Is 8th grade pre-algebra or algebra?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Some people can’t afford the out of state mediocre options that would be available. They will have to fight for an in state position and they don’t want Radford.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The “standard” gen-ed track is Pre-Alg in 8th and Algebra in 9th, but it’s very, very normal to take Algebra in 8th. It’s technically an accelerated path but a lot of people do it. The more accelerated path is Algebra in 7th, or even 6th.

But when people refer to “Math 8” or “8th grade math”, it refers to the year before algebra.

This will put you at the bottom half of your school, maybe even lower than that. Algebra in 9th is not for kids who want to attend a competitive college.

Both my boys took algebra in 7th and algebra 2 in 9th. This is the normal advanced track.

I took Algebra in 9th and only had 3 years of math. I went to a four year college and then completed my PhD. I even taught statistics as a Professor. Kids who struggle in math in HS can do great things and attend college. Not every kid needs to go to a top 25 college and you caan attend a to 100 or even 50 college with Algebra in 9th, you just won’t be able to start in some programs.

Reid is pushing for everyone to take Algebra in 8th grade and that is a mistake. The normal path has been to complete Algebra by 8th grade but a decent number of kids take it in 9th grade,, you can look at the SOL scores by grade and see this. Not every child is ready for Algebra by 8th grade and that is fine.

It probably depends on the pyramid. We live in McLean. I personally don’t know any kids who took/take Algebra in 9th. Both my kids were in the AAP track. The smarter kids actually take algebra 2 and AP Precalc as freshmen. My junior taking AP Calc doesn’t even seem advanced.

I know kids who took Algebra in 9th grade, they had known learning issues and it was appropriate for them to take Algebra in 9th grade. I have not looked at the SOL numbers but I would imagine that the largest number of 9th grade Algebra SOL scores will be at higher FARMs schools with lower FARMs schools having very few. Algebra by 8th grade is the norm in FCPS, although not the country if you google nationwide stats. About 15% of kids will have Algebra 1 before 8th grade, that number might be going up with the 6th grade Algebra 1 program, it depends on how many kids actually do well in A1H as 6th graders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Some people can’t afford the out of state mediocre options that would be available. They will have to fight for an in state position and they don’t want Radford.

Those people have not looked at the aid that a good GPA student with a bunch of APs can get from many OOS public universities. A decent number give high amounts of merit aid to kids with 3.5s coming out of NOVA because they are looking for kids to boost their stats. Calculus is good to have but not a must have. Only 16% of high school students had calculus in 2019

https://maa.org/math-values/the-decline-in-high-school-calculus/#:~:text=First%20is%20that%20only%2015.8%25,is%20down%20from%2019.3%25%2C%20671%2C000
https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=97
https://hechingerreport.org/proof-points-high-school-calculus-college-admissions-survey/

This report goes into the rise of AP Stats and how the math landscape in HS is starting to shift. It acknowledges that calculus is still something colleges like to see while addressing the fact that colleges understand most kids don't need calculus.

https://fordhaminstitute.org/national/research/calculus-or-statistics-does-it-matter

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

The kids in that poster's example were memorable because they are exceptions. Your goal should be to get your kid in a position where they are likely to succeed, not one where they need to be the exception to succeed.
Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

The kids in that poster's example were memorable because they are exceptions. Your goal should be to get your kid in a position where they are likely to succeed, not one where they need to be the exception to succeed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

Why limit yourself to only in-state? OOS can be just as affordable. Our DC took algebra in 9th, graduated HS in ‘18 and went OOS. I think yearly tuition was about $23k at the time before merit discounts. $7.5k came off the tuition based on the SAT score. DC obtained a graduate assistant position at another OOS school and they covered the tuition cost.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

Why limit yourself to only in-state? OOS can be just as affordable. Our DC took algebra in 9th, graduated HS in ‘18 and went OOS. I think yearly tuition was about $23k at the time before merit discounts. $7.5k came off the tuition based on the SAT score. DC obtained a graduate assistant position at another OOS school and they covered the tuition cost.

Quoting myself to revise a bit. The total annual cost was about $23k. Actual tuition was less. Today, the OOS (public university) tuition is about $12k annually, with an estimated total cost of $28k.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

Why limit yourself to only in-state? OOS can be just as affordable. Our DC took algebra in 9th, graduated HS in ‘18 and went OOS. I think yearly tuition was about $23k at the time before merit discounts. $7.5k came off the tuition based on the SAT score. DC obtained a graduate assistant position at another OOS school and they covered the tuition cost.

