If you are someone who "warns" people of the dangers of COVID on social media

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They are riding high on the moral ground that COVID gives them to look down on anyone who doesn't agree with them. "I'm such a good person! I wear my mask! I do whatever the cdc tells me to do. If Fauci says boost, I say shoot me up!"

Thankfully this forum isn't real life. No one cares irl.

It differs from place to place. My in laws live in a community full of Trumpsters and nearly everyone is unmasked and few are fully vaccinated let alone boosted. Although many of their neighbors and coworkers have had Covid more than once or are struggling with long Covid, they can’t deviate from what the people around them do. Yet they are shocked when Grandma dies or Junior is hospitalized.

Both are wrong. COVID purity moralizing is extremely off putting. Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior. If you are just literally posting about rising case rates or your personal experience with long COVID, I do think that can be valuable. But if you are just shouting into the abyss about people not taking COVID seriously enough, you're not achieving anything.

Please take your admonishment that "Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior" to heart. People have picked their sides at this point. Thinking of people on the other side of the line from you as psychopaths and P.O.S. isn't helping sway them to your side, and I don't think it's healthy mentally for the person who's doing it, either.

I don't think of "people on the other side of the line" are psychopaths and P O Ss. I think there are some pro mask/lockdown posters who behave horribly/dishonestly on these boards who are P O Ss and psychopaths. These are people who post falsehoods repeatedly and ignore when someone posts proof that they are wrong. People who say any child's mental illness was caused by their parents. I've seen that gem a lot. People who insist than anyone who isn't masking right now didn't make any sacrifices in 2020-21 - also a common talking point. Those posters are psychopaths.

Everyone on the pro-masking side will eventually give up masks. In other words, the people in favor of normalcy will "win." It's truly crazy that people are planning on giving up normal socialization for themselves and their children indefinitely. Lack of normal socializing will also cause changes to the brain and remodeling of circuitry...

It’s been almost 3 years. When will people give up masks exactly? Most of the families at our daycare are still masking their 2-4yos even though not required anymore and I truly don’t get what the endgame is. Masks are mostly a joke in that environment anyway but clearly they think the minimal benefit is worth it. For how long though?

Why not ask them? The endgame for them is to probably limit Covid infections in their chidren, but I can't read their minds. That's our reason to mask our school age kids.

DP you know exactly why we don't ask. Because anyone who questions masking, even toddler masking, gets accused of causing mass death/disability (see the first page of this thread). Even our therapist, who indicated privately to me that DD's in-school therapy would be easier without masks (and in fact once they dropped the mask requirement for everyone suddenly we saw a lot of progress) did not want to come out and say that to the teachers. It had been a struggle to get them to even allow the therapist into the school, so it was a very calculated decision.

What this really comes down to is for how long should the general population make sacrifices to prevent death/disability in a small (but definitely significant) percentage of people. And how do we decide which sacrifices are worth it? What I see a lot on these boards is that folks do not think masking (of toddlers or older children and adults) or avoiding indoor activities is a sacrifice at all, and that COVID precautions don't cause any significant harm. Many of us did change our behavior significantly in 2020-2021 because we do recognize that COVID is serious. By the time 2022 rolled around, it became clear that the cost to ourselves and our child was too much. These precautions are fine for short periods of time. When they are in place for years, for many of us the harms build up. Maybe you haven't experienced that in your family and that's great. But we have and the harms are real. It's a risk though, to say this publicly, because those that haven't had the issues we have deny that they even exist and think of us as murderers. No thanks. The risk is not worth the benefit of such a conversation. I will stick to the people in my life who recognize that different people have different priorities and priorities other than COVID are valid.

Of course our kids have experienced Covid related frustrations. It's not fun to be the only kid sitting outside for lunch, or any number of situations that they deal with. And I don't know anyone who would prefer to wear masks if there were zero perceived threat. People approach risk differently. If you child is able to receive maskless therapy right now, that's great and I hope it continues. I don't think forcing toddlers to mask is fair either, despite all the assumptions made about me because I mask. If mandates ever came back, I would support exceptions for small children and certain other children. Just don't judge parents who do mask their toddlers. They aren't your enemy.

We aren't giving up the masks in our house because we have found workarounds. We try to live a full life, but to us, the risk of infection is high to long term quality of life. If that calculus changes, so will our behavior. I certainly hope it does, but for now that's where we are at.

I could not care less if parents at DD's daycare mask their child. It doesn't affect me, so I definitely don't think they are my enemy. The masks rarely cover their nose and often don't cover their mouths either so it's more of a chin strap anyway. Which does make me wonder why they do it. Doesn't mean I need to confront them about it. What could possibly be the benefit of that?

