Prep material for Cogat, please suggest

[Anonymous]

Cogat is NOT an iq test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can't believe people compare COGAT vs SAT. For SAT you're expected to prepare because it's a knowledge base test. COGAT is an intelligence/IQ test that measures if a child is gifted.

Both CogAT and SAT are learned reasoning tests with scores that correlate with how successful you're likely to be in school. Neither is an IQ test. Back in the day, no one prepped for the SAT, either. The only real difference now is that you're not supposed to prep for the CogAT, whereas it's assumed that you will prep for the SAT.

I'm not surprised that there's such a strong parallel on these forums between the two tests. Both are easily prepped, the prepping will most likely increase your score somewhat, and small changes in scores can lead to huge changes in educational opportunities available to you. The excessive prepping for the CogAT has been a problem that has grossly bloated AAP, but it's not a problem that will be solved by wagging your finger at people and telling them not to prep. MoCo seems to have somewhat solved the problem. Perhaps FCPS should follow their lead.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Cogat is NOT an iq test.

This is NOT accurate. Cogat does not provide an IQ score, but does correlate with IQ, While Cogat isn't an IQ score, it is an intelligence test accepted by admission for Mensa which has an IQ requirement of top 2%.

[Anonymous]

Think about it. Why teachers are instructed to ask kids if they prepped at home for COGAT? Are juniors in high school asked if they prepped for SAT?

[Anonymous]

Here is my take on it relative to AAP. If the kid is able to prep and increase the score such that they are admitted to AAP, while not optimal, it is not a huge deal. As long as they can handle the work and pace, it is fine. The advantage of AAP is that the truly slow students are not impacting my kids education. (My DD is now out of AAP in HS; she is not at TJ)

[Anonymous]

Do an Amazon search for Cogar test prep.

Or on google.

I couldn’t find many of Amazon, but for an excellent pack of test prep books from another website. Definitely worth the time and effort.

[Anonymous]

Just a warning from over here in Montgomery County: after years of parents gaming the system, the county got fed up and changed the criteria for admission to 4th grade gifted centers. They now mostly use the scores on the MAP tests they have been taking in school all along, plus a much shorter admission test. They are trying to find out what kids' real abilities are, beyond their parents. This is what will happen in your county too if you keep prepping. School systems don't like being used and manipulated this way.

[Anonymous]

Or just use a REAL iq test like the WISC! I prepped mine for cogat and all had 135+ WISC (not prepped). Most aap kids do not have 135+ iqs.

[Anonymous]

Email your child's teacher and say you are interested in AAP if it is appropriate for your child. Ask the teacher for recommendations on how to prepare your child for the test. You could send the same email to the school's AART, or the equivalent in your county, who can also give you some good ideas.

Most of the schools also have meetings about the programs available and you can ask a lot of questions there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hello,

My son would be taking cogat in Mar ( Loudoun county). COuld you please let me know where to get the prep material for the test?

Thanks

Do a google search. There are several books on Amazon. Like most of the posters said, prepping will not make much of a difference. Where it does make a difference is in getting your child familiar with the types of questions to expect, the format of the test, etc. Any improvement in test scores are probably because your kid is now familiar with the testing process and what to expect.

I know the teachers introduce the kids to the format, etc but that's barely enough.

Be careful. Teachers do ask kids if they've seen questions or prepared at home. Kids at this age don't or can't lie no matter what. A couple of kids in our class responded positively to those questions and the teacher made a note of that. I don't know if that'll be in their record but you don't want the score to be invalid because teacher thinks he/she prepared at home.

BS. Believe me.. If my kid scores well and gets the right rating (whatever they call the teacher rating thing that's not related to test scores), there is no way the kid won't make it in. I'll make sure of that. IT IS NOT AGAINST THE LAW/RULES TO PREP. There's nothing written to that effect. It's just a story the DCUM non-preppers keep floating.

This.

Bhwahahaha... invalid because teach thinks he/she prepared at home. What a crock...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hello,

My son would be taking cogat in Mar ( Loudoun county). COuld you please let me know where to get the prep material for the test?

Thanks

Do a google search. There are several books on Amazon. Like most of the posters said, prepping will not make much of a difference. Where it does make a difference is in getting your child familiar with the types of questions to expect, the format of the test, etc. Any improvement in test scores are probably because your kid is now familiar with the testing process and what to expect.

I know the teachers introduce the kids to the format, etc but that's barely enough.

