Is 8th grade pre-algebra or algebra?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, you "said what you said" because you are deluding yourself into believing that the path your family took was optimal. Most of us don't consider taking 5 years to graduate ("or 4 with some Summer school") what we'd like for our children. If I'm paying for an extra year of school they'd better be on their way to a masters or MBA.

+1,000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

PP. My bright, but not genius level, DS took Algebra 1 in 9th grade to avoid doing it over PowerPoint due to Covid. Took SAT and submitted scores, got into 6 of 8 Virginia colleges he applied to. The assistant dean of Engineering at ODU flat out said you can start out at any Math level and become and engineer, it might take you longer, but you can do it. Then they showed the 5 year progression, or 4 year with some Summer school, to graduate starting at Pre-Calc. Mason did the same thing. You can graduate from either of those schools and start your life. Both were around 30K. In Virginia, most of the privates will give you enough aid in some form to get the price down to that of a public university. People in this area fight tooth and nail to hold on to the belief that not being in advanced math will somehow doom you to a life of poverty.

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

Yes of course you can take math in college but we are trying to avoid that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, you "said what you said" because you are deluding yourself into believing that the path your family took was optimal. Most of us don't consider taking 5 years to graduate ("or 4 with some Summer school") what we'd like for our children. If I'm paying for an extra year of school they'd better be on their way to a masters or MBA.

It doesn't matter if it was optimal or not, that's subjective anyway. Things in life don't always go as planned, we adapted in a suboptimal situation and found a path that was workable. I don't consider that delusional. It's practical and completely valid. Like the old saying goes, "There's more than one way to skin a cat." And in the arc of one's life trajectory, taking some extra time to graduate isn't hugely significant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

Why limit yourself to only in-state? OOS can be just as affordable. Our DC took algebra in 9th, graduated HS in ‘18 and went OOS. I think yearly tuition was about $23k at the time before merit discounts. $7.5k came off the tuition based on the SAT score. DC obtained a graduate assistant position at another OOS school and they covered the tuition cost.

We need to be in driving distance. Flying or taking the train home for every long weekend or break is not financially possible.

The school is about 2 hours away by car.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:OP here, my kid is in Math 7 (regular, not honors) and has an A (with the help of a tutor, to be honest).

The jump from Math 7 to Algebra is a big one for a lot of kids. The county's policy of saying a C or better in Math 7 is good enough to move on to Algebra is laughable and creating classrooms full of students who are struggling greatly in Algebra and it will spill over to upper level classes.

Their attempt to "fix" this problem is to start having kids skip Math 7 instead and take Pre-Algebra (Math 8) as a 7th grader. The jump will still be big but not as big as the Math 7 to Algebra jump. You and I have kids who were caught in these transition years where this wasn't an option and it's been a challenge for us.

My daughter took regular Math 7 in 7th grade b/c math was a struggle for her and there was no teamed option for Math 7H (basically Pre-Algebra/Math 8 with extensions). When she moved into 8th, we were fully prepared to just have her take Pre-Algebra but the school *finally* got on board with teamed Algebra and was offering it for the first time. Because my daughter had an A in Math 7, she was recommended to move on to Algebra. Let's just say, thank the Lord I know what I'm doing b/c I basically tutor her every night and catch her up on all the skills she missed by skipping over Pre-Algebra. And now we're, unfortunately, on a path where we'll have to figure out advanced math classes for her.

If you're prepared to pay for a tutor to get her through Algebra successfully, then go for it. If you think at all that she'll need a more solid foundation before moving on, then I'd wait and just do Pre-Algebra in 8th. All this changes if for some reason you're at an IB school and need to have Algebra done by 8th.

Algebra in 8th grade has been the standard in FCPS for years, over a decade.

Incorrect. Algebra in 8th has been AVAILABLE for years. It's only since Dr. Reid became superintendent the she decided Algebra should be what ALL 8th graders take. Her push for Algebra for all will have a long and detrimental effect on math education in FCPS.

