Diversity v. "Best" schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Schools are a function of the area they are serving. "

Don't you see a problem with that???

Why should low-income students suffer because of the area in which they live?

I do indeed.

But if the students are suffering, does that not originate in the culture of the area? If Asian students outperform their white counterparts across town, is it due to some lack of funding or is it simply due to the Asians possessing a greater committment to education?

Public schools in any said municipality receive the same funding. Were that not so, we would not be discussing a problem of lopsided test scores for it would be easy to remedy with proper accounting.

[Anonymous]

Interesting thread. A buch of guilt-ridden people flogging themselves because they want junior to procure an education, but don't want to think of themselves as bigots.

I am one of the PPs talking about the value (educational and otherwise) of diversity.

Please don't pretend to understand our reasons for placing a high importance on diversity. You are not only completely off-base in your assumptions, but you have also argued it in an incredibly condescending way.

For the record, our reasons for prioritizing diversity are as follows:

1. We have been blessed with many dear people in our lives from many different countries (and in fact my spouse and I are from different countries ourselves), cultures, religions, etc. and I think my spouse and I are better people for it. We want our children to have that same experience.

2. My spouse and I both believe that this country is headed in the wrong direction for myriad reasons, but one of them is the ridiculously paternalistic attitude in the US that we know best. In some cases that is true, but in many cases there is a LOT we can learn from the rest of the world. I have also found in my personal experience that many of the people who espouse this type of conceit are also people who have had few meaningful experiences with other cultures/countries/religions.

3. I agree completely with the PP who said that true understanding comes not from occasional interaction, but from close, personal relationships. In the case of my children as they get older, I would guess that the relationships they form will primarily be a result of where they are educated. Therefore, we will certainly go out of our way to seek out a diverse educational environment for them.

You don't have to buy this and you don't have to do it yourself, but at a minimum you can try and not pass off your inaccurate speculations as fact.

Also, to the 14:08 poster: you are basically making the same arguments that counties in the south made when they didn't want to racially integrate their schools in the 1950s. Time to get a bit of an updated perspective on learning and why schools are failing!

[Anonymous]

<<You don't have to buy this and you don't have to do it yourself, but at a minimum you can try and not pass off your inaccurate speculations as fact.>>

Do it myself? I already did. I attended DC public school my entire life- voluntarilly. My diversity was organic and natural, not forced or contrived. In addition, I said this was already a diverse nation and that was no criticism.

Perhaps actually read and parse the message before commenting?


<<Also, to the 14:08 poster: you are basically making the same arguments that counties in the south made when they didn't want to racially integrate their schools in the 1950s. Time to get a bit of an updated perspective on learning and why schools are failing!>>

Oh, of course! The inevitable and hackneyed implication of bigotry. In the 50s, you were a Commie, now a Bigot. So original.

Schools are failing, or rather some schools are failing, because they are composed of students who put forth little effort and have families who are not involved in their schooling let alone the school itself. I am hardly the first to point out such dystopias exist.

Johnny Can't Read because Johnny, his family and his peers devalue education. Not because Johnny's school has no textbooks or no diversity.

[Anonymous]

Johnny Can't Read because Johnny, his family and his peers devalue education. Not because Johnny's school has no textbooks or no diversity.

thank you, thank you, thank you. for saying so.

[Anonymous]

Do it myself? I already did. I attended DC public school my entire life- voluntarilly. My diversity was organic and natural, not forced or contrived. In addition, I said this was already a diverse nation and that was no criticism.

Perhaps actually read and parse the message before commenting?

Why are you chastising me for not reading your message when you obviously didn't take much time to read mine? Where did I advocate forced or contrived diversity? Where did I say that anybody should be bound to do as we are? (In fact, I pretty clearly said quite the opposite.) The only thing I did was tell you why my family valued multiculturalism and that our reasons were much deeper than the assinine conclusion that it was because we didn't want to be labeled bigots. I still can't get past how outrageous that comment is, by the way, and I'm surprised you haven't been completely flamed for it.

