Peer Masking as a Reasonable Accommodation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Accommodations are made all the time at schools.

There are no tree nuts allowed in classrooms of kids with allergies. There are kids who get preferential seating near the teacher due to vision issues. There are kids in wheelchairs whose classroom is on the main floor so they don't have to deal with the stairs/elevators. LOTS of accommodations.

Seems reasonable that if there is a particular medical issue that makes masking a need for a kid that it would be a reasonable accommodation. It also seems reasonable that if a kid needs to be in an un-masked classroom due to speech issues that would be accommodated too... that might mean that those two kids aren't in the same class, but they each have their educational needs met.

Exactly! Schools are already accustomed to managing and balancing numerous accommodations. We’ve definitely been in a classroom with a child that had a severe but allergy and all the families understood they had to do their part to keep that student as safe as possible. My kids would definitely be willing to mask up to keep their peers safe.

Avoiding bringing PB&J or nuts for lunch is not the same as requiring an entire class to wear masks all day - and then making others who need to have others not masked for hearing issues or whatnot move to another class.

It’s doable and kids are already moved around frequently and placed in certain classrooms to accommodate disabilities.

[Anonymous]

E.O. 2 and S.B. 739 are the law in Virginia. This is not a class action, and the twelve plaintiffs in this case have no legal right to ask the Court to deviate from that state law in any schools in Virginia (much less school districts) their children do not attend, or indeed even those areas of their schools in which Plaintiffs' children do not frequent. In other words, only those schools Plaintiffs attend or would attend are directly impacted by this Court's decision.

Albemarle County (Brownsville Elementary School), Bedford County (Stanton River Middle), Chesapeake (Grassfield Elementary, Southeastern Elementary), Chesterfield County (Enon Elementary), Cumberland County (Cumberland Elementary), Fairfax County (Stenwood Elementary), Henrico County (Quioccasin Middle), Loudoun County (Trailside Middle and Loudoun County High), Manassas City (Jennie Dean Elementary), York County (Tabb Middle). Am. Compl. ¶¶ 71, 83, 89, 98, 106, 119, 125, 135, 144, 154, 164, 174.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

So you’re saying it should be optional, i.e. what I’m willing to do?

To some extent, but it depends. There was news about a school that asked other students to volunteer to be in a masked classroom to accommodate a student with a disability and many volunteered. Lots of different, creative ways to make reasonable accommodations work. Many of you are being very narrow-minded about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:E.O. 2 and S.B. 739 are the law in Virginia. This is not a class action, and the twelve plaintiffs in this case have no legal right to ask the Court to deviate from that state law in any schools in Virginia (much less school districts) their children do not attend, or indeed even those areas of their schools in which Plaintiffs' children do not frequent. In other words, only those schools Plaintiffs attend or would attend are directly impacted by this Court's decision.

Albemarle County (Brownsville Elementary School), Bedford County (Stanton River Middle), Chesapeake (Grassfield Elementary, Southeastern Elementary), Chesterfield County (Enon Elementary), Cumberland County (Cumberland Elementary), Fairfax County (Stenwood Elementary), Henrico County (Quioccasin Middle), Loudoun County (Trailside Middle and Loudoun County High), Manassas City (Jennie Dean Elementary), York County (Tabb Middle). Am. Compl. ¶¶ 71, 83, 89, 98, 106, 119, 125, 135, 144, 154, 164, 174.

Here's the settlement agreement, https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf The state and state officials were parties to the case and are bound by the agreement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

Nope. There are home based teaching options if you are that medically fragile.

Yikes. The pandemic really has broken some people, hasn't it?

Some would argue that the people thinking that requiring an entire class of young children to mask indefinitely is a reasonable accommodation are the ones who are broken.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

Masks don’t work with young kids. They don’t wear them properly, they are gross at the end of the day, and it’s not hygienic. It’s a gross cloth accessory.

Maybe this could work in a HS where kids only have to wear it in the class(es) with that other student. But at the elementary level you’re talking about all day long, possibly for multiple years of life if in the class with that student more than once. We have zero studies on the long term effects of constant masking beginning in young childhood.

It makes much more since to have the child with cancer wear an N95 that actually provides them with protection.

