Arizona style immigration law coming to Virginia?

[Anonymous]

Oh shush. Suits and boycotts affect all the people of AZ. You are the demagogue. How carefully must everything be parsed for you? I'm sure you understood my intent.

[Anonymous]

And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

Good question.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

I'm surprised that you don't seem to know that Obama recently deployed an additional 1200 National Guard troops and an extra $500 million to be used to secure the border with Mexico. As you also should know, Obama supports comprehensive immigration reform. Unfortunately, Republicans -- even McCain who previously co-authored such a bill -- don't want to work with him on such legislation.

But, let's turn the question around. What would you like Obama and Holder to do that they aren't doing now?

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are people more upset about? Illegal immigration or being asked to show an ID when already interacting with police? One guess.

The constitution requires a census. So, to follow your logic, if you already have to interact with a census worker, you should not be angry about a few innocuous questions. Yet, those questions are enough to to cause Erickson to grab his wife's shotgun.

The census is a head count. How many bathrooms, your sex or ethnic origin, your phone number and email address are well beyond constitutional scope.

And I am not sure how you "logically" drew the conclusion that a constitutionally required head count must mean it is okay to ask "a few innocuous" questions.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

I'm surprised that you don't seem to know that Obama recently deployed an additional 1200 National Guard troops and an extra $500 million to be used to secure the border with Mexico. As you also should know, Obama supports comprehensive immigration reform. Unfortunately, Republicans -- even McCain who previously co-authored such a bill -- don't want to work with him on such legislation.

But, let's turn the question around. What would you like Obama and Holder to do that they aren't doing now?

Have any of those 1200 national guard troops really been deployed? I don't think so. They were authorized yes, but they are not there.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:
The census is a head count. How many bathrooms, your sex or ethnic origin, your phone number and email address are well beyond constitutional scope.

And I am not sure how you "logically" drew the conclusion that a constitutionally required head count must mean it is okay to ask "a few innocuous" questions.

So, maybe you can explain this then. Disclosing your number of bathrooms (not actually asked, by the way) is "well beyond the constitutional scope". But, providing your birth certificate because your grass is too tall is fine. That's not my logic, it's yours. So, please explain it.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

I'm surprised that you don't seem to know that Obama recently deployed an additional 1200 National Guard troops and an extra $500 million to be used to secure the border with Mexico. As you also should know, Obama supports comprehensive immigration reform. Unfortunately, Republicans -- even McCain who previously co-authored such a bill -- don't want to work with him on such legislation.

But, let's turn the question around. What would you like Obama and Holder to do that they aren't doing now?

I do know actually. I would like far more National Guard troops. I would like the border secured. I would like employers penalized. I would like police everywhere to have the ability to check status if a person is arrested, and if here illegally pass them on to ICE.
To your point--AZ asked for months for far more National Guard and were stonewalled until they passed this law. The amount if guardsmen they received were a day late and a penny short. Have I answered YOUR question?

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:
I do know actually. I would like far more National Guard troops. I would like the border secured. I would like employers penalized. I would like police everywhere to have the ability to check status if a person is arrested, and if here illegally pass them on to ICE.
To your point--AZ asked for months for far more National Guard and were stonewalled until they passed this law. The amount if guardsmen they received were a day late and a penny short. Have I answered YOUR question?

Actually, that's not a very good answer. Let's take your points in order:

1) Far more National Guard troops -- okay, how many and who will pay for them? The lengthy deployments to Iraq were very disruptive to the communities from which these troops came. What sort of assistance, if any, would you propose for those communities?

2) "I would like the border secured" -- well, I'd like to end world hunger. Neither of us have a plan.

3) "I would like employers penalized" -- they already can be, and many are. However, as with many laws, enforcement is an issue. Would you rather have law enforcement officers raiding businesses or tracking down terrorists?

4) ability for local police to check status of arrested people and turn them over to ICE. This has already been possible in 1996 under the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act ("IIRIRA"), specifically Section 287(g).

It's easy to stomp your feet and complain. But coming up with practical and workable ideas is a lot more difficult.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The census is a head count. How many bathrooms, your sex or ethnic origin, your phone number and email address are well beyond constitutional scope.

