Sidewalk in Bethesda to keep kids and adults safe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are some excellent educational resources at this link for teaching students safe pedestrian and biking practices: https://www.saferoutespartnership.org/safe-routes-school/srts-program/basics. We can all do a lot more to work with our own kids on these safety tips, and probably more via PTAs and other school forums.

I'll tell you what's endangering kids in my neighborhood: drivers. Drivers driving way too fast, drivers on phones, drivers disobeying the law by not stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks (note that ALL intersections are crosswalks, including intersections where there aren't painted crosswalks), drivers rolling through stop signs, drivers barely even slowing down to turn right on red.

Until that changes, "safe pedestrian and biking practices" basically boils down to: Try really, really hard to stay out of the way of drivers, so that they don't hit you.

I posted those resources and I totally agree with you. But until we can get our crazy neighbors to agree that our neighborhood needs sidewalks, the only think I can manage to actually affect is how my child operates when walking around. It's not a solution, but it's the one thing I can actually *do* to help keep her safe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to Pete, here's a 9-year-old, run over and killed by a schoolbus, and what does the PP focus on? How KIDS need to learn how to not get run over and killed.

Seriously, you don't think that would be helpful for kids to know?????

This is not the thread about the 9 year old. It is a thread about sidewalks. Read before you get all agitated PP.

It's helpful for kids to learn how to not get themselves run over and killed in the exactly the same way that it's helpful for women to learn how to not get themselves raped.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm the PP at the start of this post. One of the things we MUST do is to teach and reenforce -- reenforce, reenforce, reenforce, reenforce. How is a crossing guard stopping traffic that has a green light reenforcing to kids that they should wait for the light to be in their favor? They wait on the sidewalk until the flashing light changes and the street light changes. Yet the crossing guards walk out into oncoming traffic to stop it so they can cross. This does NOT reenforce safety rules.

Also, there are crossing guards at intersections with 4-way stop signs, on roads that have speed limits of 25 mph, stepping out into the street so kids can cross. These are not kids with special needs. They should be able to master simple skills like this.

PP, you know why there are crossing guards at intersections like that? Because drivers don't stop at stop signs, don't stop for pedestrians in crosswalks, and don't stop for pedestrians in crosswalks at stop signs. Let's focus on that. Licensed drivers should be able to master simple skills like that.

Agree. As long as we live in a society where people think being caught on camera or forced to follow the rules is the only way they'll do it, we can't function together. PSAs are helpful. In Montgomery County they have periodic PSAs where they talk about driver safety laws (usually in tandem with ticketing enforcement pushes).

We definitely can't have a crossing guard at every single intersection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honest to Pete, here's a 9-year-old, run over and killed by a schoolbus, and what does the PP focus on? How KIDS need to learn how to not get run over and killed.

Seriously, you don't think that would be helpful for kids to know?????

This is not the thread about the 9 year old. It is a thread about sidewalks. Read before you get all agitated PP.

It's helpful for kids to learn how to not get themselves run over and killed in the exactly the same way that it's helpful for women to learn how to not get themselves raped.

Don't waste out time on this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are some excellent educational resources at this link for teaching students safe pedestrian and biking practices: https://www.saferoutespartnership.org/safe-routes-school/srts-program/basics. We can all do a lot more to work with our own kids on these safety tips, and probably more via PTAs and other school forums.

I'll tell you what's endangering kids in my neighborhood: drivers. Drivers driving way too fast, drivers on phones, drivers disobeying the law by not stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks (note that ALL intersections are crosswalks, including intersections where there aren't painted crosswalks), drivers rolling through stop signs, drivers barely even slowing down to turn right on red.

Until that changes, "safe pedestrian and biking practices" basically boils down to: Try really, really hard to stay out of the way of drivers, so that they don't hit you.

I posted those resources and I totally agree with you. But until we can get our crazy neighbors to agree that our neighborhood needs sidewalks, the only think I can manage to actually affect is how my child operates when walking around. It's not a solution, but it's the one thing I can actually *do* to help keep her safe.

I agree. And what a sorry indictment of our society's priorities. It's more important for drivers to get to the next corner 2 seconds faster than for kids to not get run over and killed.

[Anonymous]

This situation is exactly why some parents still take and meet their kids at the bus stop even though they could walk by themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are some excellent educational resources at this link for teaching students safe pedestrian and biking practices: https://www.saferoutespartnership.org/safe-routes-school/srts-program/basics. We can all do a lot more to work with our own kids on these safety tips, and probably more via PTAs and other school forums.

I'll tell you what's endangering kids in my neighborhood: drivers. Drivers driving way too fast, drivers on phones, drivers disobeying the law by not stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks (note that ALL intersections are crosswalks, including intersections where there aren't painted crosswalks), drivers rolling through stop signs, drivers barely even slowing down to turn right on red.

Until that changes, "safe pedestrian and biking practices" basically boils down to: Try really, really hard to stay out of the way of drivers, so that they don't hit you.