To be fair, you posted asking why they still do it. It sounded to me like it bothered you on some level, but I guess not.

DP- you aren't curious why parents would force their kids to wear something that's so obviously ineffective and interferes with social interactions/communication? Like what is the point? I mean, I don't really care either except that teachers at our daycare felt pressured to mask up again because so many parents continued to send their kids wearing masks half-a$$.

As someone who masks in an area where usually NO ONE else does (military base), I don't think you can blame other parents for teachers who mask. They are adults and if masks are optional, they are making a choice to do it. If I had a younger kid, I would want to protect them from all the circulating viruses, but I don't think cloth masks do enough (it's not nothing, but it's minimal). It would depend on what the kid could manage and was appropriate for them, and I'd probably not be in a group childcare setting right now if I could help it.

We actually have a quite few people masking this week as they are sick of getting sick before the holidays. Seems a sensible reaction to current conditions.

This. I can tell you that most kids (and adults) at our preschool are still wearing masks and the viruses are still going around anyway, including Covid outbreaks. Those we know with vulnerable family members moved to nannyshares or SAH.

YMMV We have a very vulnerable friend and her child goes to school in person. Child and husband got COVID recently and thankfully she didn't get it. Many vulnerable people do take the risk, for a variety of reasons.

FWIW, “school” as in K-12, is a bit easier to navigate than preschool/daycare, for several reasons. The risks can be mitigated a bit more (speaking from personal experience)

Their kid still got COVID though. Since the beginning of the pandemic we've known young kids are less likely to spread COVID than older ones, so I am not sure your risk assessment is correct.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:If there's one covid positive kid in that class and they're napping next to a different person than they're working next to, the masks can be working fwiw. It won't protect the napping kid (or the kid eating next to the sick kid), but it will protect the working kid.

I understand you're saying it's still being transmitted. I think the idea is to prevent transmission where possible. Kids have to eat and nap without masks, I guess. But it could help the other kids, and seems like reducing transmission as much as is reasonably possible was the goal all along.

I understand we have different limits on what reasonable is. Just explaining that limits that still allow some transmission while preventing other transmission might still be reasonable in preventing some but not all spread. Imperfect, but still reasonable.

Is it really necessary to take masks off while napping? Obviously not for babies but older kids maybe. Mine sleeps with their head under a blanket half the time. My kids are older but illnesses seems to be running rampant right now. My neighbor has been home with her young kids all week and they wear the masks!

Oh FFS. It's a choking hazard. You want kids to risk their lives to avoid a cold? Lost the plot.

Many kids drop the nap at a certain point. Those kids can certainly stay masked during the “rest” period, you just have to ask.

You want kids to mask during napping? Good christ, you are the absolute worst.

[Anonymous]

Jesus Christ, you mask zealots on this thread are so weird. It’s pointless and neurotic at this point and you look superstitious. Why not carry a head of garlic with you to ward off the vampires while you’re at it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jesus Christ, you mask zealots on this thread are so weird. It’s pointless and neurotic at this point and you look superstitious. Why not carry a head of garlic with you to ward off the vampires while you’re at it?

It’s a religious garment, like a burka. They believe in the Church of Covid. Say 5 Hail Faucis, and keep the Pfaith.

Covid is eternal. Send those MAGA heathens to eternal hell!

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:OP is a snowflake.

A scared snowflake given that she’s too afraid to speak directly to the friends she is upset with.

Love the words, snowflake, sheep, woke, liberal, and so many more on this thread. These words say a lot about the speaker, and frankly, only positive things about the person being labeled. I think we've learned that in the last 7 years. You can choose to be intelligent, respectful, and considerate, or you can just be a dumba$$ calling other people names because it's impossible for you to understand and accept reality. Go ahead and get Covid or the flu, expose babies to RSV if that's your game, but the smart people really aren't going to do that and we aren't going to get upset when you name call, because we know you are just too dumb and immature. It's just not a problem. Really.

You're telling people not to call people names, but you label people as "dumb and immature"? lol

Those are adjectives. So, yes.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The people who are still neurotic and blathering on on socials and in public are the long-term victims of a sustained and powerful PR campaign by mainstream media and government. At the beginning, this was probably warranted, as we didn't know much... but like all government programs, it went on for far too long. We now have a legion of people who are go on spreading the gospel, and will for some time. My advice is to ignore them. They'll stop eventually.

Ah, key word, "mainstream media." You wouldn't know how to source information if your life depended on it. I am so exhausted by how many truly awful people there are, but also how dumb. More exhausted by that than Covid. 1.7 million people voted for Walker in this election. That shows where the problems are, unfortunately, and every state has them.

