will not taking calculus hinder a kid's chance at getting into a top college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous[b wrote:]OP - is your counselor trying to say it's ok not to take algebra in 8th grade?[/b] I would not agree with that - not because of calculus, but because SAT/ACT math sections go up to pre-calculus so you want your DC to have that class by junior year so they can take the tests.

No this was a math teacher, not a counselor. And she was telling a class of 8th grade geometry students (kids who are two,years ahead in math) that it was ok to not take the more advanced math class next year (that one would assume kids who are two years ahead in math would take)' if they were really certain that they didn't want to pursue a math field. My daughter who is very good at math but doesn't like it and will most likely choose an arts or humanities based major now thinks it's not necessary for her to take pre-AP Algebra II next year. What I strongly suspect is that schools along the lines of W&M and UVA would still expect to see it on a student's transcript, even if they kid was stating that they wanted to major in history or English.

This puts your original post in a different light.

I’m the one who said kids should find colleges that suit them, not go out of their way to mold themselves to suit the colleges.

But I do think kids should take normal college prep classes. For a kid like your daughter who could easily end up in Calculus BC, ending up in Calculus AB is the minimum.

People need calculus so they end up remembering enough math to buy carpet and calculate tips.

[Anonymous]

Take it year by year. Your child should be taking the hardest level they can handle that is offered to them each year, regardless of how that makes them a good candidate for a college or not.

8th grade me and junior-year me were very different people with different abilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous[b wrote:]OP - is your counselor trying to say it's ok not to take algebra in 8th grade?[/b] I would not agree with that - not because of calculus, but because SAT/ACT math sections go up to pre-calculus so you want your DC to have that class by junior year so they can take the tests.

No this was a math teacher, not a counselor. And she was telling a class of 8th grade geometry students (kids who are two,years ahead in math) that it was ok to not take the more advanced math class next year (that one would assume kids who are two years ahead in math would take)' if they were really certain that they didn't want to pursue a math field. My daughter who is very good at math but doesn't like it and will most likely choose an arts or humanities based major now thinks it's not necessary for her to take pre-AP Algebra II next year. What I strongly suspect is that schools along the lines of W&M and UVA would still expect to see it on a student's transcript, even if they kid was stating that they wanted to major in history or English.

This puts your original post in a different light.

I’m the one who said kids should find colleges that suit them, not go out of their way to mold themselves to suit the colleges.

But I do think kids should take normal college prep classes. For a kid like your daughter who could easily end up in Calculus BC, ending up in Calculus AB is the minimum.

People need calculus so they end up remembering enough math to buy carpet and calculate tips.

I hope you are not using calculous to calculate tips.

[Anonymous]

I am so sick of middle school teachers talking down to the whole class as a means of encouraging kids who are struggling. One message does not fit all kids! No matter how hard we tried to counter the message, my kids threw back at us, "My teachers say a B is a good grade, so why should I do the homework when I can get a B without it? They said life goes on if you don't have and A." An underachiever's dream teacher. Now we are on the path to have that kid with the 1600 SAT (no prep) and a slew of Bs.

[Anonymous]

A few comments on this thread:

Not taking calculus if it is offered, and more importantly dropping down a math level, will definitely be noticed by adcoms and absolutely lessen chances of admission to a highly selective college.

Now, whether or not it is smart or healthy to be concerned about that is a much more important question, and impossible to answer without knowing the kid and the family. It's completely OK to make the choice regardless of the lessening of the chances if it makes for a happier and healthier kid.

The point made about "I don't use calculus at my job!" may be one of the stupidest things I have read on this forum, and that says a lot. I don't use calculus at my job either, nor do I use History, Literature, Art, Music, Chemistry, Biology, Physics and the like, so should those be dropped also?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am so sick of middle school teachers talking down to the whole class as a means of encouraging kids who are struggling. One message does not fit all kids! No matter how hard we tried to counter the message, my kids threw back at us, "My teachers say a B is a good grade, so why should I do the homework when I can get a B without it? They said life goes on if you don't have and A." An underachiever's dream teacher. Now we are on the path to have that kid with the 1600 SAT (no prep) and a slew of Bs.

