MD teenager shot Friday for refusing to give up his jacket

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp here. Teens need mentors. If you are interested in being one, here is one organization: https://communityyouthadvance.org/program-overview/

Do people/teens really need someone to explicitly tell them it's wrong to shoot someone for the their coat? I always thought basic ethics were innate, but maybe I'm wrong. Most people I know who didn't have the greatest childhood and didn't have adults around to guide them, still ended up pretty decent people.

I mean even wild animals are better - they generally are violent only when it comes to survival.

The idea that ethics is innate is a dangerous falsehood. Even the most cursory glance at human history and civilization reveals that humans by nature are violent brutes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp here. Teens need mentors. If you are interested in being one, here is one organization: https://communityyouthadvance.org/program-overview/

Do people/teens really need someone to explicitly tell them it's wrong to shoot someone for the their coat? I always thought basic ethics were innate, but maybe I'm wrong. Most people I know who didn't have the greatest childhood and didn't have adults around to guide them, still ended up pretty decent people.

I mean even wild animals are better - they generally are violent only when it comes to survival.

The idea that ethics is innate is a dangerous falsehood. Even the most cursory glance at human history and civilization reveals that humans by nature are violent brutes.

No, morals and ethics are innate, instinctive. But they can be unlearned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pp here. Teens need mentors. If you are interested in being one, here is one organization: https://communityyouthadvance.org/program-overview/

Do people/teens really need someone to explicitly tell them it's wrong to shoot someone for the their coat? I always thought basic ethics were innate, but maybe I'm wrong. Most people I know who didn't have the greatest childhood and didn't have adults around to guide them, still ended up pretty decent people.

I mean even wild animals are better - they generally are violent only when it comes to survival.

The idea that ethics is innate is a dangerous falsehood. Even the most cursory glance at human history and civilization reveals that humans by nature are violent brutes.

No, morals and ethics are innate, instinctive. But they can be unlearned.

No. Most of human history was dominated by violent conquest. The relative peace and stability and egalitarianism we have seen over the past several centuries is a complete aberration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are so many young adults in PG such complete and utter trash? Are there parents around, or equally trashy? Shooting a kid over a freaking jacket? How about you get a job and work for something yourselves? Absolute insanity.

It’s rarely about the jacket. IYKYK

What do you mean?

[Anonymous]

The jacket was apparently a "Moose Knuckles" jacket.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The jacket was apparently a "Moose Knuckles" jacket.

https://www.mooseknucklescanada.com/us-en/p/gold-stirling-parka-neoshear-m39mp261gs?filter=adult_size:334-color_id:811

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They don't see way out of poverty. They don't even see way out of crime as it's all around them. Why didn't their parents make it even if they work? Many still have family members and friends who borrow them poor.
When I was homeless, then poor then working, I had so many people getting money off of me. I almost didn't make it because of that. There only so many 10-12 hours shifts I can work for minimum wage and give money away. Luckily I got rid of all of them, the latest one asked for money a months ago, but now I have it.
I saw shooting and muggings, but wasn't directly involved besides one witness case.
Those kids do need to see that there's a way out, but we don't have enough people showing it to them. Their own neighborhood, peers and family are bigger influencers.

This (not that I am condoning any of the crime--I am totally sick of it.) But I read a study once that noted that kids in high-crime dysfunctional communities often do not know a single person who supports him/herself with a [legal] job.

It would be amazing if the people who "made it" showed this example, but they move out as quickly as possible and never look back. At some point do the winners have a special responsibility to go back and help the losers?

There are different ways to help.

Going back to tutor once a week might make you feel good, but it’s only going to help a handful of kids at best and might not actually help any at all if you aren’t good at tutoring. My brother had a volunteer tutor in high school who was a nice guy but lacked the skills to tutor algebra and geometry. My brother had to do remedial classes in community college.

It can be much more effective to donate money to effective programs and above all to vote for policies that make a difference for thousands of kids.

Out there is someone who anonymously paid for me to attend a summer program that got me out of my neighborhood, keeping me safe and exposing me to different career paths and middle class AAs. I can’t thank them enough!

Beyond that, diversion has to happen in early ES. Fifth grade is too late. MS is way too late. The adolescent brain is at a disadvantage whether you are poor or rich. The difference is that rich kids who make stupid choices are given endless chances to fulfill their potential while poor kids are treated like adults or rabid animals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are so many young adults in PG such complete and utter trash? Are there parents around, or equally trashy? Shooting a kid over a freaking jacket? How about you get a job and work for something yourselves? Absolute insanity.

It’s rarely about the jacket. IYKYK

What do you mean?

Despite what the Kristin Minks of the world say, these kids didn't steal the jacket because they were cold, they did it because they can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They don't see way out of poverty. They don't even see way out of crime as it's all around them. Why didn't their parents make it even if they work? Many still have family members and friends who borrow them poor.
When I was homeless, then poor then working, I had so many people getting money off of me. I almost didn't make it because of that. There only so many 10-12 hours shifts I can work for minimum wage and give money away. Luckily I got rid of all of them, the latest one asked for money a months ago, but now I have it.
I saw shooting and muggings, but wasn't directly involved besides one witness case.
Those kids do need to see that there's a way out, but we don't have enough people showing it to them. Their own neighborhood, peers and family are bigger influencers.

This (not that I am condoning any of the crime--I am totally sick of it.) But I read a study once that noted that kids in high-crime dysfunctional communities often do not know a single person who supports him/herself with a [legal] job.

It would be amazing if the people who "made it" showed this example, but they move out as quickly as possible and never look back. At some point do the winners have a special responsibility to go back and help the losers?

There are different ways to help.

Going back to tutor once a week might make you feel good, but it’s only going to help a handful of kids at best and might not actually help any at all if you aren’t good at tutoring. My brother had a volunteer tutor in high school who was a nice guy but lacked the skills to tutor algebra and geometry. My brother had to do remedial classes in community college.

It can be much more effective to donate money to effective programs and above all to vote for policies that make a difference for thousands of kids.

Out there is someone who anonymously paid for me to attend a summer program that got me out of my neighborhood, keeping me safe and exposing me to different career paths and middle class AAs. I can’t thank them enough!

Beyond that, diversion has to happen in early ES. Fifth grade is too late. MS is way too late. The adolescent brain is at a disadvantage whether you are poor or rich. The difference is that rich kids who make stupid choices are given endless chances to fulfill their potential while poor kids are treated like adults or rabid animals.

This is a wonderful story and I hope you are now paying it forward. I know many middle and upper class AA professionals, and yes, I think they have a special onus to reach the hand back. Many of them feel the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The jacket was apparently a "Moose Knuckles" jacket.

https://www.mooseknucklescanada.com/us-en/p/gold-stirling-parka-neoshear-m39mp261gs?filter=adult_size:334-color_id:811

Never heard of the brand.