I posted those resources and I totally agree with you. But until we can get our crazy neighbors to agree that our neighborhood needs sidewalks, the only think I can manage to actually affect is how my child operates when walking around. It's not a solution, but it's the one thing I can actually *do* to help keep her safe.

Exactly. Empower your children. Teach them to be safe. I tell my kids you never know if drivers are going to stop. Who gives a crap if they SHOULD stop. I want my kids to come home safe at the end of the day, not insist they have the right of way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mentioned this issue on another thread. I live on a busy street but my kids are ultimately much safer because we have proper sidewalks. The county should make sidewalks a priority, especially around schools. For example, a few years ago MCPS spent millions to construct Silver Creek Middle School, but most of the neighborhood around the school has no sidewalks.

Quite a few of us in this neighborhood put a huge effort in to try and get sidewalks about 18 months ago. We got it through a county feasibility study, but the neighborhood opposition was extraordinary. The county now won't even hold the public hearing that they're required to hold as the next step in the process. A handful of people controlling the HOA and some very vocally opposed neighbors who called council members and county staff daily have effectively shut this down. Very unkind things were said on the listserv and directly to faces of families and neighbors in support of sidewalks. It's been painful to live through and really damaging to neighborhood relationships. We dread the day that there is an accident involving a neighbor (kid or adult) that makes this seem urgent. It shouldn't take a death to get action on sidewalks. My heart just breaks today reading about the child in Bradley Hills; I can't even fathom the pain of her family, school friends, and community.

What's their problem with sidewalks?!

I live in Kentlands, where we have sidewalks throughout the entire neighborhood. It keeps everyone safer.

Specific complaints raised by neighbors: Too many trees will have to be removed; they don't want to be sued if they fail to clear the sidewalk of snow (county liability policies haven't helped here); "most" children go to private school anyway so why does it matter (wish I were joking about that one and it's not even true); no speed bumps should be installed either because it will take longer to get to the Safeway (again, wish I were joking); oh, and sidewalks reduce property values (also not true).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There are some excellent educational resources at this link for teaching students safe pedestrian and biking practices: https://www.saferoutespartnership.org/safe-routes-school/srts-program/basics. We can all do a lot more to work with our own kids on these safety tips, and probably more via PTAs and other school forums.

I'll tell you what's endangering kids in my neighborhood: drivers. Drivers driving way too fast, drivers on phones, drivers disobeying the law by not stopping for pedestrians in crosswalks (note that ALL intersections are crosswalks, including intersections where there aren't painted crosswalks), drivers rolling through stop signs, drivers barely even slowing down to turn right on red.

Until that changes, "safe pedestrian and biking practices" basically boils down to: Try really, really hard to stay out of the way of drivers, so that they don't hit you.

Well the first thing you or your kids need to do is make sure you aren't dealing with one of the drivers you described. LOOK AT THE DRIVER. I never enter the street without looking at the driver. I can't understand people who just walk into the street lost in thought. MAKE EYE CONTACT. I do this as a driver, as ell -- I look at the pedestrians and make contact. I also look at the other drivers before I go. I'm paying attention. Make sure I am -- and you can bitch all you want about how unfair it is that you HAVE to do this, but I dont get the complaining. It takes a split second. It is ingrained in me, and I am making sure it is ingrained in my kids as well.

Really not that hard and not worth complaining about something this simple.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mentioned this issue on another thread. I live on a busy street but my kids are ultimately much safer because we have proper sidewalks. The county should make sidewalks a priority, especially around schools. For example, a few years ago MCPS spent millions to construct Silver Creek Middle School, but most of the neighborhood around the school has no sidewalks.

Quite a few of us in this neighborhood put a huge effort in to try and get sidewalks about 18 months ago. We got it through a county feasibility study, but the neighborhood opposition was extraordinary. The county now won't even hold the public hearing that they're required to hold as the next step in the process. A handful of people controlling the HOA and some very vocally opposed neighbors who called council members and county staff daily have effectively shut this down. Very unkind things were said on the listserv and directly to faces of families and neighbors in support of sidewalks. It's been painful to live through and really damaging to neighborhood relationships. We dread the day that there is an accident involving a neighbor (kid or adult) that makes this seem urgent. It shouldn't take a death to get action on sidewalks. My heart just breaks today reading about the child in Bradley Hills; I can't even fathom the pain of her family, school friends, and community.

What's their problem with sidewalks?!

I live in Kentlands, where we have sidewalks throughout the entire neighborhood. It keeps everyone safer.

Specific complaints raised by neighbors: Too many trees will have to be removed; they don't want to be sued if they fail to clear the sidewalk of snow (county liability policies haven't helped here); "most" children go to private school anyway so why does it matter (wish I were joking about that one and it's not even true); no speed bumps should be installed either because it will take longer to get to the Safeway (again, wish I were joking); oh, and sidewalks reduce property values (also not true).