Quoting myself to revise a bit. The total annual cost was about $23k. Actual tuition was less. Today, the OOS (public university) tuition is about $12k annually, with an estimated total cost of $28k.

You’re also not considering the hidden costs of out of state attendance - having to fly home for breaks instead of drive. The aid is not going to counteract those costs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

Why limit yourself to only in-state? OOS can be just as affordable. Our DC took algebra in 9th, graduated HS in ‘18 and went OOS. I think yearly tuition was about $23k at the time before merit discounts. $7.5k came off the tuition based on the SAT score. DC obtained a graduate assistant position at another OOS school and they covered the tuition cost.

We need to be in driving distance. Flying or taking the train home for every long weekend or break is not financially possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

The kids in that poster's example were memorable because they are exceptions. Your goal should be to get your kid in a position where they are likely to succeed, not one where they need to be the exception to succeed.

+1 plus, who wants to go to college in Kentucky?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

PP. My bright, but not genius level, DS took Algebra 1 in 9th grade to avoid doing it over PowerPoint due to Covid. Took SAT and submitted scores, got into 6 of 8 Virginia colleges he applied to. The assistant dean of Engineering at ODU flat out said you can start out at any Math level and become and engineer, it might take you longer, but you can do it. Then they showed the 5 year progression, or 4 year with some Summer school, to graduate starting at Pre-Calc. Mason did the same thing. You can graduate from either of those schools and start your life. Both were around 30K. In Virginia, most of the privates will give you enough aid in some form to get the price down to that of a public university. People in this area fight tooth and nail to hold on to the belief that not being in advanced math will somehow doom you to a life of poverty.

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I teach algebra 2. Last year I had a handful of seniors in my class (meaning algebra 1 in 9th, geometry 10th, AFDA 11th, and algebra 2 12th). One is now a freshman at George Mason, one is at JMU, one is at VCU. A fourth is down in Norfolk area doing a mechanics training for some fancy car (maybe Porsche? I forget, I remember we joked that he’d never be working on my cars since I drive a Kia)

This year I have a larger group of seniors. 1 got accepted early to university of Kentucky to study marketing, 1 has been missing class all quarter to audition for elite music programs, two have every intention of NVCC and transfer, and 4 are still waiting to hear.

The ones who take algebra on 9th and go to AP precalc or AP stats as seniors? I can’t even begin to list the amazing schools they end up at. Sure, not MIT, but that doesn’t mean you fail!! An engineer from university of South Carolina or nc state or Mason or Penn state is still an engineer! A career in nursing depends way less on the school you attended and more on the student. I’ve had kids leave my room with full rides to nursing school after taking algebra 2 as juniors and a less strenuous math class senior year.

You can have a fine future, collegiate or otherwise, with algebra in 9th. While you obviously have more options the higher the math you take, it’s not a death sentence to slow down and be confident!

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

I can tell you that we need in state options only. We are going to have to be more competitive.

PP. My bright, but not genius level, DS took Algebra 1 in 9th grade to avoid doing it over PowerPoint due to Covid. Took SAT and submitted scores, got into 6 of 8 Virginia colleges he applied to. The assistant dean of Engineering at ODU flat out said you can start out at any Math level and become and engineer, it might take you longer, but you can do it. Then they showed the 5 year progression, or 4 year with some Summer school, to graduate starting at Pre-Calc. Mason did the same thing. You can graduate from either of those schools and start your life. Both were around 30K. In Virginia, most of the privates will give you enough aid in some form to get the price down to that of a public university. People in this area fight tooth and nail to hold on to the belief that not being in advanced math will somehow doom you to a life of poverty.

Thank you for this reality check. One can still live a happy, fulfilling, upper middle-class life without attending a Top 25/50 school. If one thinks they can't, it's because their parents or others told them they couldn't and they believed it. That's some BS right there. I said what I said.

[Anonymous]

Yeah, you "said what you said" because you are deluding yourself into believing that the path your family took was optimal. Most of us don't consider taking 5 years to graduate ("or 4 with some Summer school") what we'd like for our children. If I'm paying for an extra year of school they'd better be on their way to a masters or MBA.