Church shootings /nervous in church

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Or alternatively more people will be killed when wannabe heroes start firing and people are panicking and running all over - most people who open or conceal carry have no training in shooting under pressure.

Not if they have gone to a good instructor or the NRA range.

Oh like the good instructor in AZ a few years ago who gave a child a huge weapon she couldn't handle and then he was shot and killed by her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What state are you in? If you live in an open carry state like Texas or Virginia, there is a good chance that someone might save you if they are packing. The neighbor in Texas saved a lot of people and is a hero (even CNN calls him that). You can't tell but my husband always packs wherever he goes in Virginia - even in church. Can't do that in Maryland because there's no reciprocity. Can't do it in DC because laws are so stringent (but changing).

Or we could stop mentally ill people, or people with a history of domestic or other violence (like this guy) from getting guns in the first place. But the NRA and their lapdogs in Congress would never permit even that type of screening.

Oh, but another posted stated that you shouldn't be able to prevent a "good guy" from buying a gun if there are no convictions.. like that shooter.

The shooter in Texas did go through clearance when purchasing the gun. For some reason, the dishonorable discharge did not pop up when they ran him through ATF and FBI clearance.

The reason is because the background checks to buy a gun are joke, and in some cases, you don't even need to go through a background check. The system has too many bulletholes riddled in it.

[Anonymous]

Organize the congregation to call your congressional reps and demand stricter gun laws and improved mental health funding.

Faith demands works.

[Anonymous]

Demand that your local police departments arrest domestic abusers instead of letting them off the hook. Stop covering up for the violent among us. You think that they hit their kids and somehow it's ok because it stops there--it doesn't. It's complete madness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What state are you in? If you live in an open carry state like Texas or Virginia, there is a good chance that someone might save you if they are packing. The neighbor in Texas saved a lot of people and is a hero (even CNN calls him that). You can't tell but my husband always packs wherever he goes in Virginia - even in church. Can't do that in Maryland because there's no reciprocity. Can't do it in DC because laws are so stringent (but changing).

Or we could stop mentally ill people, or people with a history of domestic or other violence (like this guy) from getting guns in the first place. But the NRA and their lapdogs in Congress would never permit even that type of screening.

Oh, but another posted stated that you shouldn't be able to prevent a "good guy" from buying a gun if there are no convictions.. like that shooter.

The shooter spent a year in military jail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a fear that Muslims and Jews have had over their places of worship, for a long time. Many mosques and synagogues are no stranger to vandalism, or destruction of their houses of worship, and many, many threats.

I am not "happy" about any senseless violence, but it is interesting to hear Christians (particularly white Christians) talk about a feeling of fear - that is unfortunately so common and has been long standing for other groups in their houses of solace.

“It is interesting”? What on earth do you mean by that?

I mean just that. Minorities have felt this fear in their places of worship for a long time, and had a heightened sense of awareness of their vulnerable position -- even in "safe" places - that it's odd to be reminded that this fear is new and unusual for others.

Translation: we’ve had it rough so it’s funny that now you are too.

What is wrong with you?

DP.. "it's funny" in a sad way. The double standard continues... that's all. But it is true. Minorities in this country have been experiencing this kind of thing for decades.

26 people have been killed.

You: "I hate Christians so much that I will immediately go onto DCUM to gloat about some Christians feeling scared."

What's wrong with you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Organize the congregation to call your congressional reps and demand stricter gun laws and improved mental health funding.

Faith demands works.

Does it? Please show evidence.

Seems NRA grades are some of the most effective demands in the US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a fear that Muslims and Jews have had over their places of worship, for a long time. Many mosques and synagogues are no stranger to vandalism, or destruction of their houses of worship, and many, many threats.

I am not "happy" about any senseless violence, but it is interesting to hear Christians (particularly white Christians) talk about a feeling of fear - that is unfortunately so common and has been long standing for other groups in their houses of solace.

“It is interesting”? What on earth do you mean by that?

I mean just that. Minorities have felt this fear in their places of worship for a long time, and had a heightened sense of awareness of their vulnerable position -- even in "safe" places - that it's odd to be reminded that this fear is new and unusual for others.

Translation: we’ve had it rough so it’s funny that now you are too.

What is wrong with you?

The fact that you're outraged at pointing this out, highlights your immense privilege. A tragedy is always a tragedy, but it's a privileged position to be in, to only be struck with such fear today.

I'm not OP and I'm not scared. I'm just pointing out that you're making the deaths of 26 people all about you and your hatred for Christians. Pretty sick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Demand that your local police departments arrest domestic abusers instead of letting them off the hook. Stop covering up for the violent among us. You think that they hit their kids and somehow it's ok because it stops there--it doesn't. It's complete madness.

How? What is the leverage?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Demand that your local police departments arrest domestic abusers instead of letting them off the hook. Stop covering up for the violent among us. You think that they hit their kids and somehow it's ok because it stops there--it doesn't. It's complete madness.

