I'm Jewish. Ask me anything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do you say "Jewish" instead of "Jews"?

I feel that calling oneself "Jewish" does not show full commitment to that identity. It's like you are on the fence.

what quote are you referring to? Jewish is an adjective. English grammar has different words for adjectives and nouns.

For example people say - "I am Christian." or "I am Muslim." They do not say I am "Muslimish" or I am "Christianish". So why say I am "Jewish"? Why not just say "I am a Jew" ?

Christian is an adjective. Jew is not. That is simply English grammar. "I am a Jew just sounds a bit different, more formal than saying "I am Jewish". Both are correct usages however, and both are said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I will try to address some of your other questions, but this was your response to whether you felt being chosen. Why do you feel chosen if you don't believe in G_d? "To be honest, I do. I didn't have that clarity growing up when I was in Saturday or Sunday school and in Hebrew school. As I've matured, I view religion a bit differently. I don't walk around entitled."

That quote was not me.

However like many people of all faith traditions, I do sometimes doubt. When I doubt the existence of G-d, I ALSO doubt the chosenness of the Jewish people. I am not sure the PP meant to say he was atheist (quite different from saying one views G-d differently or less clearly than as a child) or that he did not believe in G-d, but absolutely believed in Jewish chosenness. You are conflating people not believing in G-d but still considering themselves Jewish, with people not believing in G-d but still believing in Jewish chosenness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Sure, they may have some other Italian friends and talk about some cultural similarities, but they don't segregate from the rest of the world the way the Jews do.

Despite a history of being confined to ghettos (that is where the word comes from BTW) most Jews, certainly most secular Jews, live pretty integrated lives.

To add to the point, we are in the final process of preparing for DD's Bat Mitzvah. Here is a breakdown of the guests:

Total: About half Jew, half Non-Jew

Family: 80% Jewish (the rest are family by marriage)
Friends: 27% jewish....

So the people I chose to spend time with are almost 3/4th not jewish (and is actually higher...jewish friends were more likely to say yes)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I will try to address some of your other questions, but this was your response to whether you felt being chosen. Why do you feel chosen if you don't believe in G_d? "To be honest, I do. I didn't have that clarity growing up when I was in Saturday or Sunday school and in Hebrew school. As I've matured, I view religion a bit differently. I don't walk around entitled."

That quote was not me.

However like many people of all faith traditions, I do sometimes doubt. When I doubt the existence of G-d, I ALSO doubt the chosenness of the Jewish people. I am not sure the PP meant to say he was atheist (quite different from saying one views G-d differently or less clearly than as a child) or that he did not believe in G-d, but absolutely believed in Jewish chosenness. You are conflating people not believing in G-d but still considering themselves Jewish, with people not believing in G-d but still believing in Jewish chosenness.

Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do you say "Jewish" instead of "Jews"?

I feel that calling oneself "Jewish" does not show full commitment to that identity. It's like you are on the fence.

what quote are you referring to? Jewish is an adjective. English grammar has different words for adjectives and nouns.

For example people say - "I am Christian." or "I am Muslim." They do not say I am "Muslimish" or I am "Christianish". So why say I am "Jewish"? Why not just say "I am a Jew" ?

Christian is an adjective. Jew is not. That is simply English grammar. "I am a Jew just sounds a bit different, more formal than saying "I am Jewish". Both are correct usages however, and both are said.

Yep, basic grammar is why people say "I am Jewish."

Saying "I am Jewish" is equivalent to saying "I am Christian" or "I am Muslim."

Saying "I am a Jew" is equivalent to saying "I am a Christian" or "I am a Muslim."

The difference is that the terms "Christian" and "Muslim" are both adjectives and nouns, but "Jew" is a noun and "Jewish" is an adjective.