Wow. Just, wow.

I would just point them to Kentlands and Lakelands as proof that none of their complaints are real.

Also, beyond the selfishness inherent in the private school comment, do they not realize that installing sidewalks is beneficial for everyone?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mentioned this issue on another thread. I live on a busy street but my kids are ultimately much safer because we have proper sidewalks. The county should make sidewalks a priority, especially around schools. For example, a few years ago MCPS spent millions to construct Silver Creek Middle School, but most of the neighborhood around the school has no sidewalks.

Quite a few of us in this neighborhood put a huge effort in to try and get sidewalks about 18 months ago. We got it through a county feasibility study, but the neighborhood opposition was extraordinary. The county now won't even hold the public hearing that they're required to hold as the next step in the process. A handful of people controlling the HOA and some very vocally opposed neighbors who called council members and county staff daily have effectively shut this down. Very unkind things were said on the listserv and directly to faces of families and neighbors in support of sidewalks. It's been painful to live through and really damaging to neighborhood relationships. We dread the day that there is an accident involving a neighbor (kid or adult) that makes this seem urgent. It shouldn't take a death to get action on sidewalks. My heart just breaks today reading about the child in Bradley Hills; I can't even fathom the pain of her family, school friends, and community.

What's their problem with sidewalks?!

I live in Kentlands, where we have sidewalks throughout the entire neighborhood. It keeps everyone safer.

Specific complaints raised by neighbors: Too many trees will have to be removed; they don't want to be sued if they fail to clear the sidewalk of snow (county liability policies haven't helped here); "most" children go to private school anyway so why does it matter (wish I were joking about that one and it's not even true); no speed bumps should be installed either because it will take longer to get to the Safeway (again, wish I were joking); oh, and sidewalks reduce property values (also not true).

When there was a sidewalk proposal in Wyngate several years ago, one of the objections was: what do we need a sidewalk for, nobody walks here anyway.

[Anonymous]

I mentioned this in the other thread-

Our area in upper MoCo does not have sidewalks. The bus pick our kids up at our driveway because MCPS and/or the bus depot said it was unsafe for our kids to walk to a bus stop and cross a busy road. Elementary school kids should not have to walk in the street to get to a bus stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mentioned this issue on another thread. I live on a busy street but my kids are ultimately much safer because we have proper sidewalks. The county should make sidewalks a priority, especially around schools. For example, a few years ago MCPS spent millions to construct Silver Creek Middle School, but most of the neighborhood around the school has no sidewalks.

Quite a few of us in this neighborhood put a huge effort in to try and get sidewalks about 18 months ago. We got it through a county feasibility study, but the neighborhood opposition was extraordinary. The county now won't even hold the public hearing that they're required to hold as the next step in the process. A handful of people controlling the HOA and some very vocally opposed neighbors who called council members and county staff daily have effectively shut this down. Very unkind things were said on the listserv and directly to faces of families and neighbors in support of sidewalks. It's been painful to live through and really damaging to neighborhood relationships. We dread the day that there is an accident involving a neighbor (kid or adult) that makes this seem urgent. It shouldn't take a death to get action on sidewalks. My heart just breaks today reading about the child in Bradley Hills; I can't even fathom the pain of her family, school friends, and community.

What's their problem with sidewalks?!

I live in Kentlands, where we have sidewalks throughout the entire neighborhood. It keeps everyone safer.

Specific complaints raised by neighbors: Too many trees will have to be removed; they don't want to be sued if they fail to clear the sidewalk of snow (county liability policies haven't helped here); "most" children go to private school anyway so why does it matter (wish I were joking about that one and it's not even true); no speed bumps should be installed either because it will take longer to get to the Safeway (again, wish I were joking); oh, and sidewalks reduce property values (also not true).

When there was a sidewalk proposal in Wyngate several years ago, one of the objections was: what do we need a sidewalk for, nobody walks here anyway.

Maybe if there were sidewalks, people would walk more!

This is one of the many reasons we live in a walkable MoCo neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can someone explain again why sidewalks keep kids safe? I've honestly never thought about them like that before. I thought it's so people could push strollers etc. Someone said if they don't have sidewalks then kids will always walk on the actual road instead to get to school. Is that right? Why don't they walk across the grass?

Because grass isn’t always available. If it is it could be wet or a car is parked there or a huge pile of leaves. There are endless reasons. My DS has to walk on Bradley Blvd when he walks home from school and it’s an extremely dangerous road with little room to walk in many areas.

[Anonymous]

I grew up in a neighborhood without sidewalks. It was very unsafe. People were hit every year. Now I live in a neighborhood with sidewalks. It's so nice. You don't have to constantly be on guard when taking a leisurely stroll. You can take your dog for a walk. You see neighbors when you're walking and chat with them or just say "hi" as you pass. It's a much nicer and friendlier environment and gives the neighborhood more of a sense of community. I can't understand why someone wouldn't want that.