AAP Center Elimination Rumors

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Talk about wishful thinking. This is such BS it actually made me laugh. When someone says “many,” it’s always a huge tell that they think no one will call them out. The fact is, you have no idea how any kids are doing, other than your own. And as another poster said, the proof is at graduation when you see all of the great colleges the kids go to - who were never in AAP in elementary school.

The labeling really does give you a false sense of superiority though, doesn’t it?
DP

How do you know which kids went through AAP other than the ones in your kid's pyramid? High schools have many pyramids feeding into them. Memorizing all those AAP kids especially if your kid didn't get in, to watch them progress through high school and note which schools they got into is... a bit obsessive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Congratulations! You just made the argument that the top of GE kids should get a chance to be exposed to the curriculum too!

Her elementary school had a great curriculum. Encouraging and challenging. You don't need to segregate kids to provide that

You might want to research and find out what the most important thing is to increase learning and achievement.

Yes, right now the top of GE kids are sitting around waiting for others to catch up most of the time. I don't see how I can help instill good study habits when DC is getting 100 on tests with little to no effort. DC is one of the segregated students who deserves access to the curriculum in the classroom that is right next door, but doesn't get it because the local school is a center and the educators who know DC don't get to make that choice.

There will always be a cut off. Even if your kid gets in, it just shifts the cut off criteria lower and then the next kid will be hitting the cut off and complaining.

DP. Which is why the cutoff is a false threshold. Can the kid do the work? Great, then s/he should be given that work. Period. There shouldn’t be a test given in the 1st and 2nd grade (!!) to determine who is bright enough to do advanced work.

Their AAP application determined that they can't do the work. Apply again next year when you feel they're old enough to show advanced abilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Sorry, no. Getting a certain score on a test given at the age of 6/7 is not proof that a child either is or is not able to do advanced work. As others have said, there are plenty of kids in AAP who are only there due to intense prepping by their parents and outside tutoring. And there are kids in GE were never prepped or tutored but who could easily do AAP work if given the chance. Let’s be clear: AAP is *not* neurosurgery. And it’s definitely not even a gifted curriculum. It’s just slightly accelerated - which tons of GE kids would be able to do. Many schools, in fact, have been simply using the AAP curriculum for their GE students, which is as it should be.

Face it - you enjoy the gatekeeping aspect of this and don’t want the segregation to end because then you’d have to stop pretending your child is somehow smarter than the others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Sorry, no. Getting a certain score on a test given at the age of 6/7 is not proof that a child either is or is not able to do advanced work. As others have said, there are plenty of kids in AAP who are only there due to intense prepping by their parents and outside tutoring. And there are kids in GE were never prepped or tutored but who could easily do AAP work if given the chance. Let’s be clear: AAP is *not* neurosurgery. And it’s definitely not even a gifted curriculum. It’s just slightly accelerated - which tons of GE kids would be able to do. Many schools, in fact, have been simply using the AAP curriculum for their GE students, which is as it should be.

Face it - you enjoy the gatekeeping aspect of this and don’t want the segregation to end because then you’d have to stop pretending your child is somehow smarter than the others.

Face it. Honors for all is a failure. Gate keeping is required. Unfortunately some are left on the outside of the gate. The county is getting poorer and families who care about academics need a safe haven. AAP is it. Sorry some kids aren’t good at tests every year and can’t make the cut. Try again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Talk about wishful thinking. This is such BS it actually made me laugh. When someone says “many,” it’s always a huge tell that they think no one will call them out. The fact is, you have no idea how any kids are doing, other than your own. And as another poster said, the proof is at graduation when you see all of the great colleges the kids go to - who were never in AAP in elementary school.

The labeling really does give you a false sense of superiority though, doesn’t it?
DP

How do you know which kids went through AAP other than the ones in your kid's pyramid? High schools have many pyramids feeding into them. Memorizing all those AAP kids especially if your kid didn't get in, to watch them progress through high school and note which schools they got into is... a bit obsessive.