FWIW, the noun for the religion itself is a distinct word for all three religions: Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

Between 50-60% of jews in the world do not believe in god, and I'm guessing the percentage is actually much higher. I think jews should have the same rights as any other citizen in the US, but I don't believe I have to approve of their exclusive behavior just because they make similar meals every once in awhile and have similar wedding celebrations. These do not seem like important enough activities to support entire countries being exclusive or even certain neighborhood community groups. I don't understand why we should have school days off for their religious holidays if they don't believe in god. I also think it is right to be offended when for example jewish children and their parents only invite jews to parties year after year using the excuse that the parents got to know their best friends at jewish preschool first and therefore have no room for anyone else. The OP said that jews aren't exclusive and are very integrated in society, but there are several posts that point out how jewish families work hard to segregate themselves from non-jews.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

Between 50-60% of jews in the world do not believe in god, and I'm guessing the percentage is actually much higher. I think jews should have the same rights as any other citizen in the US, but I don't believe I have to approve of their exclusive behavior just because they make similar meals every once in awhile and have similar wedding celebrations. These do not seem like important enough activities to support entire countries being exclusive or even certain neighborhood community groups. I don't understand why we should have school days off for their religious holidays if they don't believe in god. I also think it is right to be offended when for example jewish children and their parents only invite jews to parties year after year using the excuse that the parents got to know their best friends at jewish preschool first and therefore have no room for anyone else. The OP said that jews aren't exclusive and are very integrated in society, but there are several posts that point out how jewish families work hard to segregate themselves from non-jews.

I should not respond, because I have already reported this post as offensive (I believe it is anti-Semitic)....but I will.

First of all, I am allowed to have exclusive behavior in my personal life. I can decide who my friends are and are not. Just like my Morman neighbors, I pray with like minded people. It is not a secret society: Shul is open to all. The JCC has jewish and non jewish members, just like the YMCA.

As for school days off, it largely depends on where you live. In Fairfax, my kids miss school....in Montgomery County, where about 15 % of the teachers are jewish, it would be a logistical problem to get that many subs, so they close schools. Why not have school on Christmas then? It is similar.

My family -- immediate and extended -- are part of the greater society. My sister won the democratic party nomination for Congress in her state a few years ago.

Half of the people invited to my DD's Bat Mitzvah are not jewish....excluding family, only about 25% invited are jewish. I think you will find, if you take off your anti-Semitic glasses, that most people that are jewish mostly socialize with non-jews.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

Between 50-60% of jews in the world do not believe in god, and I'm guessing the percentage is actually much higher. I think jews should have the same rights as any other citizen in the US, but I don't believe I have to approve of their exclusive behavior just because they make similar meals every once in awhile and have similar wedding celebrations. These do not seem like important enough activities to support entire countries being exclusive or even certain neighborhood community groups. I don't understand why we should have school days off for their religious holidays if they don't believe in god. I also think it is right to be offended when for example jewish children and their parents only invite jews to parties year after year using the excuse that the parents got to know their best friends at jewish preschool first and therefore have no room for anyone else. The OP said that jews aren't exclusive and are very integrated in society, but there are several posts that point out how jewish families work hard to segregate themselves from non-jews.

I should not respond, because I have already reported this post as offensive (I believe it is anti-Semitic)....but I will.

First of all, I am allowed to have exclusive behavior in my personal life. I can decide who my friends are and are not. Just like my Morman neighbors, I pray with like minded people. It is not a secret society: Shul is open to all. The JCC has jewish and non jewish members, just like the YMCA.

As for school days off, it largely depends on where you live. In Fairfax, my kids miss school....in Montgomery County, where about 15 % of the teachers are jewish, it would be a logistical problem to get that many subs, so they close schools. Why not have school on Christmas then? It is similar.

My family -- immediate and extended -- are part of the greater society. My sister won the democratic party nomination for Congress in her state a few years ago.

Half of the people invited to my DD's Bat Mitzvah are not jewish....excluding family, only about 25% invited are jewish. I think you will find, if you take off your anti-Semitic glasses, that most people that are jewish mostly socialize with non-jews.

