Why won't FCPS kick kids out of AAP or re-evaluate them annually?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The least qualified kids are parent referrals. We should really just get rid of that.

A 7 year old isn't "tricking" a test. If you are getting in on test scores, you are qualified.

If you are getting in based on parent referral, you are probably NOT qualified.

My child was a parent referral, AND we got in because of test scores. 136 NNAT/139 COGAT (I think 147 Quant) was not in pool for our pyramid apparently. Our GBRS and samples were underwhelming.

[Anonymous]

Fcps doesn’t kick kids out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Because the process is such a time suck for teachers already. Any kids who got kicked out would appeal. Nobody has that kind of time in public school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The least qualified kids are parent referrals. We should really just get rid of that.

A 7 year old isn't "tricking" a test. If you are getting in on test scores, you are qualified.

If you are getting in based on parent referral, you are probably NOT qualified.

My child was a parent referral, AND we got in because of test scores. 136 NNAT/139 COGAT (I think 147 Quant) was not in pool for our pyramid apparently. Our GBRS and samples were underwhelming.

Hence the word "probably"
There's a lot of reasons why a gifted kid might not act like a gifted kid (immaturity, boredom, attitude, etc.).
There are not a lot of ways for a non-gifted kid to test that far into the right hand side of the curve.

[Anonymous]

I don't think it's fair to children that are struggling to have to remain in AAP. I read this article recently and it reminded me of this thread:

https://www.vox.com/culture/365064/former-gifted-kids-burned-out-memes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw what “other material”’is normally submitted with the application? I thought it’s just the test scores and teachers assessment. What other material? Worksheets from the classroom?

Case and point! Kids are prepped and angled in by parents.

yes, many preppers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw what “other material”’is normally submitted with the application? I thought it’s just the test scores and teachers assessment. What other material? Worksheets from the classroom?

Case and point! Kids are prepped and angled in by parents.

“Other material” from the school, in addition to the NNAT and CoGat universal screeners and the new HOPE teacher assessment, consist of school work samples, iready, report card, ePRF scores and SOL (SOLs only included if applying 3rd grade on). other materials submitted by parents (should one opt to do so) include parent samples & parent questionnaire and approved outside testing.

In the past there were letter of recommendation, awards, certificates etc that are no longer allowed in the packet submission.

[Anonymous]

This area is not Type “A.” It’s mostly status-insecure people who didn’t go to great schools themselves that are pushing the AAP hype. It’s time to get rid of AAP. It’s a freak show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

This area is soooooo type A

[Anonymous]

The irony of all this is that AAP placement for our kids is being determined by B and C level educated people. When you realize that - this dumpster fire makes sense.

The best thing for students in FCPS is to hire gifted teachers! But, they don’t pay teachers well, so we have the current situation.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wondered about this when my kid was going through the program. Annual reevaluation for all kids would be a waste of time and overkill, but kids who are consistently failing the SOLs and unable to keep up with the work should be kicked out. On the flip side, passing advanced on both SOLs and getting 4s across the board should be a guaranteed in. There are very few kids who pass advanced on both reading and math who couldn't handle the pace and curriculum of AAP.

On the one hand it's bad for kid's self esteem if they are removed. On the other hand, nobody cares about the self esteem of kids who don't get in

This is a stupid argument. Maybe parents and schools should stop telling AAP kids that they're special. Maybe instead tell children that they are in classes that meet their needs and stop there. One of my kids asked why they didn't get in to AAP and I said "You don't need to be in there. You're going to get advanced math pull outs, but everything else in the normal classroom is perfect for you!" and that was that.

My kid pushed in for advanced math. We were told and they were told that their spot was contingent on their being space available. That was the highlight of the advanced math meeting. There was no talk of meeting her needs, just her needs can be met as along as the level IV class has space for her.

