What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

It has to be heat stroke. I bet both adults started getting woozy at the same time--altered mental status, confusion and eventual loss of consciousness. This can happen very quickly. He sat down and she sat down and/or tumbled from a standing position. They were probably disoriented enough to not even think of using the phone. If you're drifting out of consciousness you're not going to be able to put two and two together to make a call. The baby either died at the same time or within a few hours. The dog probably laid down with them and eventually died of lack of lack of water/heat stroke as well. If this happened to me, my dog would never "go for help". He would hang out next to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It has to be heat stroke. I bet both adults started getting woozy at the same time--altered mental status, confusion and eventual loss of consciousness. This can happen very quickly. He sat down and she sat down and/or tumbled from a standing position. They were probably disoriented enough to not even think of using the phone. If you're drifting out of consciousness you're not going to be able to put two and two together to make a call. The baby either died at the same time or within a few hours. The dog probably laid down with them and eventually died of lack of lack of water/heat stroke as well. If this happened to me, my dog would never "go for help". He would hang out next to me.

Dogs have natural instincts and this one is experienced in wilderness. If it wasn't harnessed it would have followed the sounds of the river nearby to get some water and then come back to its family to protect them overnight.

Or maybe it stayed to protect the baby who was crying even if the parents were unconscious. Otherwise I can't see a dog that can hear running water staying there to die of heat exhaustion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It has to be heat stroke. I bet both adults started getting woozy at the same time--altered mental status, confusion and eventual loss of consciousness. This can happen very quickly. He sat down and she sat down and/or tumbled from a standing position. They were probably disoriented enough to not even think of using the phone. If you're drifting out of consciousness you're not going to be able to put two and two together to make a call. The baby either died at the same time or within a few hours. The dog probably laid down with them and eventually died of lack of lack of water/heat stroke as well. If this happened to me, my dog would never "go for help". He would hang out next to me.

Just a note, there was no cell service, so calling for help wasn't on the table.

And honestly, if suffering severe heat stroke, I wonder what the best decision would have been. Shade, water, and if they ran out of water, submerge in the toxic algae pond? Wait to hike out until nightfall?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It has to be heat stroke. I bet both adults started getting woozy at the same time--altered mental status, confusion and eventual loss of consciousness. This can happen very quickly. He sat down and she sat down and/or tumbled from a standing position. They were probably disoriented enough to not even think of using the phone. If you're drifting out of consciousness you're not going to be able to put two and two together to make a call. The baby either died at the same time or within a few hours. The dog probably laid down with them and eventually died of lack of lack of water/heat stroke as well. If this happened to me, my dog would never "go for help". He would hang out next to me.

Dogs have natural instincts and this one is experienced in wilderness. If it wasn't harnessed it would have followed the sounds of the river nearby to get some water and then come back to its family to protect them overnight.

Or maybe it stayed to protect the baby who was crying even if the parents were unconscious. Otherwise I can't see a dog that can hear running water staying there to die of heat exhaustion.

+1. Dog and human physiology and instincts are much more divergent than most people think, even dog owners. Their bodies just work very differently. And even you PP, with your shi shi dog, your dog would not lie down and die next to you. It is not in their nature. And there would be physical evidence of heat stroke in a dog like red gums and probably vomit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dog is a chow chow mix per instagram. A chow could have more trouble in the heat, although I still don't buy it would be simultaneously like that

Ok here is the dog in motion, while in the care of a dog sitter, maybe a chow but definitely not full chow. The dog was 7.5 and looks to have lived an incredibly active and outdoors focused life. I do not buy that that dog died of heatstroke at the same time as its people.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B07zFfAn2gs/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Dogs with heavy fur like that don't do well in the heat. Do you know how many dogs die running with their owners on hot days? I hope a vet pops in on this conversation. I went to a dog show in the summer in Virgnia several years ago and the number of dogs requiring medical intervention from heat stroke was astounding.

Dogs without continuous exercise don't do well. There are plenty of footage of it in high-heat environments of the past 5+ years. Also that dog's fur isn't particularly heavy. It doesn't have a double-coat of insulation like a Alaskan Malamute or a Siberian Husky.

Actually, PP is correct. Humans are one of the very few animals that sweat, and therefore can travel quickly and for long distances in high heat. That’s how we hunted before tools, we would chase other animals until they collapsed from heatstroke. Dogs have a much lower heat tolerance than us.