Funny that you saw nothing obsessive about the PPP’s post, claiming she keeps tabs on the progress of all the students in her kid’s classes and pretending she knows how they’re all doing academically. Was that you? Either way, hypocrite much?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Kids who are at center schools are a disadvantage here because there is no room to push in to the advanced classes. So it's a committee of strangers who make the decision about my kids. The max local staff can do is assign my kids to part time services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Congratulations! You just made the argument that the top of GE kids should get a chance to be exposed to the curriculum too!

Her elementary school had a great curriculum. Encouraging and challenging. You don't need to segregate kids to provide that

You might want to research and find out what the most important thing is to increase learning and achievement.

Yes, right now the top of GE kids are sitting around waiting for others to catch up most of the time. I don't see how I can help instill good study habits when DC is getting 100 on tests with little to no effort. DC is one of the segregated students who deserves access to the curriculum in the classroom that is right next door, but doesn't get it because the local school is a center and the educators who know DC don't get to make that choice.

There will always be a cut off. Even if your kid gets in, it just shifts the cut off criteria lower and then the next kid will be hitting the cut off and complaining.

DP. Which is why the cutoff is a false threshold. Can the kid do the work? Great, then s/he should be given that work. Period. There shouldn’t be a test given in the 1st and 2nd grade (!!) to determine who is bright enough to do advanced work.

Their AAP application determined that they can't do the work. Apply again next year when you feel they're old enough to show advanced abilities.

You are insufferable. A test score doesn’t determine whether a child is capable of more advanced work. And it’s amusing that you think otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Talk about wishful thinking. This is such BS it actually made me laugh. When someone says “many,” it’s always a huge tell that they think no one will call them out. The fact is, you have no idea how any kids are doing, other than your own. And as another poster said, the proof is at graduation when you see all of the great colleges the kids go to - who were never in AAP in elementary school.

The labeling really does give you a false sense of superiority though, doesn’t it?
DP

How do you know which kids went through AAP other than the ones in your kid's pyramid? High schools have many pyramids feeding into them. Memorizing all those AAP kids especially if your kid didn't get in, to watch them progress through high school and note which schools they got into is... a bit obsessive.

Funny that you saw nothing obsessive about the PPP’s post, claiming she keeps tabs on the progress of all the students in her kid’s classes and pretending she knows how they’re all doing academically. Was that you? Either way, hypocrite much?

You are doing the same thing...
It wasn't me. I don't know or care who is in the program out of my kid's circle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Kids who are at center schools are a disadvantage here because there is no room to push in to the advanced classes. So it's a committee of strangers who make the decision about my kids. The max local staff can do is assign my kids to part time services.

+1
And we all know that “part time services” is merely a euphemism for “handing the kid a worksheet once a week and pretending that’s enrichment.”

The whole Level 1, 2, 3, 4 nonsense is all so absurd. Just have flexible groupings where all kids can get the instruction they need, every day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just wait. When they don't get in TJ, self-esteem flies away.

+1
I mean, surely FCPS has done a study on AAP kids and outcomes once in high school and beyond? Once high school starts, all of these kids are in honors and AP classes together and many of the prior "GE" kids far outpace prior "AAP" kids, to include attending much better colleges. The labeling at the age of seven is doing no one any favors.

+1

It’s only around because some parents want segregation from the poors.

Not our experience. In high school, the AAP kids are doing better in the honors and AP classes. There are some kids with no AAP experience who are trying an honors class and it’s difficult for them as they aren’t used to the challenge. Many also didn’t develop the work ethic or study skills that the AAP kids did because their curriculum was harder.

Congratulations! You just made the argument that the top of GE kids should get a chance to be exposed to the curriculum too!

Her elementary school had a great curriculum. Encouraging and challenging. You don't need to segregate kids to provide that

You might want to research and find out what the most important thing is to increase learning and achievement.