[Anonymous]

Just go back to test scores. The teacher referrals and HOPE are BS.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

I think that Lotte is closed but you can just get it delivered to your door through amazon.com

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=cogat&ref=nb_sb_noss
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=nnat&crid=QHJ5BOYPZWXC&sprefix=nnat%2Caps%2C79&ref=nb_sb_noss_1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This area is not Type “A.” It’s mostly status-insecure people who didn’t go to great schools themselves that are pushing the AAP hype. It’s time to get rid of AAP. It’s a freak show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

This area is soooooo type A

I’m not sure which FCPS parents you’re talking about but the majority of AAP parents at our McLean schools are type A and went to top schools.

Can you elaborate on why AAP is a “freak show” that must be eliminated?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area is not Type “A.” It’s mostly status-insecure people who didn’t go to great schools themselves that are pushing the AAP hype. It’s time to get rid of AAP. It’s a freak show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

This area is soooooo type A

I’m not sure which FCPS parents you’re talking about but the majority of AAP parents at our McLean schools are type A and went to top schools.

Can you elaborate on why AAP is a “freak show” that must be eliminated?

DP, but I’m inclined to agree. AAP is no longer about providing differentiated services to truly gifted children. Instead, it’s a status symbol and a perceived leg up that the ambitious NoVa parents game the system to ensure their kids get into and has probably watered down the program as a result. Fortunately, everything resets in Middle School and being in AAP for ES is rendered useless anyway. (Yes, I know there is AAP in MS and that math is different.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area is not Type “A.” It’s mostly status-insecure people who didn’t go to great schools themselves that are pushing the AAP hype. It’s time to get rid of AAP. It’s a freak show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

This area is soooooo type A

I’m not sure which FCPS parents you’re talking about but the majority of AAP parents at our McLean schools are type A and went to top schools.

Can you elaborate on why AAP is a “freak show” that must be eliminated?

DP. I don't think it needs to be eliminated but it does need to be retuned. There is too much subjectivity, it lets in way to many mediocre kids with type A parents doing parent referrals and excludes too many high testing kids that get kept out because they aren't "presenting" as gifted to some 2nd grade teacher. I would really like to see a study cross referencing test scores, GBRS scores correlation to test scores by teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This area is not Type “A.” It’s mostly status-insecure people who didn’t go to great schools themselves that are pushing the AAP hype. It’s time to get rid of AAP. It’s a freak show.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wouldn't this weed out the kids who were prepped in? My kid is definitely in classes with kids who don't belong in AAP but because they don't get counseled out or reevaluated annually, they're just stuck there and it's (a) hard for those kids and (b) annoying for the truly advanced kids who they are holding behind.

You wouldn't be weeding out prepped kids, you would be weeding out the kids that are referred by parents.
On the whole, test scores reflect ability whether it is prepped or not. An unprepared kid can underperform but a well prepared kid will not outperform.
Don't excuse your child's failure with the fact that other kids have studied.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You are absolutely NOT supposed to prepare for tests like NNAT and COGAT. You can ABSOLUTELY trick those tests into believing your child is gifted because you have taught your child the strategies to answer the questions as opposed to actually gifted children who can intuitively answer the questions without any help at all. You don't see the difference there?

The thing is, almost everyone preps for these so if you don't, you are at a disadvantage. Have you been to lotte in Fairfax? They sell cogat prep books. If you think people aren't prepping their kids then you are deluded. Also, AAP is no a gifted program. It's an advanced academic program. There is a difference.

This area is soooooo type A

I’m not sure which FCPS parents you’re talking about but the majority of AAP parents at our McLean schools are type A and went to top schools.

Can you elaborate on why AAP is a “freak show” that must be eliminated?

DP. I don't think it needs to be eliminated but it does need to be retuned. There is too much subjectivity, it lets in way to many mediocre kids with type A parents doing parent referrals and excludes too many high testing kids that get kept out because they aren't "presenting" as gifted to some 2nd grade teacher. I would really like to see a study cross referencing test scores, GBRS scores correlation to test scores by teacher.

They had to move to a more holistic approach bc so many parents were prepping their kids, which rendered the high scores meaningless. Blame the type-A preppers parents for this mess.

[Anonymous]

They need to go back to GT. Having an entire curriculum for "advanced" kids without having a separate entire curriculum for "behind" kids is inequitable. Why doesn't my kid who is bad at math have her own curriculum?? WHY???