It's absolutely true that the CDC has been extremely slow to change course, if at all. They didn't start recommending N95 masks for public use until almost a year after supply became sufficient. I remember telling my colleagues about a particular N95 mask that was recommended to me by a family member who works in public health, and they all looked at me like I was stealing from health care workers (in the meantime the New York Times was reporting that domestic makers of N95s like the ones I had bought were struggling to sell them because the hospitals only wanted the cheaper Chinese-made ones). They are extremely stuck in their ways and have not done a good job of incorporating new information or balancing competing priorities.

Don't think you understood my comment. Pro mask wearing here.

[Anonymous]

I wonder whether people who don't mask in crowded indoor areas expect is going to happen to them, exactly?

If you catch covid 1-2x per year from this, and your chance of getting long covid is 15% each time, you're rolling the dice each time and you've got less than 7 years before the jig is up and you get long covid. Less time if you're including others in your family. Barring some major scientific development.

- Do you not believe in long covid and think it is a magical white lady disease? (I saw that earlier in this thread. Good luck with that.)
-- Is it just about hating masks no matter what the cost to your personal health?
- will you not take precautions like masking and not eating indoors again EVER or will you start again if more people around you are being careful again
- avoid any "optional" indoor social activities?
- if someone in your family gets long covid and suffers from constant fatigue and brain fog that doesn't resolve, will you change your mind about what precautions your family might have taken to prevent the exposure or at least reduce the dosage inhaled? Or will you still be happy with the choices you made now?

I'm pretty sure you will say you are happy with your choices because no one can plan for the unexpected. (It's not that unexpected! but whatever you do you)

[Anonymous]

I'm terrible at math. It's less than 4 years doh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jesus Christ, you mask zealots on this thread are so weird. It’s pointless and neurotic at this point and you look superstitious. Why not carry a head of garlic with you to ward off the vampires while you’re at it?

Sounds like a you problem.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They are riding high on the moral ground that COVID gives them to look down on anyone who doesn't agree with them. "I'm such a good person! I wear my mask! I do whatever the cdc tells me to do. If Fauci says boost, I say shoot me up!"

Thankfully this forum isn't real life. No one cares irl.

It differs from place to place. My in laws live in a community full of Trumpsters and nearly everyone is unmasked and few are fully vaccinated let alone boosted. Although many of their neighbors and coworkers have had Covid more than once or are struggling with long Covid, they can’t deviate from what the people around them do. Yet they are shocked when Grandma dies or Junior is hospitalized.

Both are wrong. COVID purity moralizing is extremely off putting. Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior. If you are just literally posting about rising case rates or your personal experience with long COVID, I do think that can be valuable. But if you are just shouting into the abyss about people not taking COVID seriously enough, you're not achieving anything.

Please take your admonishment that "Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior" to heart. People have picked their sides at this point. Thinking of people on the other side of the line from you as psychopaths and P.O.S. isn't helping sway them to your side, and I don't think it's healthy mentally for the person who's doing it, either.

I don't think of "people on the other side of the line" are psychopaths and P O Ss. I think there are some pro mask/lockdown posters who behave horribly/dishonestly on these boards who are P O Ss and psychopaths. These are people who post falsehoods repeatedly and ignore when someone posts proof that they are wrong. People who say any child's mental illness was caused by their parents. I've seen that gem a lot. People who insist than anyone who isn't masking right now didn't make any sacrifices in 2020-21 - also a common talking point. Those posters are psychopaths.

Everyone on the pro-masking side will eventually give up masks. In other words, the people in favor of normalcy will "win." It's truly crazy that people are planning on giving up normal socialization for themselves and their children indefinitely. Lack of normal socializing will also cause changes to the brain and remodeling of circuitry...

It’s been almost 3 years. When will people give up masks exactly? Most of the families at our daycare are still masking their 2-4yos even though not required anymore and I truly don’t get what the endgame is. Masks are mostly a joke in that environment anyway but clearly they think the minimal benefit is worth it. For how long though?

Why not ask them? The endgame for them is to probably limit Covid infections in their chidren, but I can't read their minds. That's our reason to mask our school age kids.

DP you know exactly why we don't ask. Because anyone who questions masking, even toddler masking, gets accused of causing mass death/disability (see the first page of this thread). Even our therapist, who indicated privately to me that DD's in-school therapy would be easier without masks (and in fact once they dropped the mask requirement for everyone suddenly we saw a lot of progress) did not want to come out and say that to the teachers. It had been a struggle to get them to even allow the therapist into the school, so it was a very calculated decision.