Huh? My kindergartener wears a mask just fine. She and her friends wore masks just fine in preschool too.

Oh, sure. She loves it so much because you told her she does. Poor kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Yes but reasonable people can disagree on what constitutes a reasonable accommodation. More relevantly, per the pl, the ruling contradicts your argument and explicitly states that schools must provide an alternative placement fir any children who don’t want to mask. So again, what happens in the case that no other families in the grade want their kids to mask?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Asking a classroom of other students to do something they and their parents don't want them to is not a reasonable accommodation for the one student.

[Anonymous]

I am hearing impaired and use reading of lips as part of my ability to understand people when they speak. The pandemic has made it really, really challenging because I just have no ability to understand when faces are masked.

If the schools do this, I hope they enforce clear masks so those of us with hearing issues aren't left behind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nbc12.com/2022/12/12/aclu-parents-virginia-settle-lawsuit-school-masking-accommodations/

Does this mean what I think it means? That schools can require students to mask as an accommodation for others? What happens when someone filed a counter request for an accommodation that their child has a disability that makes masking difficult (such as social or speech delays)?

Is there a certain illness metric that must be met, or is the school now required to enforce universal masking if one kid makes a claim that they need an accommodation. Why now when COVID numbers are low? Will this apply to fly, RSV, etc.?

This seems like a giant can of worms and I’m sure I’ll get skewered, but I don’t want my young kids back in masks. My almost-5 year old spent nearly half his life in one and hated it. He has delays and it was a nightmare for us to get him to wear it. We are vaxxed and boosted, and masked when mandated, so no, not crazy Trumpers. But I am concerned we are opening the door to this concept of making a whole class of kids be a part of a student’s accommodation.

And FWIW I also don’t think a whole class of kids should be disrupted because one student with an IEP is having a violent meltdown. In general I think accommodations should not extend to altering the behavior of other students in class.

Speech delays have nothing to do with masking. ASD might. It's kinda sad you cannot be considerate to the child who may have health issues who otherwise may not be able to go to school. Being vaccinated and boosted helps your child not others as its not stopping transmission fully. Maybe you should homeschool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Asking a classroom of other students to do something they and their parents don't want them to is not a reasonable accommodation for the one student.

Actually it is and its good to teach your kids a sense of community and empathy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

Masks don’t work with young kids. They don’t wear them properly, they are gross at the end of the day, and it’s not hygienic. It’s a gross cloth accessory.

Maybe this could work in a HS where kids only have to wear it in the class(es) with that other student. But at the elementary level you’re talking about all day long, possibly for multiple years of life if in the class with that student more than once. We have zero studies on the long term effects of constant masking beginning in young childhood.

It makes much more since to have the child with cancer wear an N95 that actually provides them with protection.

Huh? My kindergartener wears a mask just fine. She and her friends wore masks just fine in preschool too.

Oh, sure. She loves it so much because you told her she does. Poor kids.

Have you stopped to think about what you are saying?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is the full settlement: https://www.acluva.org/sites/default/files/field_documents/seaman_v._virginia_settlement_agreement_fully_executed.pdf

I can't cut and paste from it, but it makes clear that this is not some kind of right to reinstitute 100% masking based on an unsupported allegation that the child is "immunocompromised" or whatever. Kids in Virginia still have rights NOT to mask - both under Virginia law and the ADA.

Thanks for posting! It's actually very narrow in saying that the plaintiffs can request masking as an accommodation (no guarantee it will be given) and explicitly says that schools also have to accommodate kids who don't want to mask by providing an alternate placement.

Sorry - that's backwards. Why should everyone else have to seek alternative placement rather than the student "requiring" their peers be masked? THAT's the one who needs to seek alternative placement.

Also what happens if no one else in the grade wants their kids to have to mask and they all requests an alternative placement ?

Students with disabilities have certain rights that don’t apply to non-disabled students. A kid with a disability has a right to a reasonable accommodation for their disability.

Asking a classroom of other students to do something they and their parents don't want them to is not a reasonable accommodation for the one student.

Actually it is and its good to teach your kids a sense of community and empathy.

And to give them speech issues, challenges connecting/recognizing emotions, and failure to develop normal immunity