And I am not sure how you "logically" drew the conclusion that a constitutionally required head count must mean it is okay to ask "a few innocuous" questions.

So, maybe you can explain this then. Disclosing your number of bathrooms (not actually asked, by the way) is "well beyond the constitutional scope". But, providing your birth certificate because your grass is too tall is fine. That's not my logic, it's yours. So, please explain it.

Bathrooms dates from the 50s. I was actually asked for both my cell phone and email address "in case there were questions" - I declined.

I have lived in 5 states in multiple communities and I have never known the height of your grass to be a police matter? Really? HOA can be a PITA about that or your paint fading, but the police? And as I understand it the AZ law stipulates that your driver's license (not your birth certificate) is stipulated as adequate identification.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:
Bathrooms dates from the 50s. I was actually asked for both my cell phone and email address "in case there were questions" - I declined.

I have lived in 5 states in multiple communities and I have never known the height of your grass to be a police matter? Really? HOA can be a PITA about that or your paint fading, but the police? And as I understand it the AZ law stipulates that your driver's license (not your birth certificate) is stipulated as adequate identification.

The Arizona law allows police to check immigration status while enforcing civic ordinances. I am sure that not cutting your grass will violate something. But, if not, just substitute jaywalking and the point remains the same. And, while it should be obvious, I guess it bears repeating: not everyone has driver's licenses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And you conveniently didn't answer my question. At heart, the majority of Arizonans crave a firm action in illegal immigration. What are Obama and Holder proposing besides lawsuits that will undermines the steps the state has taken, and ignoring their chief executive when she calls or comes to town?

I'm surprised that you don't seem to know that Obama recently deployed an additional 1200 National Guard troops and an extra $500 million to be used to secure the border with Mexico. As you also should know, Obama supports comprehensive immigration reform. Unfortunately, Republicans -- even McCain who previously co-authored such a bill -- don't want to work with him on such legislation.

But, let's turn the question around. What would you like Obama and Holder to do that they aren't doing now?

I do know actually. I would like far more National Guard troops. I would like the border secured. I would like employers penalized. I would like police everywhere to have the ability to check status if a person is arrested, and if here illegally pass them on to ICE.
To your point--AZ asked for months for far more National Guard and were stonewalled until they passed this law. The amount if guardsmen they received were a day late and a penny short. Have I answered YOUR question?

Any state can check the status if a person is charged with a crime. That exists today. I don't see why people can't understand that. And the National Guard thing is incredible. If you knew what the border is like, you would realize why several thousand guardsmen wouldn't make a difference.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Bathrooms dates from the 50s. I was actually asked for both my cell phone and email address "in case there were questions" - I declined.

I have lived in 5 states in multiple communities and I have never known the height of your grass to be a police matter? Really? HOA can be a PITA about that or your paint fading, but the police? And as I understand it the AZ law stipulates that your driver's license (not your birth certificate) is stipulated as adequate identification.

The Arizona law allows police to check immigration status while enforcing civic ordinances. I am sure that not cutting your grass will violate something. But, if not, just substitute jaywalking and the point remains the same. And, while it should be obvious, I guess it bears repeating: not everyone has driver's licenses.

I didn't drive for years. There's something called a 'non-driver's id' --issued at the same bureau. Are you for real? Jay-walking is a crime. My sister got a ticket in DC once. Taught her a lesson, that no doubt keeps her and drivers safer.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Bathrooms dates from the 50s. I was actually asked for both my cell phone and email address "in case there were questions" - I declined.

I have lived in 5 states in multiple communities and I have never known the height of your grass to be a police matter? Really? HOA can be a PITA about that or your paint fading, but the police? And as I understand it the AZ law stipulates that your driver's license (not your birth certificate) is stipulated as adequate identification.

The Arizona law allows police to check immigration status while enforcing civic ordinances. I am sure that not cutting your grass will violate something. But, if not, just substitute jaywalking and the point remains the same. And, while it should be obvious, I guess it bears repeating: not everyone has driver's licenses.

In Montgomery County not cutting your grass is a violation.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How many of you actually read the bill?

Or did you just get the quick and dirty from a website?

I am willing to be not many of you have read it.

I have read it. What's your point?

That have not and hopave no idea what they are talking about either for or against it. Most probably don't even know how to find the bill.