What this really comes down to is for how long should the general population make sacrifices to prevent death/disability in a small (but definitely significant) percentage of people. And how do we decide which sacrifices are worth it? What I see a lot on these boards is that folks do not think masking (of toddlers or older children and adults) or avoiding indoor activities is a sacrifice at all, and that COVID precautions don't cause any significant harm. Many of us did change our behavior significantly in 2020-2021 because we do recognize that COVID is serious. By the time 2022 rolled around, it became clear that the cost to ourselves and our child was too much. These precautions are fine for short periods of time. When they are in place for years, for many of us the harms build up. Maybe you haven't experienced that in your family and that's great. But we have and the harms are real. It's a risk though, to say this publicly, because those that haven't had the issues we have deny that they even exist and think of us as murderers. No thanks. The risk is not worth the benefit of such a conversation. I will stick to the people in my life who recognize that different people have different priorities and priorities other than COVID are valid.

Of course our kids have experienced Covid related frustrations. It's not fun to be the only kid sitting outside for lunch, or any number of situations that they deal with. And I don't know anyone who would prefer to wear masks if there were zero perceived threat. People approach risk differently. If you child is able to receive maskless therapy right now, that's great and I hope it continues. I don't think forcing toddlers to mask is fair either, despite all the assumptions made about me because I mask. If mandates ever came back, I would support exceptions for small children and certain other children. Just don't judge parents who do mask their toddlers. They aren't your enemy.

We aren't giving up the masks in our house because we have found workarounds. We try to live a full life, but to us, the risk of infection is high to long term quality of life. If that calculus changes, so will our behavior. I certainly hope it does, but for now that's where we are at.

I could not care less if parents at DD's daycare mask their child. It doesn't affect me, so I definitely don't think they are my enemy. The masks rarely cover their nose and often don't cover their mouths either so it's more of a chin strap anyway. Which does make me wonder why they do it. Doesn't mean I need to confront them about it. What could possibly be the benefit of that?

To be fair, you posted asking why they still do it. It sounded to me like it bothered you on some level, but I guess not.

DP- you aren't curious why parents would force their kids to wear something that's so obviously ineffective and interferes with social interactions/communication? Like what is the point? I mean, I don't really care either except that teachers at our daycare felt pressured to mask up again because so many parents continued to send their kids wearing masks half-a$$.

As someone who masks in an area where usually NO ONE else does (military base), I don't think you can blame other parents for teachers who mask. They are adults and if masks are optional, they are making a choice to do it. If I had a younger kid, I would want to protect them from all the circulating viruses, but I don't think cloth masks do enough (it's not nothing, but it's minimal). It would depend on what the kid could manage and was appropriate for them, and I'd probably not be in a group childcare setting right now if I could help it.

We actually have a quite few people masking this week as they are sick of getting sick before the holidays. Seems a sensible reaction to current conditions.

This. I can tell you that most kids (and adults) at our preschool are still wearing masks and the viruses are still going around anyway, including Covid outbreaks. Those we know with vulnerable family members moved to nannyshares or SAH.

YMMV We have a very vulnerable friend and her child goes to school in person. Child and husband got COVID recently and thankfully she didn't get it. Many vulnerable people do take the risk, for a variety of reasons.

FWIW, “school” as in K-12, is a bit easier to navigate than preschool/daycare, for several reasons. The risks can be mitigated a bit more (speaking from personal experience)

Their kid still got COVID though. Since the beginning of the pandemic we've known young kids are less likely to spread COVID than older ones, so I am not sure your risk assessment is correct.

Young kids can get Covid the same but it’s generally not life threatening. Those young kids live with adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jesus Christ, you mask zealots on this thread are so weird. It’s pointless and neurotic at this point and you look superstitious. Why not carry a head of garlic with you to ward off the vampires while you’re at it?

It’s a religious garment, like a burka. They believe in the Church of Covid. Say 5 Hail Faucis, and keep the Pfaith.

Covid is eternal. Send those MAGA heathens to eternal hell!

It’s obvious that you are trying hard to marginalize and put a stigma on mask wearers. We’ve seen this playbook many times before on a myriad of issues. We aren’t phased by your sad attempts to bully. We aren’t weak like you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They are riding high on the moral ground that COVID gives them to look down on anyone who doesn't agree with them. "I'm such a good person! I wear my mask! I do whatever the cdc tells me to do. If Fauci says boost, I say shoot me up!"

Thankfully this forum isn't real life. No one cares irl.

It differs from place to place. My in laws live in a community full of Trumpsters and nearly everyone is unmasked and few are fully vaccinated let alone boosted. Although many of their neighbors and coworkers have had Covid more than once or are struggling with long Covid, they can’t deviate from what the people around them do. Yet they are shocked when Grandma dies or Junior is hospitalized.

Both are wrong. COVID purity moralizing is extremely off putting. Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior. If you are just literally posting about rising case rates or your personal experience with long COVID, I do think that can be valuable. But if you are just shouting into the abyss about people not taking COVID seriously enough, you're not achieving anything.

