Is my child gifted? In Arlington magazine this month

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: The pool is too high. You are better to go to a High School with a less educated populace so you are a big fish in a small pond. The competition is too large here.

There is a cap on the number of students from any one area or HS. Also, everyone is white so nobody is getting affirmative action acceptances.

Wakefield?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I believe they've followed up on aap in Fairfax, and those kids haven't out performed AP students who didn't do aap. There really isn't that much at stake.
And if you are so worried that your budding north Arlington rocket scientist won't be placed into GT, move to south Arlington. It's much easier to get a GT designation at Randolf or Drew.

What study is that comparing gifted kids to kids taking AP classes in high school who weren't designated gifted?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I believe they've followed up on aap in Fairfax, and those kids haven't out performed AP students who didn't do aap. There really isn't that much at stake.
And if you are so worried that your budding north Arlington rocket scientist won't be placed into GT, move to south Arlington. It's much easier to get a GT designation at Randolf or Drew.

This isn't true. There is no study on this. I'd love to see one, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe they've followed up on aap in Fairfax, and those kids haven't out performed AP students who didn't do aap. There really isn't that much at stake.
And if you are so worried that your budding north Arlington rocket scientist won't be placed into GT, move to south Arlington. It's much easier to get a GT designation at Randolf or Drew.

This isn't true. There is no study on this. I'd love to see one, though.

+1

No longitudinal study has been done but many have asked for one to be done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that all the siblings in many of the families are all gifted--even though they have vastly different intelligence and personalities.

That should tell you something right there.

This is a school where all of the parents have advanced graduate and professional degrees--yet it's just the same families in the program.

Statistically, that isn't even possible.

It's actually very common and normal. Sibling IQs tend to be within 10 points of each other.

Newsflash: So are 90% of the children at any of the N. Arlington school's. Not just your family members. 90% of could meet the criteria the school uses for gifted. It's the idea that only certain families (3, 4, 5 siblings) all magically are accepted at 5.

Then Arlington uses a pretty low standard. The standard should be top 2%. Move.

It's because those families with lots of kid know the system.

APS is over-crowded.

The bar for determining a Kindergartner is GT is extremely low and highly subjective. If a kid went to an academic vs a play-based preschool there is a big difference at entry-level--even when studies show the play-based preschool will begin to quickly eclipse the traditional preschool kid by 3rd grade.

Once the 5-year old (fucking ridiculous) gets this label it's with them for life no matter how poorly they score on standardized tests in the later years or how they actually perform in the classroom/grades.

Our school puts these designated GT-kids at the top of the line for services from there out. They fill the high group math and high group classes with GT kids even when those kids have test scores much, much lower and lower grades than a kid whose parents didn't did the phony pony show or lobby for GT at age 5-6.

So now the much smarter kid is squeezed out of services and a spot in the accelerated 5th grade classes. By middle school and HS this child will be behind these same kids for advanced algebra, AP classes, etc.

Sound fair or legit?

All based on one nitwits judgement of the intellect of a kid just a few years out of diapers.

This is why some of those families have every kid designated as soon as they enter the system, They knew what was at stake down the pipe and that this same kid most likely will have a much harder time getting that designation down the pipe.

Those that thought objective criteria would be used are screwed.

None of my 4 DCs were in accelerated language arts or math classes in their APS elementary school and it made no difference what honors/AP/IB classes they could take once they got to high school. Math is easily remedied if your child is indeed capable of handling it. When your DC gets to middle school, have your child placed in the upper level math. The counselor may give you a hard time but in the end it's your decision. My first DC was placed in accelerated math in 6th grade and we saw the consequences to his friends who weren't. So when our second and fourth DCs were placed in regular 6th grade math we insisted they be moved to accelerated math. Both still got As and the older of the two is now a math major at UVA. We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that all the siblings in many of the families are all gifted--even though they have vastly different intelligence and personalities.

That should tell you something right there.

This is a school where all of the parents have advanced graduate and professional degrees--yet it's just the same families in the program.

Statistically, that isn't even possible.

It's actually very common and normal. Sibling IQs tend to be within 10 points of each other.

Newsflash: So are 90% of the children at any of the N. Arlington school's. Not just your family members. 90% of could meet the criteria the school uses for gifted. It's the idea that only certain families (3, 4, 5 siblings) all magically are accepted at 5.

Then Arlington uses a pretty low standard. The standard should be top 2%. Move.

It's because those families with lots of kid know the system.

APS is over-crowded.