This is an AMA discussion. If you need to call someone out as offensive, then you are insecure. You can be exclusive in behavior as you mentioned, but then you should expect people who are excluded to not accept you as being an open inclusive person. You aren't exclusive person if you have many non-jewish friends and since you live in VA you really can't easily be anyway with a low jewish population, but there are jews in NY, NJ, and in MD who surround themselves with other jews to the exclusion of everyone else without adhering to any of the 600 plus jewish rules intentionally. There are entire jewish neighborhoods full of atheist jews. I grew up in one and definitely felt left out to the point where our family stopped doing anything with most of these families and there were at least 20 of these families just in my grade. Of course I did have some great jewish friends, but I haven't forgotten that the other 90%of the jewish families were exclusive and I see the same thing happening still in MD. The JCC is up front that they're an exclusive organization and their programs do include religious activities. They also welcome non-jews into their facility for just about all of their activities. A kid's birthday party from a public school where only the jewish kids are invited or a PTA group where only the jewish moms can participate on the committee is being unreasonably exclusive in semi-public settings. Instead of being upfront and saying that they really only want to associate with jews, these people hide behind other excuses as to why non-jews aren't invited. They can do what they want till they are made to be more inclusive, but they are still being exclusive for what I see as no strong tie to warrant the exclusion. I still haven't been told why these types of atheist jews need to live a life so exclusive of other people whether in the US or Israel where they only ever socialize with jews outside of business. What do they have in common with each other that non-jews don't have? We're all people. PP, maybe you're not the right person to answer this since you don't lead this type of life searching out other non-practicing jews as friends to the exclusion of others. OP is probably the better person to answer this since she doesn't believe in god but still thinks she's "chosen".

[Anonymous]

You clearly have problems with jewish people. You call us insular, but when my family arrived here, we were only allowed to live is specific neighborhoods -- jews were not allowed in many places in the 50's and 60's....and there are still exclusive clubs that do not allow jews. The communities that allowed jews became predominately jewish (if there was a significant jewish population in the region).

I have lived in places that were majority jewish; and I have lived in towns where I was the only jewish person. Hell, in 1975, at the age of 11, we had a cross burnt in our yard. I was not invited to anything there.

There are predominantly jewish clubs: Woodmont Country Club is an example. But, it was founded because non of the other clubs around would allow jews. Get you facts straight!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You clearly have problems with jewish people. You call us insular, but when my family arrived here, we were only allowed to live is specific neighborhoods -- jews were not allowed in many places in the 50's and 60's....and there are still exclusive clubs that do not allow jews. The communities that allowed jews became predominately jewish (if there was a significant jewish population in the region).

I have lived in places that were majority jewish; and I have lived in towns where I was the only jewish person. Hell, in 1975, at the age of 11, we had a cross burnt in our yard. I was not invited to anything there.

There are predominantly jewish clubs: Woodmont Country Club is an example. But, it was founded because non of the other clubs around would allow jews. Get you facts straight!

Jews certainly weren't the only minority excluded in the US by far. Get your facts straight. Not sure the background of the MD jewish area, but I think they just had more democrats than in VA and were not part of the confederacy, therefore more jews moved there than to VA. I haven't heard of any neighborhood that built up because of some exclusive behavior by non-jews. You could be right, but at this time more jews move to MD because there are more jews there. Nonetheless, jews aren't excluded now from any non-religious establishment and many have been living in the US for decades, so why do some still behave as if they can only associate with other jews on a personal level? From wikepedia "Oftentimes children will attend Hebrew School with the sole purpose of learning how to read Hebrew for their Bar/Bat Mitzvah. In these cases, the students will mostly learn the Hebrew words that are in the Torah portion they will be reciting." These are the types of families I grew up around and their exclusive behavior was pervasive in every activity. You still haven't answered the question of why these families feel the need to associate solely with other jews? What is the huge cultural connection that draws them together? Many of these children couldn't even tell me basic information about jewish history, language, ceremonies, etc. They just acted like they belonged to some exclusive country club.

[Anonymous]

I have respect for people of a different culture who may be excluding me because they are doing something that involves their culture only and I especially appreciate them if they involve me in their culture by at least explaining it and possibly even inviting me to participate. What I don't appreciate is someone telling me I can't be part of their group because I'm not part of their culture and then going on for years on end only talking about non-Jewish things like American music or something that doesn't require any exclusivity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

Between 50-60% of jews in the world do not believe in god, and I'm guessing the percentage is actually much higher. I think jews should have the same rights as any other citizen in the US, but I don't believe I have to approve of their exclusive behavior just because they make similar meals every once in awhile and have similar wedding celebrations. These do not seem like important enough activities to support entire countries being exclusive or even certain neighborhood community groups. I don't understand why we should have school days off for their religious holidays if they don't believe in god. I also think it is right to be offended when for example jewish children and their parents only invite jews to parties year after year using the excuse that the parents got to know their best friends at jewish preschool first and therefore have no room for anyone else. The OP said that jews aren't exclusive and are very integrated in society, but there are several posts that point out how jewish families work hard to segregate themselves from non-jews.