Please take your admonishment that "Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior" to heart. People have picked their sides at this point. Thinking of people on the other side of the line from you as psychopaths and P.O.S. isn't helping sway them to your side, and I don't think it's healthy mentally for the person who's doing it, either.

I don't think of "people on the other side of the line" are psychopaths and P O Ss. I think there are some pro mask/lockdown posters who behave horribly/dishonestly on these boards who are P O Ss and psychopaths. These are people who post falsehoods repeatedly and ignore when someone posts proof that they are wrong. People who say any child's mental illness was caused by their parents. I've seen that gem a lot. People who insist than anyone who isn't masking right now didn't make any sacrifices in 2020-21 - also a common talking point. Those posters are psychopaths.

Everyone on the pro-masking side will eventually give up masks. In other words, the people in favor of normalcy will "win." It's truly crazy that people are planning on giving up normal socialization for themselves and their children indefinitely. Lack of normal socializing will also cause changes to the brain and remodeling of circuitry...

It’s been almost 3 years. When will people give up masks exactly? Most of the families at our daycare are still masking their 2-4yos even though not required anymore and I truly don’t get what the endgame is. Masks are mostly a joke in that environment anyway but clearly they think the minimal benefit is worth it. For how long though?

Why not ask them? The endgame for them is to probably limit Covid infections in their chidren, but I can't read their minds. That's our reason to mask our school age kids.

DP you know exactly why we don't ask. Because anyone who questions masking, even toddler masking, gets accused of causing mass death/disability (see the first page of this thread). Even our therapist, who indicated privately to me that DD's in-school therapy would be easier without masks (and in fact once they dropped the mask requirement for everyone suddenly we saw a lot of progress) did not want to come out and say that to the teachers. It had been a struggle to get them to even allow the therapist into the school, so it was a very calculated decision.

What this really comes down to is for how long should the general population make sacrifices to prevent death/disability in a small (but definitely significant) percentage of people. And how do we decide which sacrifices are worth it? What I see a lot on these boards is that folks do not think masking (of toddlers or older children and adults) or avoiding indoor activities is a sacrifice at all, and that COVID precautions don't cause any significant harm. Many of us did change our behavior significantly in 2020-2021 because we do recognize that COVID is serious. By the time 2022 rolled around, it became clear that the cost to ourselves and our child was too much. These precautions are fine for short periods of time. When they are in place for years, for many of us the harms build up. Maybe you haven't experienced that in your family and that's great. But we have and the harms are real. It's a risk though, to say this publicly, because those that haven't had the issues we have deny that they even exist and think of us as murderers. No thanks. The risk is not worth the benefit of such a conversation. I will stick to the people in my life who recognize that different people have different priorities and priorities other than COVID are valid.

Of course our kids have experienced Covid related frustrations. It's not fun to be the only kid sitting outside for lunch, or any number of situations that they deal with. And I don't know anyone who would prefer to wear masks if there were zero perceived threat. People approach risk differently. If you child is able to receive maskless therapy right now, that's great and I hope it continues. I don't think forcing toddlers to mask is fair either, despite all the assumptions made about me because I mask. If mandates ever came back, I would support exceptions for small children and certain other children. Just don't judge parents who do mask their toddlers. They aren't your enemy.

We aren't giving up the masks in our house because we have found workarounds. We try to live a full life, but to us, the risk of infection is high to long term quality of life. If that calculus changes, so will our behavior. I certainly hope it does, but for now that's where we are at.

I could not care less if parents at DD's daycare mask their child. It doesn't affect me, so I definitely don't think they are my enemy. The masks rarely cover their nose and often don't cover their mouths either so it's more of a chin strap anyway. Which does make me wonder why they do it. Doesn't mean I need to confront them about it. What could possibly be the benefit of that?

To be fair, you posted asking why they still do it. It sounded to me like it bothered you on some level, but I guess not.

DP- you aren't curious why parents would force their kids to wear something that's so obviously ineffective and interferes with social interactions/communication? Like what is the point? I mean, I don't really care either except that teachers at our daycare felt pressured to mask up again because so many parents continued to send their kids wearing masks half-a$$.

As someone who masks in an area where usually NO ONE else does (military base), I don't think you can blame other parents for teachers who mask. They are adults and if masks are optional, they are making a choice to do it. If I had a younger kid, I would want to protect them from all the circulating viruses, but I don't think cloth masks do enough (it's not nothing, but it's minimal). It would depend on what the kid could manage and was appropriate for them, and I'd probably not be in a group childcare setting right now if I could help it.

We actually have a quite few people masking this week as they are sick of getting sick before the holidays. Seems a sensible reaction to current conditions.