The bar for determining a Kindergartner is GT is extremely low and highly subjective. If a kid went to an academic vs a play-based preschool there is a big difference at entry-level--even when studies show the play-based preschool will begin to quickly eclipse the traditional preschool kid by 3rd grade.

Once the 5-year old (fucking ridiculous) gets this label it's with them for life no matter how poorly they score on standardized tests in the later years or how they actually perform in the classroom/grades.

Our school puts these designated GT-kids at the top of the line for services from there out. They fill the high group math and high group classes with GT kids even when those kids have test scores much, much lower and lower grades than a kid whose parents didn't did the phony pony show or lobby for GT at age 5-6.

So now the much smarter kid is squeezed out of services and a spot in the accelerated 5th grade classes. By middle school and HS this child will be behind these same kids for advanced algebra, AP classes, etc.

Sound fair or legit?

All based on one nitwits judgement of the intellect of a kid just a few years out of diapers.

This is why some of those families have every kid designated as soon as they enter the system, They knew what was at stake down the pipe and that this same kid most likely will have a much harder time getting that designation down the pipe.

Those that thought objective criteria would be used are screwed.

None of my 4 DCs were in accelerated language arts or math classes in their APS elementary school and it made no difference what honors/AP/IB classes they could take once they got to high school. Math is easily remedied if your child is indeed capable of handling it. When your DC gets to middle school, have your child placed in the upper level math. The counselor may give you a hard time but in the end it's your decision. My first DC was placed in accelerated math in 6th grade and we saw the consequences to his friends who weren't. So when our second and fourth DCs were placed in regular 6th grade math we insisted they be moved to accelerated math. Both still got As and the older of the two is now a math major at UVA. We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

That's fine for you. But, unfortunately, due to overcrowding and capacity issues which are getting monumentally worse by the year they most certainly can and will deny kids for space reasons in those classrooms.

It's also in my DNA not to be one of these douchebag parents. I always believe if deserved, talent will be recognized. I am honest about my children's abilities. I refuse to lobby for something I think is unfounded in Kindergarten.

Unfortunately, N Arlington is 99% populated by busy-body douchebags. They are on the travel soccer and baseball sidelines. I don't know how they breathe with so much shit up their nostrils from all this brown nosing.

The cream does always rise to the top. The parents will eventually hit a brick wall. It happens all of the time. It's crushing to kids that were always told they were the best. They develop zero grit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

A kid who takes 6th grade math in 6th grade can still take calculus by 12th grade. What exactly are you worried about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that all the siblings in many of the families are all gifted--even though they have vastly different intelligence and personalities.

That should tell you something right there.

This is a school where all of the parents have advanced graduate and professional degrees--yet it's just the same families in the program.

Statistically, that isn't even possible.

It's actually very common and normal. Sibling IQs tend to be within 10 points of each other.

Newsflash: So are 90% of the children at any of the N. Arlington school's. Not just your family members. 90% of could meet the criteria the school uses for gifted. It's the idea that only certain families (3, 4, 5 siblings) all magically are accepted at 5.

Then Arlington uses a pretty low standard. The standard should be top 2%. Move.

It's because those families with lots of kid know the system.

APS is over-crowded.

The bar for determining a Kindergartner is GT is extremely low and highly subjective. If a kid went to an academic vs a play-based preschool there is a big difference at entry-level--even when studies show the play-based preschool will begin to quickly eclipse the traditional preschool kid by 3rd grade.

Once the 5-year old (fucking ridiculous) gets this label it's with them for life no matter how poorly they score on standardized tests in the later years or how they actually perform in the classroom/grades.

Our school puts these designated GT-kids at the top of the line for services from there out. They fill the high group math and high group classes with GT kids even when those kids have test scores much, much lower and lower grades than a kid whose parents didn't did the phony pony show or lobby for GT at age 5-6.

So now the much smarter kid is squeezed out of services and a spot in the accelerated 5th grade classes. By middle school and HS this child will be behind these same kids for advanced algebra, AP classes, etc.

Sound fair or legit?

All based on one nitwits judgement of the intellect of a kid just a few years out of diapers.

This is why some of those families have every kid designated as soon as they enter the system, They knew what was at stake down the pipe and that this same kid most likely will have a much harder time getting that designation down the pipe.

Those that thought objective criteria would be used are screwed.