Yes, right now the top of GE kids are sitting around waiting for others to catch up most of the time. I don't see how I can help instill good study habits when DC is getting 100 on tests with little to no effort. DC is one of the segregated students who deserves access to the curriculum in the classroom that is right next door, but doesn't get it because the local school is a center and the educators who know DC don't get to make that choice.

There will always be a cut off. Even if your kid gets in, it just shifts the cut off criteria lower and then the next kid will be hitting the cut off and complaining.

DP. Which is why the cutoff is a false threshold. Can the kid do the work? Great, then s/he should be given that work. Period. There shouldn’t be a test given in the 1st and 2nd grade (!!) to determine who is bright enough to do advanced work.

Their AAP application determined that they can't do the work. Apply again next year when you feel they're old enough to show advanced abilities.

You are insufferable. A test score doesn’t determine whether a child is capable of more advanced work. And it’s amusing that you think otherwise.

Good thing there is more to the application than the test score! Why don't you use some of those advanced work samples in the application?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Kids who are at center schools are a disadvantage here because there is no room to push in to the advanced classes. So it's a committee of strangers who make the decision about my kids. The max local staff can do is assign my kids to part time services.

So get the part time services and then apply again. We know a family who successfully did this and the kid was admitted to full time by the committee the following year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Centers are needed in schools where there aren’t enough level 4 kids to make a whole class.

Ok. But there are schools that have a large enough cohort. In my opinion, the centers should only be allowed if the cohort is too small. Why should we bus kids to a center when there is a large enough cohort with a designated class. I know our center pulls from two schools. Both of these schools including my own, has a designated AAP class (not cluster model) and routinely has enough kids (12-17 kids)

It's crazy that you are anti busing AAP kids but are just fine with a 1:12 teacher to student ratio only for AAP. Doubtful that general ed classes have that ratio.

Wow. No, mommy, principals place other smart students into the Level IV class to make sure it is a similar size to the other classrooms. Most of these kids would have gotten into AAP if they were in a Title I or lower SES school anyway, so it works out. Your little baby is not "gifted" as much as you want to think s/he is. Principal placed kids do just as well if not better than the kids who got into AAP because their 2nd grade teacher liked them.

Principal placed kids get there because parents suck up to them.
Second grade teachers of the student are not on the selection committee for full time AAP.
Principal placing kids who did not make the cut into classrooms are part of the reason people prefer centers. The peer group has all been selected by a neutral centralized committee rather than who sucks up to the principal.

AAP is an advanced program. It must be hard for you to accept that even with a lower standard than gifted your kid still didn't make the cut. It's not the end of the world.

You're absolutely right, it's not the end of the world, yet here you are getting suuuuper defensive and freaking out and insulting people that you 100% know are telling the truth but oh boy, you just can't handle the fact that your child isn't as precious as you think s/he is. Trust me, my kids are going to end up in the exact same AP classes as yours in high school and will probably blow them out of the water.

You were the first to bring up kids saying my "little baby isnt gifted as I think he is." Well it's a good thing there are tests that independently confirmed giftedness for them. No sucking up needed.

It's very weird that you are comparing your kids future academic success to that of strangers. You sound very insecure about needing that annual principal placement for your future academic rockstar.

Yeah some people are really bothered by their kids not being selected for AAP. I enjoy listening to them complain and denigrate others kids.

If they stood back and took a second to breathe, they would understand that the kids are really where they need to be and should be happy the system allows this much flexibility for everyone’s learning needs.

Where is the flexibility for the remedial children? Where are their centers? Why do they have to be lumped in with all of the normal children while your special snowflake gets advanced math and extra special worksheets in AAP?

Are you serious? The elimination of leveled classrooms/tracking and the mainstreaming of remedial and special ed students was the result of parents of those students pushing for mainstreaming. Parents of advanced and on-level kids didn't do any of this to you - point your finger at your own counterparts from the last decades.