This. I can tell you that most kids (and adults) at our preschool are still wearing masks and the viruses are still going around anyway, including Covid outbreaks. Those we know with vulnerable family members moved to nannyshares or SAH.

YMMV We have a very vulnerable friend and her child goes to school in person. Child and husband got COVID recently and thankfully she didn't get it. Many vulnerable people do take the risk, for a variety of reasons.

FWIW, “school” as in K-12, is a bit easier to navigate than preschool/daycare, for several reasons. The risks can be mitigated a bit more (speaking from personal experience)

Their kid still got COVID though. Since the beginning of the pandemic we've known young kids are less likely to spread COVID than older ones, so I am not sure your risk assessment is correct.

That analysis was proven wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jesus Christ, you mask zealots on this thread are so weird. It’s pointless and neurotic at this point and you look superstitious. Why not carry a head of garlic with you to ward off the vampires while you’re at it?

You are SO hysterical and you just cannot stop yourself with the melodramatic language and grade school name calling. It's perseverative and indicative of a mental disorder. If you were truly happy, YOU WOULD NOT CARE what choices others make. Please get professional help to help you stop the cycle.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They are riding high on the moral ground that COVID gives them to look down on anyone who doesn't agree with them. "I'm such a good person! I wear my mask! I do whatever the cdc tells me to do. If Fauci says boost, I say shoot me up!"

Thankfully this forum isn't real life. No one cares irl.

It differs from place to place. My in laws live in a community full of Trumpsters and nearly everyone is unmasked and few are fully vaccinated let alone boosted. Although many of their neighbors and coworkers have had Covid more than once or are struggling with long Covid, they can’t deviate from what the people around them do. Yet they are shocked when Grandma dies or Junior is hospitalized.

Both are wrong. COVID purity moralizing is extremely off putting. Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior. If you are just literally posting about rising case rates or your personal experience with long COVID, I do think that can be valuable. But if you are just shouting into the abyss about people not taking COVID seriously enough, you're not achieving anything.

Please take your admonishment that "Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior" to heart. People have picked their sides at this point. Thinking of people on the other side of the line from you as psychopaths and P.O.S. isn't helping sway them to your side, and I don't think it's healthy mentally for the person who's doing it, either.

I don't think of "people on the other side of the line" are psychopaths and P O Ss. I think there are some pro mask/lockdown posters who behave horribly/dishonestly on these boards who are P O Ss and psychopaths. These are people who post falsehoods repeatedly and ignore when someone posts proof that they are wrong. People who say any child's mental illness was caused by their parents. I've seen that gem a lot. People who insist than anyone who isn't masking right now didn't make any sacrifices in 2020-21 - also a common talking point. Those posters are psychopaths.

Everyone on the pro-masking side will eventually give up masks. In other words, the people in favor of normalcy will "win." It's truly crazy that people are planning on giving up normal socialization for themselves and their children indefinitely. Lack of normal socializing will also cause changes to the brain and remodeling of circuitry...

It’s been almost 3 years. When will people give up masks exactly? Most of the families at our daycare are still masking their 2-4yos even though not required anymore and I truly don’t get what the endgame is. Masks are mostly a joke in that environment anyway but clearly they think the minimal benefit is worth it. For how long though?

Why not ask them? The endgame for them is to probably limit Covid infections in their chidren, but I can't read their minds. That's our reason to mask our school age kids.

DP you know exactly why we don't ask. Because anyone who questions masking, even toddler masking, gets accused of causing mass death/disability (see the first page of this thread). Even our therapist, who indicated privately to me that DD's in-school therapy would be easier without masks (and in fact once they dropped the mask requirement for everyone suddenly we saw a lot of progress) did not want to come out and say that to the teachers. It had been a struggle to get them to even allow the therapist into the school, so it was a very calculated decision.

What this really comes down to is for how long should the general population make sacrifices to prevent death/disability in a small (but definitely significant) percentage of people. And how do we decide which sacrifices are worth it? What I see a lot on these boards is that folks do not think masking (of toddlers or older children and adults) or avoiding indoor activities is a sacrifice at all, and that COVID precautions don't cause any significant harm. Many of us did change our behavior significantly in 2020-2021 because we do recognize that COVID is serious. By the time 2022 rolled around, it became clear that the cost to ourselves and our child was too much. These precautions are fine for short periods of time. When they are in place for years, for many of us the harms build up. Maybe you haven't experienced that in your family and that's great. But we have and the harms are real. It's a risk though, to say this publicly, because those that haven't had the issues we have deny that they even exist and think of us as murderers. No thanks. The risk is not worth the benefit of such a conversation. I will stick to the people in my life who recognize that different people have different priorities and priorities other than COVID are valid.