None of my 4 DCs were in accelerated language arts or math classes in their APS elementary school and it made no difference what honors/AP/IB classes they could take once they got to high school. Math is easily remedied if your child is indeed capable of handling it. When your DC gets to middle school, have your child placed in the upper level math. The counselor may give you a hard time but in the end it's your decision. My first DC was placed in accelerated math in 6th grade and we saw the consequences to his friends who weren't. So when our second and fourth DCs were placed in regular 6th grade math we insisted they be moved to accelerated math. Both still got As and the older of the two is now a math major at UVA. We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

That's fine for you. But, unfortunately, due to overcrowding and capacity issues which are getting monumentally worse by the year they most certainly can and will deny kids for space reasons in those classrooms.

It's also in my DNA not to be one of these douchebag parents. I always believe if deserved, talent will be recognized. I am honest about my children's abilities. I refuse to lobby for something I think is unfounded in Kindergarten.

Unfortunately, N Arlington is 99% populated by busy-body douchebags. They are on the travel soccer and baseball sidelines. I don't know how they breathe with so much shit up their nostrils from all this brown nosing.

The cream does always rise to the top. The parents will eventually hit a brick wall. It happens all of the time. It's crushing to kids that were always told they were the best. They develop zero grit.

I certainly agree with your characterization of the douchebag parents on the N Arlington travel sports teams and with your belief that the cream usually rises to the top. However, the previous PP is also correct about the importance of accelerated math in 6th grade and, yes, it is worth it to advocate for your child if they need the extra challenge.

Also, when did Arlington start IDing kids as gifted in K or 1st grade? A few years ago when my kids were at Jamestown they wouldn't begin formally IDing giftedness until 2nd or 3rd grade - has that changed?

And to the PP who was surprised at the lack of Ivy college acceptances - yep, it's true. When I first saw Naviance at Yorktown I was really surprised - the top colleges take very few YHS students. But UVa and W&M seem to like them so that's fine with us.

[Anonymous]

If GT services at the elementary school level aren't giving our kids a leg up in the college admissions process, then I don't really get the point. And my kid has been identified as GT. He likes his GT teacher, but I am not convinced the extra "homework" is really doing anything for his longer-term success. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I was really surprised by the college acceptance rates that were reported in that same magazine. I think we are wasting a lot of energy arguing about this stuff, when everyone should be focused on what APS high school looks like in 5-10 years when we are 3,000 high school seats short of what we need. We're arguing over how Ks end up getting selected to do extra math worksheets, and meanwhile all the local ivy league college slots are going to Fairfax and Montgomery County kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

A kid who takes 6th grade math in 6th grade can still take calculus by 12th grade. What exactly are you worried about?

Didn't say it wasn't possible. That track, however, generally leads to pre calculus in 12th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it funny that all the siblings in many of the families are all gifted--even though they have vastly different intelligence and personalities.

That should tell you something right there.

This is a school where all of the parents have advanced graduate and professional degrees--yet it's just the same families in the program.

Statistically, that isn't even possible.

It's actually very common and normal. Sibling IQs tend to be within 10 points of each other.

Newsflash: So are 90% of the children at any of the N. Arlington school's. Not just your family members. 90% of could meet the criteria the school uses for gifted. It's the idea that only certain families (3, 4, 5 siblings) all magically are accepted at 5.

Then Arlington uses a pretty low standard. The standard should be top 2%. Move.

It's because those families with lots of kid know the system.

APS is over-crowded.

The bar for determining a Kindergartner is GT is extremely low and highly subjective. If a kid went to an academic vs a play-based preschool there is a big difference at entry-level--even when studies show the play-based preschool will begin to quickly eclipse the traditional preschool kid by 3rd grade.

Once the 5-year old (fucking ridiculous) gets this label it's with them for life no matter how poorly they score on standardized tests in the later years or how they actually perform in the classroom/grades.

Our school puts these designated GT-kids at the top of the line for services from there out. They fill the high group math and high group classes with GT kids even when those kids have test scores much, much lower and lower grades than a kid whose parents didn't did the phony pony show or lobby for GT at age 5-6.

So now the much smarter kid is squeezed out of services and a spot in the accelerated 5th grade classes. By middle school and HS this child will be behind these same kids for advanced algebra, AP classes, etc.

Sound fair or legit?

All based on one nitwits judgement of the intellect of a kid just a few years out of diapers.

This is why some of those families have every kid designated as soon as they enter the system, They knew what was at stake down the pipe and that this same kid most likely will have a much harder time getting that designation down the pipe.

Those that thought objective criteria would be used are screwed.