Currently, you could advocate for more tracking in every school - but I'd be ready from blowback from other parents who don't want to see their kid in the remedial class, even if it would be the best fit.

LOLing at you saying AAP parents didn't cause this. PLEASE. Parents are absolutely the reason there is a bloated AAP program full of normal children who belong in GenEd.

+1
I blame FCPS for allowing this system to get so bloated and out of control. What a joke it is now, compared to when they had a tiny and excellent GT program.

So your kid didn't make it into AAP but you're arguing to reduce the number of other kids' access to AAP.
What do you get out of this? Your kid isn't getting in either way. Is it spite that drives this behavior?

DP. So you're admitting that your kid is at the bottom of aap? Otherwise you would be happy to get rid of the low performers and elevate the class as a whole.

No. My kids are legitimately gifted. I don't covet what those kids have and have no reason to be spiteful like you apparently do. Low performers haven't impacted our school 's AAP classrooms. The teachers don't appear to slow down for stragglers. They move through material and you either get it or you don't.

Every AAP parent says this, LOL!

+100
It's such a tell. The only reason AAP was opened up to the masses is because of the ridiculous "equity" push. Same with TJ. Both AAP and TJ admissions need to go back to merit ONLY, and take only the top 5% of students. The ones who absolutely need a gifted curriculum - which AAP is certainly not.

No, the tell is those of you who don't realize that there is a whole world outside of FCPS for gifted people. There are a lot of resources for gifted children to be able to learn and grow outside of school and FCPS isn't the beginning or end of education. There really isn't a need to obsess over AAP.

Great, it sounds like your child is getting enough enrichment from all of your outside gifted people resources and doesn't need a separate "advanced" curriculum in school. We all agree, woohoo!

Nope. VA still requires gifted education. AAP won't be going away.

DP. No one is talking about doing away with AAP - or advanced classes. Ending the segregation that are center schools and the AAP program as a whole is the problem. If a kid can do the work, there is no reason why they shouldn’t be in an advanced group. Flexible groupings per core class are the obvious answer.

Your post completely contradicts itself.

The kids who have proven they can do the work are in the advanced group. It's called AAP. Apply again next year.

Kids who are at center schools are a disadvantage here because there is no room to push in to the advanced classes. So it's a committee of strangers who make the decision about my kids. The max local staff can do is assign my kids to part time services.

+1
And we all know that “part time services” is merely a euphemism for “handing the kid a worksheet once a week and pretending that’s enrichment.”

The whole Level 1, 2, 3, 4 nonsense is all so absurd. Just have flexible groupings where all kids can get the instruction they need, every day.

I always feel like the part time services designation is the local staff admitting that my kid needs more even if there's nothing they can do about it.
I say this because once in part time/ level 3 you can't get dropped from it. (But subject specific has to be renewed each year)
Unfortunately, the level 4 committee seems to think if you are at a school with enough strong peers then you don't need challenging curriculum. But, a lot of us would argue that if you are at a school with a lot of strong peers then you have a lot of kids who can handle and should get the aap curriculum.

[Anonymous]

I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't care if they get rid of Centers or not. What I do care about is that they drop kids who don't belong in AAP every year. Didn't get pass advanced in SOLs or 90+ percentile on both iready tests? OUT.

Exactly. The whole point is to not be slow the class down pulling up the stragglers. And to the poster who is just sure her child belongs if not for the mean test scores saying no - maybe you should prep your kid for the test if you are so convinced they'd be fine with all the work. Tests are the most fair way to evaluate aptitude that we have. The line has to be drawn somewhere. It's already too low, as shown by all the whining here about other kids that got in. I'd love for it to be higher. However, we'd just be hearing from a different set of parents instead of you.

No, the whole point is that fcps should keep their word and start meeting all kids where they are at.
The fact that there are kids in aap dragging it down and kids in ge sitting around running out of work to do (per the teacher, not just the kids saying it) illustrates the problems with the current system. Maybe if all kids were met where they were at, less on the fringe parents would apply just because.