Of course our kids have experienced Covid related frustrations. It's not fun to be the only kid sitting outside for lunch, or any number of situations that they deal with. And I don't know anyone who would prefer to wear masks if there were zero perceived threat. People approach risk differently. If you child is able to receive maskless therapy right now, that's great and I hope it continues. I don't think forcing toddlers to mask is fair either, despite all the assumptions made about me because I mask. If mandates ever came back, I would support exceptions for small children and certain other children. Just don't judge parents who do mask their toddlers. They aren't your enemy.

We aren't giving up the masks in our house because we have found workarounds. We try to live a full life, but to us, the risk of infection is high to long term quality of life. If that calculus changes, so will our behavior. I certainly hope it does, but for now that's where we are at.

I could not care less if parents at DD's daycare mask their child. It doesn't affect me, so I definitely don't think they are my enemy. The masks rarely cover their nose and often don't cover their mouths either so it's more of a chin strap anyway. Which does make me wonder why they do it. Doesn't mean I need to confront them about it. What could possibly be the benefit of that?

To be fair, you posted asking why they still do it. It sounded to me like it bothered you on some level, but I guess not.

DP- you aren't curious why parents would force their kids to wear something that's so obviously ineffective and interferes with social interactions/communication? Like what is the point? I mean, I don't really care either except that teachers at our daycare felt pressured to mask up again because so many parents continued to send their kids wearing masks half-a$$.

As someone who masks in an area where usually NO ONE else does (military base), I don't think you can blame other parents for teachers who mask. They are adults and if masks are optional, they are making a choice to do it. If I had a younger kid, I would want to protect them from all the circulating viruses, but I don't think cloth masks do enough (it's not nothing, but it's minimal). It would depend on what the kid could manage and was appropriate for them, and I'd probably not be in a group childcare setting right now if I could help it.

We actually have a quite few people masking this week as they are sick of getting sick before the holidays. Seems a sensible reaction to current conditions.

This. I can tell you that most kids (and adults) at our preschool are still wearing masks and the viruses are still going around anyway, including Covid outbreaks. Those we know with vulnerable family members moved to nannyshares or SAH.

YMMV We have a very vulnerable friend and her child goes to school in person. Child and husband got COVID recently and thankfully she didn't get it. Many vulnerable people do take the risk, for a variety of reasons.

FWIW, “school” as in K-12, is a bit easier to navigate than preschool/daycare, for several reasons. The risks can be mitigated a bit more (speaking from personal experience)

Their kid still got COVID though. Since the beginning of the pandemic we've known young kids are less likely to spread COVID than older ones, so I am not sure your risk assessment is correct.

That analysis was proven wrong.

People who lap up Right Wing propaganda are still pretending it's true. "Science changes and adapts as it learns" is too high level of a concept for their simple brains.

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Anonymous wrote:They are riding high on the moral ground that COVID gives them to look down on anyone who doesn't agree with them. "I'm such a good person! I wear my mask! I do whatever the cdc tells me to do. If Fauci says boost, I say shoot me up!"

Thankfully this forum isn't real life. No one cares irl.

It differs from place to place. My in laws live in a community full of Trumpsters and nearly everyone is unmasked and few are fully vaccinated let alone boosted. Although many of their neighbors and coworkers have had Covid more than once or are struggling with long Covid, they can’t deviate from what the people around them do. Yet they are shocked when Grandma dies or Junior is hospitalized.

Both are wrong. COVID purity moralizing is extremely off putting. Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior. If you are just literally posting about rising case rates or your personal experience with long COVID, I do think that can be valuable. But if you are just shouting into the abyss about people not taking COVID seriously enough, you're not achieving anything.

Please take your admonishment that "Nobody who doesn't already agree with you is going to be convinced to change their behavior" to heart. People have picked their sides at this point. Thinking of people on the other side of the line from you as psychopaths and P.O.S. isn't helping sway them to your side, and I don't think it's healthy mentally for the person who's doing it, either.

I don't think of "people on the other side of the line" are psychopaths and P O Ss. I think there are some pro mask/lockdown posters who behave horribly/dishonestly on these boards who are P O Ss and psychopaths. These are people who post falsehoods repeatedly and ignore when someone posts proof that they are wrong. People who say any child's mental illness was caused by their parents. I've seen that gem a lot. People who insist than anyone who isn't masking right now didn't make any sacrifices in 2020-21 - also a common talking point. Those posters are psychopaths.

Everyone on the pro-masking side will eventually give up masks. In other words, the people in favor of normalcy will "win." It's truly crazy that people are planning on giving up normal socialization for themselves and their children indefinitely. Lack of normal socializing will also cause changes to the brain and remodeling of circuitry...