I live in the desert and they will issue citations to people who have dogs outside when it gets into the triple digits, it’s that dangerous for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dog is a chow chow mix per instagram. A chow could have more trouble in the heat, although I still don't buy it would be simultaneously like that

Ok here is the dog in motion, while in the care of a dog sitter, maybe a chow but definitely not full chow. The dog was 7.5 and looks to have lived an incredibly active and outdoors focused life. I do not buy that that dog died of heatstroke at the same time as its people.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B07zFfAn2gs/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Dogs with heavy fur like that don't do well in the heat. Do you know how many dogs die running with their owners on hot days? I hope a vet pops in on this conversation. I went to a dog show in the summer in Virgnia several years ago and the number of dogs requiring medical intervention from heat stroke was astounding.

Dogs without continuous exercise don't do well. There are plenty of footage of it in high-heat environments of the past 5+ years. Also that dog's fur isn't particularly heavy. It doesn't have a double-coat of insulation like a Alaskan Malamute or a Siberian Husky.

Actually, PP is correct. Humans are one of the very few animals that sweat, and therefore can travel quickly and for long distances in high heat. That’s how we hunted before tools, we would chase other animals until they collapsed from heatstroke. Dogs have a much lower heat tolerance than us.

I live in the desert and they will issue citations to people who have dogs outside when it gets into the triple digits, it’s that dangerous for them.

I'm the pp and I'm just stunned people around this area aren't aware of this. They think running with their dogs is a great thing but they will die of heatstroke just running around here on a hot day.

[Anonymous]

The heat stroke pov makes me wonder if they were out of water so drank from the river in desperation, knowing the risk but not having any other options. This would point to tixic algae death. I really don’t think all four of them died from heat stroke.

What was the temperature anyway? I didn’t see that info.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The heat stroke pov makes me wonder if they were out of water so drank from the river in desperation, knowing the risk but not having any other options. This would point to tixic algae death. I really don’t think all four of them died from heat stroke.

What was the temperature anyway? I didn’t see that info.

Go back one page.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The heat stroke pov makes me wonder if they were out of water so drank from the river in desperation, knowing the risk but not having any other options. This would point to tixic algae death. I really don’t think all four of them died from heat stroke.

What was the temperature anyway? I didn’t see that info.

Go back one page.

Sorry .. 2 pages.

[Anonymous]

How do we know it was a full day hike that they had planned? I must have missed that. And how do you know there was no shade at all?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dog jumped into toxic water snd they all died trying to dry him off. People catch rabies because they think their dog is choking and get saliva on themselves. And get rabies.

I don't think you understand rabies.

Since I am a vet yes I understand rabies. The virus makes it through small abrasions on the hands. But thanks for your input.

Okay sure. Rabies equals instant death. Gotcha

Algae PLUS rabies is instant death. Science!

Now we are combining two unlikely scenarios into one.

If that's the case, I'm going with boulder plus Africanized bees.

You know, I agree. I don't think they've given the proper amount of thought to the fact that it might be Africanized bees.

[Anonymous]

Doesn’t 911 actually work even in areas of no service? I guess I’m naive but I thought that 911 would often work in places where you can’t get “normal” service. You can also text 911….even if there isn’t service, isn’t there a chance the text would go through?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do we know it was a full day hike that they had planned? I must have missed that. And how do you know there was no shade at all?

I don't think anyone knows it was a full day hike. It was quoted in one of the original articles that there was very little shade and the temps had reached 109.

[Anonymous]

Murder suicide. Dad killed mom first (why she was found separately) then everyone else together.

[Anonymous]

I’m fat and out of shape and I live in southern arizona.

I don’t think it was heat stroke. For those of us that live in these climates, we know how to deal with the heat. I’ve gone hiking, in the morning, in the summer. I’ve never been close to heat stroke, and I’m a person who barely sweats. Also, 109 in 20% humidity for a person who is in good shape and has water is unlikely to be suddenly hit with heat stroke. It would take more time to cumulatively build up.

You’d be surprised how much the temp swings throughout the day and how much the lack of humidity helps. For example, my kids play outside when it’s in the low 100s here and we are all fat, fair skinned Scandinavians. Nobody has ever gotten heat exhaustion, let alone heat stroke.