivered on their mission chasing rankings since the inception of USNWR. The U.S. has gone from having the highest college graduation rate in the industrialized world to being in the middle of the pack despite spending more per capita than any other country and having higher education costs increase faster than any other area of the economy for about 40 years.

Yes but its important to note where the spending is coming from if you are linking attainment to spending. The US, unlike most OECD countries, relies heavily on private/household expenditures for higher education (which just means families with money end up spending more to attend expensive schools with fancy dorms, new buildings and all the extras). The countries that are seeing their attainment levels increase are making large, PUBLIC investment in higher education so more of their citizens can afford to go.

https://jobmarketmonitor.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/capture-d_c3a9cran-2016-05-23-c3a0-08-40-41.png?w=750&h=426" border="0" class="embeddedImage" />

https://jobmarketmonitor.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/capture-d_c3a9cran-2016-05-23-c3a0-08-40-41.png?w=750&h=426

Yes, they have increased public spending, but the U.S. has had a runaway cost problem. Higher education spending per student (from all sources) and percent of GDP is much higher in the U.S. than other countries (South Korea is the only one close), yet graduation rates are average among OECD.

[Anonymous]

I can't figure out where USNWR is going. UCLA is a fine school overall, but for undergraduates, there really are a lot of better options.