It’s been almost 3 years. When will people give up masks exactly? Most of the families at our daycare are still masking their 2-4yos even though not required anymore and I truly don’t get what the endgame is. Masks are mostly a joke in that environment anyway but clearly they think the minimal benefit is worth it. For how long though?

Why not ask them? The endgame for them is to probably limit Covid infections in their chidren, but I can't read their minds. That's our reason to mask our school age kids.

DP you know exactly why we don't ask. Because anyone who questions masking, even toddler masking, gets accused of causing mass death/disability (see the first page of this thread). Even our therapist, who indicated privately to me that DD's in-school therapy would be easier without masks (and in fact once they dropped the mask requirement for everyone suddenly we saw a lot of progress) did not want to come out and say that to the teachers. It had been a struggle to get them to even allow the therapist into the school, so it was a very calculated decision.

What this really comes down to is for how long should the general population make sacrifices to prevent death/disability in a small (but definitely significant) percentage of people. And how do we decide which sacrifices are worth it? What I see a lot on these boards is that folks do not think masking (of toddlers or older children and adults) or avoiding indoor activities is a sacrifice at all, and that COVID precautions don't cause any significant harm. Many of us did change our behavior significantly in 2020-2021 because we do recognize that COVID is serious. By the time 2022 rolled around, it became clear that the cost to ourselves and our child was too much. These precautions are fine for short periods of time. When they are in place for years, for many of us the harms build up. Maybe you haven't experienced that in your family and that's great. But we have and the harms are real. It's a risk though, to say this publicly, because those that haven't had the issues we have deny that they even exist and think of us as murderers. No thanks. The risk is not worth the benefit of such a conversation. I will stick to the people in my life who recognize that different people have different priorities and priorities other than COVID are valid.

Of course our kids have experienced Covid related frustrations. It's not fun to be the only kid sitting outside for lunch, or any number of situations that they deal with. And I don't know anyone who would prefer to wear masks if there were zero perceived threat. People approach risk differently. If you child is able to receive maskless therapy right now, that's great and I hope it continues. I don't think forcing toddlers to mask is fair either, despite all the assumptions made about me because I mask. If mandates ever came back, I would support exceptions for small children and certain other children. Just don't judge parents who do mask their toddlers. They aren't your enemy.

We aren't giving up the masks in our house because we have found workarounds. We try to live a full life, but to us, the risk of infection is high to long term quality of life. If that calculus changes, so will our behavior. I certainly hope it does, but for now that's where we are at.

I could not care less if parents at DD's daycare mask their child. It doesn't affect me, so I definitely don't think they are my enemy. The masks rarely cover their nose and often don't cover their mouths either so it's more of a chin strap anyway. Which does make me wonder why they do it. Doesn't mean I need to confront them about it. What could possibly be the benefit of that?

To be fair, you posted asking why they still do it. It sounded to me like it bothered you on some level, but I guess not.

DP- you aren't curious why parents would force their kids to wear something that's so obviously ineffective and interferes with social interactions/communication? Like what is the point? I mean, I don't really care either except that teachers at our daycare felt pressured to mask up again because so many parents continued to send their kids wearing masks half-a$$.

As someone who masks in an area where usually NO ONE else does (military base), I don't think you can blame other parents for teachers who mask. They are adults and if masks are optional, they are making a choice to do it. If I had a younger kid, I would want to protect them from all the circulating viruses, but I don't think cloth masks do enough (it's not nothing, but it's minimal). It would depend on what the kid could manage and was appropriate for them, and I'd probably not be in a group childcare setting right now if I could help it.

We actually have a quite few people masking this week as they are sick of getting sick before the holidays. Seems a sensible reaction to current conditions.

This. I can tell you that most kids (and adults) at our preschool are still wearing masks and the viruses are still going around anyway, including Covid outbreaks. Those we know with vulnerable family members moved to nannyshares or SAH.

YMMV We have a very vulnerable friend and her child goes to school in person. Child and husband got COVID recently and thankfully she didn't get it. Many vulnerable people do take the risk, for a variety of reasons.

FWIW, “school” as in K-12, is a bit easier to navigate than preschool/daycare, for several reasons. The risks can be mitigated a bit more (speaking from personal experience)

Their kid still got COVID though. Since the beginning of the pandemic we've known young kids are less likely to spread COVID than older ones, so I am not sure your risk assessment is correct.

That analysis was proven wrong.

Not really. Young children are still less likely to get COVID and when they do it is more likely to be asymptomatic, which is less likely to spread. Viral shedding increases with age. The problem is when they do get a symptomatic infection, it is more likely to spread within the household because mitigation strategies within a household with an infected child are very difficult. It's easier though if a lower risk parent can care for the child and the higher risk parent can distance from them.