Schools are failing, or rather some schools are failing, because they are composed of students who put forth little effort and have families who are not involved in their schooling let alone the school itself. I am hardly the first to point out such dystopias exist.

Johnny Can't Read because Johnny, his family and his peers devalue education. Not because Johnny's school has no textbooks or no diversity.

It makes me sad - truly - that people who seem to be educated, people who presumably are parents, truly understand so little about shortcomings of our education system. Yes, obviously parenting has a lot to do with learning, but before I really blow a gasket during the course of this discussion, are you actually really advocating that there is no link between the resources available at a given school and education? Or is this something you are just saying for the sake of your argument? Just let me know before my blood pressure really goes through the roof and I am forced to refer you to study after study after study after study establishing the correlation.

[Anonymous]

are you actually really advocating that there is no link between the resources available at a given school and education? Or is this something you are just saying for the sake of your argument? Just let me know before my blood pressure really goes through the roof and I am forced to refer you to study after study after study after study establishing the correlation.

I'm not the PP you're talking to, but .... is there not also study after study beginning in the 1960s that shows the most powerful predictor of a student's success is the student's parents' socio-economic space? e.g., their own educational attainment. Their income. Their literacy. Their age when they had children, etc etc etc.

I, at least, assumed that's what PP was talking about.

In places like Silver Spring, where there's a handful of schools with truly diverse socio-economic representation within the same classroom (meaning, identical "resources available" as you put it, the same teacher! the same funding! the same texbooks!), educational achievement falls generally along socio-economic lines in that classroom. That's anecdotal info shared by my SIL and another teacher friend, but the NCLB numbers support this example of two.

[Anonymous]

I'm not the PP you're talking to, but .... is there not also study after study beginning in the 1960s that shows the most powerful predictor of a student's success is the student's parents' socio-economic space? e.g., their own educational attainment. Their income. Their literacy. Their age when they had children, etc etc etc.

I, at least, assumed that's what PP was talking about.

In places like Silver Spring, where there's a handful of schools with truly diverse socio-economic representation within the same classroom (meaning, identical "resources available" as you put it, the same teacher! the same funding! the same texbooks!), educational achievement falls generally along socio-economic lines in that classroom. That's anecdotal info shared by my SIL and another teacher friend, but the NCLB numbers support this example of two.

I am the 18:54 poster (also some of the other PPs are mine) and I don't disagree with anything you've said. As I mentioned, I do think that parenting (including how education is valued) and other socio-economic factors obviously have significant impact.

I do disagree with the 15:23 poster who seems to be arguing that resources, or lack thereof, impact educational success. He/she also seems to think I'm arguing that lack of diversity = bad education system, when all I am saying is the my family places a high importance on diversity and that we will seek out a learning environment that can provide that. After all, wouldn't want anyone to think we are bigots!!

[Anonymous]

I do disagree with the 15:23 poster who seems to be arguing that resources, or lack thereof, impact educational success.

PP here again-- that was supposed to read that the 15:23 poster seems to be arguing that resources, or lack thereof, do not impact educational success.

[Anonymous]

I'm so sad I missed this topic when it was 'hot'.

I have to say that as military brat, I went to schools that were wonderfully diverse racially and socioeconomically. IMO there is real value in learning in a diverse environment that will stay with your children forever. It wasn't until I went to college that I realized how many children where not fortunate enough to have had the experiences that I've had.

My school was not a 'high test score' school and was actually in one of the poorest school districts in the nation. However, I think I've accomplished just as much, if not more of what many of the children who attended private schools or schools that lacked diversity. And I've had the opportunity to experience and learn from many different cultures, religions and backgrounds which has prepared me for dealing with real people in the real world with real problems.

If you care about the quality of your childs education, the level of diversity that he or she is exposed to on a daily basis should be one of the top priorities, in my opinion. I've known many people who were completely unprepared for life outside of their shell, they virtually became recluse in college and even on the job or just limited their social interactions with people from the same background. As parents, we need to take multiple facts into consideration when choosing schools for our children. Not just test scores.