Be careful. Teachers do ask kids if they've seen questions or prepared at home. Kids at this age don't or can't lie no matter what. A couple of kids in our class responded positively to those questions and the teacher made a note of that. I don't know if that'll be in their record but you don't want the score to be invalid because teacher thinks he/she prepared at home.

BS. Believe me.. If my kid scores well and gets the right rating (whatever they call the teacher rating thing that's not related to test scores), there is no way the kid won't make it in. I'll make sure of that. IT IS NOT AGAINST THE LAW/RULES TO PREP. There's nothing written to that effect. It's just a story the DCUM non-preppers keep floating.

This.

Bhwahahaha... invalid because teach thinks he/she prepared at home. What a crock...

This is not completely untrue. I know of a family whose child's psychologist made a note of the fact that he was familiar with types of questions in the report when he was taking WISC. Their appeal didn't work. Tried the following year again with a new test score and got it. The point is that you don't want to take any chance if you really want to make it the first year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just a warning from over here in Montgomery County: after years of parents gaming the system, the county got fed up and changed the criteria for admission to 4th grade gifted centers. They now mostly use the scores on the MAP tests they have been taking in school all along, plus a much shorter admission test. They are trying to find out what kids' real abilities are, beyond their parents. This is what will happen in your county too if you keep prepping. School systems don't like being used and manipulated this way.

You aren't gaming the system by working with your kids at home. If MCPS did a better job preparing our kids and teaching, I would not feel the need to work with them at home. We do a variety of workbooks - a few pages a day. Our child's favorite is the test prep book. The teacher in 3rd this year is teaching them test prep skills. So, is that teacher gaming the system or preparing them. I don't want my child at a gifted center. Transportation/distance will interfere with activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I attended one of the info sessions beforehand and was told that kids who need to be prepped to get the scores aren't the kids who need the program in the first place.

Someone may have already said this. The problem is that the kid does not get only a numerical score, but also a percentile ranking. So let's say that your kid would score 135 on the NNAT, and be on 98th percentile without prepping (and probably be in the pool). Then 10 other kids, who would score 131 without prepping at 95th percentile, actually prep, scores 136, and are now on the 99th percentile. These kids, will not change your kids score, because 135 does not change, but the 98th percentile may become 96th or 97th percentile. And there, just because some of the other kids prep, your kid does not make the pool, and is not shining anymore.

The percentiles are rankings of scores from the highest to the lowest, and then you see what percentage of kids falls below a certain score. Than that score is associated to that percentile. So, if 99% of the kids taking the test score below your kid, then your kid scored on the 99th percentile, and is screened for the program. If other kids prep, and their score becomes even equal to your kid's score, then that 99% becomes a lower one, lets say 95, 96, 97%, etc. The percentile is not what percent the kid got right, but it is the kid's score ranking with respect to other kids' scores taking the same test.

[Anonymous]

Testing Mom has a lot of good materials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended one of the info sessions beforehand and was told that kids who need to be prepped to get the scores aren't the kids who need the program in the first place.

Someone may have already said this. The problem is that the kid does not get only a numerical score, but also a percentile ranking. So let's say that your kid would score 135 on the NNAT, and be on 98th percentile without prepping (and probably be in the pool). Then 10 other kids, who would score 131 without prepping at 95th percentile, actually prep, scores 136, and are now on the 99th percentile. These kids, will not change your kids score, because 135 does not change, but the 98th percentile may become 96th or 97th percentile. And there, just because some of the other kids prep, your kid does not make the pool, and is not shining anymore.

The percentiles are rankings of scores from the highest to the lowest, and then you see what percentage of kids falls below a certain score. Than that score is associated to that percentile. So, if 99% of the kids taking the test score below your kid, then your kid scored on the 99th percentile, and is screened for the program. If other kids prep, and their score becomes even equal to your kid's score, then that 99% becomes a lower one, lets say 95, 96, 97%, etc. The percentile is not what percent the kid got right, but it is the kid's score ranking with respect to other kids' scores taking the same test.

National percentiles won't change, but otherwise, you're correct. The in-pool cutoff is selected to capture the top 10% of FCPS students. Thanks to prepping, it's not necessarily capturing the correct top 10% of students. Keep in mind that the in-pool cutoff has been steadily increasing. In the past, 130 on any one subtest was enough to fall in the top 10% of students. FCPS kids aren't getting that much smarter in that short of a time.