I'm not sure where you got the 50-660% number. I would like to point out that Christians are very exclusionary of Jews. It's happened to me my entire life. I was excluded by Christians and, especially, Catholics from many, many things growing up and even now. So... it seems that other religions are also into exclusivity. Sorry but you can't pin this only on Jews. From the tone of your post, it sounds like you don't like Jews and are jealous of them. Jews are very integrated into society. There are some very observant Jews who choose to live in their own communities and exclude less observant Jews as well as non-Jews. I would call these Jews equal opportunity exclusionists!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Are you saying someone else is appearing as you on this thread? It's pretty clear that the quote was meaning to be you. My main question is whether jewish people can still consider themselves chosen and not believe in god. Many come across to me as if they do believe their chosen even when they don't believe in god, but it's helpful to know a jew like yourself does not believe this.

I am not the OP. I felt there were things here that called for a response even if OP was not around or did not know the answer. I also do not accept that any one Jew will speak for all the Jews.

I believe that there is a contradiction in saying Jews are "chosen" if there is no G-d. What does that mean? Who can do the choosing? OTOH I cannot control the logic other people use.

There are certainly secular Jews who are proud of their heritage. But that is not chosenness.

You also should note that a few Jews observe Jewish traditions, even though they do not believe in G-d. That may also be confusing you.

If you are really interested (and not just trolling) you should read a book on the subject (( am sure we can all suggest a few) rather than try to get all your info from a message board.

Between 50-60% of jews in the world do not believe in god, and I'm guessing the percentage is actually much higher. I think jews should have the same rights as any other citizen in the US, but I don't believe I have to approve of their exclusive behavior just because they make similar meals every once in awhile and have similar wedding celebrations. These do not seem like important enough activities to support entire countries being exclusive or even certain neighborhood community groups. I don't understand why we should have school days off for their religious holidays if they don't believe in god. I also think it is right to be offended when for example jewish children and their parents only invite jews to parties year after year using the excuse that the parents got to know their best friends at jewish preschool first and therefore have no room for anyone else. The OP said that jews aren't exclusive and are very integrated in society, but there are several posts that point out how jewish families work hard to segregate themselves from non-jews.

I'm not sure where you got the 50-660% number. I would like to point out that Christians are very exclusionary of Jews. It's happened to me my entire life. I was excluded by Christians and, especially, Catholics from many, many things growing up and even now. So... it seems that other religions are also into exclusivity. Sorry but you can't pin this only on Jews. From the tone of your post, it sounds like you don't like Jews and are jealous of them. Jews are very integrated into society. There are some very observant Jews who choose to live in their own communities and exclude less observant Jews as well as non-Jews. I would call these Jews equal opportunity exclusionists!

The 50-60% number was on a number of internet sites. After hitting at least four of them, I decided it was probably a reasonable number and knowing that many people aren't ready to give up their faith entirely, I'd guess the number is higher. How were you excluded your entire life? In what specific ways? Where did you live? Were you a minority? It makes a difference if you were a minority or a majority. Growing up the area I grew up in was 50/50 jewish/christian with few other cultures. The christians were very private with their religious and cultural life and the jewish families were very in your face about their culture even though they would all say they didn't even believe in god. People who are the minority will always feel excluded in some ways, but not always because someone is being exclusive outright. I'm not offended by this type of exclusivity. I'm offended by the outright exclusion of others. I guess I am jealous that I can't talk about my own religion so openly in the US without being called names, but other than that I'm not jealous at all and really think it's a good thing that part of my life is private. I'm more sorry for people who feel the need to live so exclusionary. And after all this back and forth, you still haven't given me any reason to have respect for their exclusivity.

[Anonymous]

20:25 again. I also feel awkward whenever I'm in a group that feels the need to pray or talk about christianity in public with others who don't believe their views or religion. I guess the experience growing up at least made me realize how awkward people feel when they can't possibly fit in. At least the people I meet who do this stuff though tend to actually practice their religion so I have some understanding for their behavior. As for Christmas, I think most practicing Christians wish most of the Christmas activities would go away. It's truly just a secular holiday in the US.