Who on earth says it's "OK" that domestic abusers hit their kids? And in fact the shooter spent time in military jail. Is this some weird deflection by an NRA supporter, or do you seriously not understand the issue?

The point is that no violent people, domestic abusers and any people with violent records, should be GIVEN GUNS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a fear that Muslims and Jews have had over their places of worship, for a long time. Many mosques and synagogues are no stranger to vandalism, or destruction of their houses of worship, and many, many threats.

I am not "happy" about any senseless violence, but it is interesting to hear Christians (particularly white Christians) talk about a feeling of fear - that is unfortunately so common and has been long standing for other groups in their houses of solace.

“It is interesting”? What on earth do you mean by that?

I mean just that. Minorities have felt this fear in their places of worship for a long time, and had a heightened sense of awareness of their vulnerable position -- even in "safe" places - that it's odd to be reminded that this fear is new and unusual for others.

Translation: we’ve had it rough so it’s funny that now you are too.

What is wrong with you?

DP.. "it's funny" in a sad way. The double standard continues... that's all. But it is true. Minorities in this country have been experiencing this kind of thing for decades.

I would never dispute that minorities have experienced violence for hundreds of years (why do you say just decades?).

However, to wish evil and death on another group, out of revenge or smugness or whatever is motivating you, is terrible. It reminds me of all the "Kentucky Fried Americans" jokes in the Guardian (an otherwise excellent news source) following 9-11. It's the same "you deserve what you get" mentality that continues to tear this country apart. It would be great if people like you could rise above the Trump mentality of "I hate liberal elites" and "I hate Christians" and "I hate anybody who benefits from affirmative action"--it's all the same bitter, blind hatred of people who are different from you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Minister. We have a security team in our church. Most members of the team are law enforcement or military. Two are always stationed in the parking lot. Two walk around inside the building. Two are in the sanctuary. They alternate Sundays and remain on duty the entire Sunday morning. Our ushers and greeters are trained to immediately report anything suspicious to security. I do not mess around when it comes to security. All churches need a security plan.

Forgot to add - They are armed.

What denomination is this? Is it a large church or even a megachurch? I can’t imagine this happening at our church

Progressive Christian Church. Not large. We average about 400 in our Sunday morning service (membership is about 650). I would be willing to bet that the majority of our members have no idea our security team members are armed. Many are probably not even aware we even have security. The team members just quietly watch to be sure nothing looks suspicious. For example, if someone walked in with a large overcoat or a backpack, they might quickly approach the person to welcome them. Our ushers and greeters learn what to watch for as part of their training. We have a member who is a retired FBI agent. He has been a great resource in training staff members on active shooter threats.

It's awful that we have to think about these things. But anywhere large groups of people gather is a potential target. It's not just outside threats. We had a former church member make threats against the church. He was struggling with mental health issues. We took it very seriously. Unfortunately, it's just reality right now. Prayer is great. But it's not enough. This kind of threat requires action.

My parents attend a larger (about 800-1000 people each Sunday) Southern Baptist Church in the deep South. They have armed security as well. It's not uncommon anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My church is in Maryland. There are no police on site. The congregation as a whole is very liberal/anti-gun so I don't picture there being many armed parishioners. I know it's still a really low risk but my imagination runs away from me... perhaps because it's a fairly quiet/contemplative time and all of our backs are to the doors.

stop going to church. Pray at home. God will hear you no matter where you are.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When my ILs church in Florida supposedly received threats they responded by encouraging the congregants to bring their weapons to mass. I'm not kidding. God bless America I guess. SMFH.

An armed private citizen shot the murderer in Texas yesterday, apparently chasing him out of the church where he then took off and then killed himself. Obviously the level of devastation was still unthinkable, but there's nothing wrong with people who have CHLs carrying.

DP-This one time. In all of the mass shootings over the years, this was the first time anyone with a gun, a shotgun in this case (outside the church), actually was able to get off a shot.

Yes, this justifies having everyone carry guns. God Bless America, indeed. I doubt the big imaginary man in the sky would bless any of this.

+1, except for where PP called the guy in the sky “imaginary.”

Plus this shooter killed 26 people before a gun-toting “hero” (across the street) took him out. How is this a “win” for encouraging everybody to carry guns? As opposed to a simple and expedient policy of preventing a wife-beating shooter from getting a gun in the first place.

The neighbor did't "take out" the gunman. He died from a self-inflicted wound.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Or alternatively more people will be killed when wannabe heroes start firing and people are panicking and running all over - most [b]people who open or conceal carry have no training in shooting under pressure.

[/b]

Not if they have gone to a good instructor or the NRA range.

And guess what, the hero, Willeford is a member of the NRA and WAS an NRA instructor, which proved my point.