Your kids would have been the same kids regardless. A few middle school teachers do not have that much influence. If they did, there would be NO straight-A high school students coming out of the middle school your kids attended -- yet I'd be willing to be that there are. Why did they not fall victim to this talking down and your kids did?

Yours are good problems to have. A kid with Bs and a 1600 SAT will be fine and you won't go broke trying to pay for an elite college.

Try being more grateful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:irregardless

It’s a word now. Language evolves.

No. It's a combo or regardless and irrespective. Does not sound evolved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the kid's next class is Alg 2, having successfully completed Geometry, she should absolutely continue on that path.

The part people are rolling their eyes over is connecting that generally wise decision to optimizing chances for a "top 30" college for an 8th grader.

OP - tell her she is a strong student who needs to continue to take math at her level, regardless of what field or discipline she may pursue later. You have control over her course selection for a while longer.

Just please leave any college admissions rationale out of the discussion. You could, however, have her research the reasons to learn calculus -- the skills taught and applicability to various fields, STEM and non-STEM.

I don't see what is wrong with this.

Getting into a top 30 college has never been more competitive than it is now.

You need to plan ahead! You actually need to get all As in the hardest course load available to you. And even then it'll be a crap shoot for the ivies and other elite top 20 schools.

Because DCUM is hypersensitive about any parent who heaven forbid, expresses any sort of desire to have their kid attend a top school.

+1. DCUM: where mothers of mediocre children come to bond

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She needs to take math all four years of high school. If she is on track to take calculus, she should take it.

Yes, but if she bumps down to a lower level she wouldn't be in calculus her senior year. And now she has this idea that that wouldn't hurt her.

Wait, isn't she on track to take BC Calc as a junior now? Algebra 2 in 9, Precalc in 10, Calculus 11?

Yes. The point is she now thinks she doesn't have to continue this track and can bump down and take the easier math classes because of college advise that her 8th grade math teacher gave her.

But, she'll still get to Calc by 12th if she slows the pace. If she's doing well and likes math, sure keep up the pace, but if she's finding it to be too much, Calc by 12th is fine.

This. As long as she takes calc by graduation it should be fine. There are 2 options for Calc at our school. AP AB and AP BC. She can take either as a senior as long as she stays on the Honors track. My DC is in a non-honors track but we made sure DC took Algebra in 8th grade in order to have the option to take Calc senior year. Some of the students who were on the honors track have dropped into his non-honors courses because the pace is too rapid in Honors. It's clear they were pushed beyond their abilities for years and developed gaps. My DC, who was poor at math till 10th grade, is getting A's and the kids who dropped down are getting lower grades. So OP make sure your DC doesn't burn out. If she takes Calc junior year, what will she take senior year? AP stats? That's nothing special. When I was in HS I took Calc as a junior and then senior year I took more Calc at the local university but I'm not sure that's an option here, so what's the point of taking it as a junior?

[Anonymous]

You need it for many types of grad school, so even if you font need for college admission not taking it can gone back to haunt you. Learned this the hard way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You need it for many types of grad school, so even if you font need for college admission not taking it can gone back to haunt you. Learned this the hard way.

What field? I can't imagine needing to have Calc for History, English, Elementary Education for instance.

[Anonymous]

While on tour as a JUNIOR, DD was asked by several heads of departments if she had finished Calculus BC. And these were not top colleges. It is important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:While on tour as a JUNIOR, DD was asked by several heads of departments if she had finished Calculus BC. And these were not top colleges. It is important.

Is this for a stem major? I can't imagine a head of dept asking this question...or being involved in admissions tours for that matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:While on tour as a JUNIOR, DD was asked by several heads of departments if she had finished Calculus BC. And these were not top colleges. It is important.

I simply don't believe this.

[Anonymous]

One important takeaway from this thread should be that the middle school math track does, indeed, impact the student's high school transcript, and accordingly, how competitive that student's transcript is for certain college admission situations (applying to STEM, applying to top-20s, etc). Though not the case for the OP, the difference between algebra 1 in 8th vs 9th is key to getting to calc during high school. Some school districts have wacky placement systems or middle school course sequences. Seeking an appropriate middle school math placement is absolutely worth a parent's effort.