None of my 4 DCs were in accelerated language arts or math classes in their APS elementary school and it made no difference what honors/AP/IB classes they could take once they got to high school. Math is easily remedied if your child is indeed capable of handling it. When your DC gets to middle school, have your child placed in the upper level math. The counselor may give you a hard time but in the end it's your decision. My first DC was placed in accelerated math in 6th grade and we saw the consequences to his friends who weren't. So when our second and fourth DCs were placed in regular 6th grade math we insisted they be moved to accelerated math. Both still got As and the older of the two is now a math major at UVA. We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

That's fine for you. But, unfortunately, due to overcrowding and capacity issues which are getting monumentally worse by the year they most certainly can and will deny kids for space reasons in those classrooms.

It's also in my DNA not to be one of these douchebag parents. I always believe if deserved, talent will be recognized. I am honest about my children's abilities. I refuse to lobby for something I think is unfounded in Kindergarten.

Unfortunately, N Arlington is 99% populated by busy-body douchebags. They are on the travel soccer and baseball sidelines. I don't know how they breathe with so much shit up their nostrils from all this brown nosing.

The cream does always rise to the top. The parents will eventually hit a brick wall. It happens all of the time. It's crushing to kids that were always told they were the best. They develop zero grit.

8:37 here. Completely agree with you about many N. Arlington parents. I don't care whether you believe me but dealing with 6th grade math placement was the only time I fell into this category. I hated it.

My youngest is still in middle school so we will see how overcrowding effects his access to AP classes once he gets to WL. I suspect it won't for the same reasons you've touched on. Just as much as most Arlington parents are pushy and think their kids are so special, so do Arlington schools love to brag and promote themselves as having such brilliant successful students with 99.9% of their students taking at least one AP, awarded gazillions of dollars in college scholarships, blah blah blah.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If GT services at the elementary school level aren't giving our kids a leg up in the college admissions process, then I don't really get the point. And my kid has been identified as GT. He likes his GT teacher, but I am not convinced the extra "homework" is really doing anything for his longer-term success. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I was really surprised by the college acceptance rates that were reported in that same magazine. I think we are wasting a lot of energy arguing about this stuff, when everyone should be focused on what APS high school looks like in 5-10 years when we are 3,000 high school seats short of what we need. We're arguing over how Ks end up getting selected to do extra math worksheets, and meanwhile all the local ivy league college slots are going to Fairfax and Montgomery County kids.

Outside of TJ I don't think many FCPS kids are going Ivy either (% wise). Does Naviance show if the kids are actually applying to these schools at all? Or maybe many just want to stick in-state for financial reasons and not many are even applying? I know it's way more competitive these days, but all of APS is producing less Ivy grads than my small, podunk HS in another state did 20 years ago. So strange!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

A kid who takes 6th grade math in 6th grade can still take calculus by 12th grade. What exactly are you worried about?

Didn't say it wasn't possible. That track, however, generally leads to pre calculus in 12th.

To get calculus do they need to double up one year? Is summer school an option to "catch up"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

A kid who takes 6th grade math in 6th grade can still take calculus by 12th grade. What exactly are you worried about?

Didn't say it wasn't possible. That track, however, generally leads to pre calculus in 12th.

To get calculus do they need to double up one year? Is summer school an option to "catch up"?

Nope. Just stay on track. The default is Math 6, Math 7, Algebra, ending with Calculus AB in 12th grade. But if a kid takes Algebra intensified in 8th, s/he'll be on track for BC in 12th.

Kids can do this in middle school
http://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/MS-Pathways-2016-2017.pdf

And end up here:
http://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/HS-POS-Pathways-2016-2017.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
We absolutely hated being such pain in the ass parents about it in sixth grade but what math a kid takes in 6th grade in APS can very much affect what math track they are on throughout high school.

A kid who takes 6th grade math in 6th grade can still take calculus by 12th grade. What exactly are you worried about?

Didn't say it wasn't possible. That track, however, generally leads to pre calculus in 12th.

To get calculus do they need to double up one year? Is summer school an option to "catch up"?

Nope. Just stay on track. The default is Math 6, Math 7, Algebra, ending with Calculus AB in 12th grade. But if a kid takes Algebra intensified in 8th, s/he'll be on track for BC in 12th.

Kids can do this in middle school
http://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/MS-Pathways-2016-2017.pdf

And end up here:
http://www.apsva.us/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/HS-POS-Pathways-2016-2017.pdf

Thanks! Very helpful!