Most of the kids take algebra in 8th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The “standard” gen-ed track is Pre-Alg in 8th and Algebra in 9th, but it’s very, very normal to take Algebra in 8th. It’s technically an accelerated path but a lot of people do it. The more accelerated path is Algebra in 7th, or even 6th.

But when people refer to “Math 8” or “8th grade math”, it refers to the year before algebra.

This will put you at the bottom half of your school, maybe even lower than that. Algebra in 9th is not for kids who want to attend a competitive college.

Both my boys took algebra in 7th and algebra 2 in 9th. This is the normal advanced track.

I agree.

The regular advanced track is algebra in 7th, calculus in 11th, and either an advanced calculus like BC or multivariable in 12th, or if they are trending towards himanities, AP stat in 12th.

The college bound track is Algebra in 8th, calculus of some for in 12th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Algebra in 9th will not get the student to calculus in 12th, unless they take geometry over the summer.

Most seniors are not taking algebra 2.

[Anonymous]

If you push to have your child take Pre-Algebra in 8th instead of Algebra… they will be in a classroom with really intense behaviors and learning struggles. That’s the reality.

[Anonymous]

No one with plans to go to college should be on the standard track.

Oh, come on. Get your head out of Northern Virginia. TONS of kids all over the country are taking "standard track" everything and going to college. You do realize there are still a fair number of schools/school systems out there that do not have the same class offerings we have here, right?

This is just such small thinking.

[Anonymous]

You will have zero shot at any school in the top 50 or any decent STEM school.

Not a lot of kids in Honors Algebra in 8th grade are likely to go top 50. Top 50 is for the kids that are taking Algebra, and maybe even Geometry, in 7th grade.

[Anonymous]

The real problem with Reid's decision to have all 8th graders taking Algebra is the Math 7 Honors curriculum. It does not adequately prepare the kids for Algebra 1 in 8th grade (at least not the Honors track). At least half of the kids in my kid's Honors Algebra have dropped down to non-Honors because they are not understanding the Honors curriculum. Algebra is way too important for future math to have kids not get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

No one with plans to go to college should be on the standard track.

Oh, come on. Get your head out of Northern Virginia. TONS of kids all over the country are taking "standard track" everything and going to college. You do realize there are still a fair number of schools/school systems out there that do not have the same class offerings we have here, right?

This is just such small thinking.

I want my kids to get into UVA, VT, JMU, William & Mary. If you're okay with Christopher Newport or Radford or paying twice as much for a "good" school out of state that's fine. I'm not. Our kids have to compete with the other Northern Virginia kids for spots. There may or may not be official quotas at the state schools, but the admissions office definitely compares applicants against all the other applicants from the same school and county. If one kid has a less rigorous course load they aren't getting in.

[Anonymous]

I want my kids to get into UVA, VT, JMU, William & Mary. If you're okay with Christopher Newport or Radford or paying twice as much for a "good" school out of state that's fine. I'm not. Our kids have to compete with the other Northern Virginia kids for spots. There may or may not be official quotas at the state schools, but the admissions office definitely compares applicants against all the other applicants from the same school and county. If one kid has a less rigorous course load they aren't getting in.

If you're only thinking about VA state schools, then yes, it's a competitive atmosphere. But there are a lot more pieces to the puzzle than whether they take Algebra 1 in 8th grade. And for UVA, you're likely talking about top 5% of a NoVa HS class and ED, so those kids might actually be taking Geometry in 8th grade.

But making a blanket statement that kids that are on a Standard Track aren't college bound? That's just not true.

[Anonymous]

I'm the OP and I'm not sure how this thread got derailed into talking about college. I literally just wanted to know what the path is and what most people do. My child is fairly average and is unlikely to go to a name brand university, but is going to go to and succeed in college somewhere. My child has mostly As in a mix of honors and regular classes (regular 7 math, and I think I mentioned earlier, has an A but does have a math tutor who has said that my kid probably doesn't need a tutor anymore). So I'm just trying to figure out if pre-Algebra or Algebra is the right path. I think I'll be better off just asking the teacher and counselor. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

OP again, I am NOT the person who insists their child needs to go in state, that is someone totally different.