ludlow-taylor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just b/c pullout groups are popular w/parents doesn't mean they're the best teaching practice. I'd prefer a principal rely on his/her own expertise versus do whatever keeps the squeaky wheels happy.

IME, I've seen ability grouping work with math (not saying it's necessary, but I'm open to it), but I don't know that it makes much sense with reading. As 7:05 mentioned, it's not too difficult to have kids reading at different levels, assigned different spelling lists, etc. within the same classroom. For that matter, there's nothing stopping advanced readers from tackling more challenging reading at home outside school hours!

ITA it seems that dcum prefers pullouts as a source of pride vs what is actually best practices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Awesome pullout groups at Watkins this year. Both reading and math are being done by ability grouping. Very popular with parents.

Too bad this started this year -- we couldn't waste another year waiting for improvement/more challenging work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just b/c pullout groups are popular w/parents doesn't mean they're the best teaching practice. I'd prefer a principal rely on his/her own expertise versus do whatever keeps the squeaky wheels happy.

IME, I've seen ability grouping work with math (not saying it's necessary, but I'm open to it), but I don't know that it makes much sense with reading. As 7:05 mentioned, it's not too difficult to have kids reading at different levels, assigned different spelling lists, etc. within the same classroom. For that matter, there's nothing stopping advanced readers from tackling more challenging reading at home outside school hours!

ITA it seems that dcum prefers pullouts as a source of pride vs what is actually best practices.

I'd personally prefer the best practice of a true gifted and talented program in DCPS. Since that is NEVER going to happen while my children are still in elementary school, I'll settle for the pull out.

I've seen teachers try to address second grade students reading on a 6th grade level in the same classroom as children who cannot read at all. Invariably, time is spent on the children who are below level. The advanced kids get to sit and read. That's not education, that's just passing the time in a chaotic building that is falling apart.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just b/c pullout groups are popular w/parents doesn't mean they're the best teaching practice. I'd prefer a principal rely on his/her own expertise versus do whatever keeps the squeaky wheels happy.

IME, I've seen ability grouping work with math (not saying it's necessary, but I'm open to it), but I don't know that it makes much sense with reading. As 7:05 mentioned, it's not too difficult to have kids reading at different levels, assigned different spelling lists, etc. within the same classroom. For that matter, there's nothing stopping advanced readers from tackling more challenging reading at home outside school hours!

Advanced readers should not have to get accelerated education only at home. They deserve an appropriate education as well. I am totally in favor of ability grouping in separate classrooms with frequent re-assessments. If students are multiple grade levels apart in ability in the same classroom, it also probably means they years apart in their content knowledge. I think it is best to meet their needs in separate classroom with the caveat that kids are moved up or down when ready or needed so that their needs can be met. Until schools get this, parents will continue to flee them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
ITA it seems that dcum prefers pullouts as a source of pride vs what is actually best practices.

I'd personally prefer the best practice of a true gifted and talented program in DCPS. Since that is NEVER going to happen while my children are still in elementary school, I'll settle for the pull out.

I've seen teachers try to address second grade students reading on a 6th grade level in the same classroom as children who cannot read at all. Invariably, time is spent on the children who are below level. The advanced kids get to sit and read. That's not education, that's just passing the time in a chaotic building that is falling apart.



Yes pul outs are inadequate IMO. The state where I cam from only offered pull outs and it was a joke. Advanced learners truly need to be in separate classes in order to meet their needs. Differentiation is a joke.

[Anonymous]

Sorry for the typos.

[Anonymous]

We left Watkins for Brent specifically because Brent offered some semblance of a program to challenge accelerated learners.

[Anonymous]

At Watkins they reshuffle the kids after each PIA. Haven't heard anything but parent support for this, whether coming from the most advanced or most remedial group. Every kid's getting challenged, moved forward. Of course, Watkins' size makes this easier to facilitate with 5 or 6 sections of each grade. Each teacher takes 1/5 or 1/6 of the grade for the math & reading blocks and can really focus in on that group's needs.

[Anonymous]

Can you move this conversation to the G/T thread just started, or begin another? I'm sure some Ludlow Taylor followers would appreciate it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can you move this conversation to the G/T thread just started, or begin another? I'm sure some Ludlow Taylor followers would appreciate it

This LT follower thinks this is just the conversation we should be having.

The neighborhood community is loaded with braniac parents of tiny tots who plan to shut Ludlow mainly because they have no reason to believe that their children will be challenged academically there, or fit in socially, after prek 4.

What other conversation should we be having? The one about renovating the building, or getting Cobbs canned, or grim PTA politics? All old hat. At least a conversation about stepping up challenge for advanced learners/gifted kids is a new spin on the inappropriateness of LT's school culture for the gentrifiers (read the majority of in-boundary parents).

Oh, I forgot, we should just shut up and pay hefty property taxes to support a school for which mediocrity would be a lofty goal, without being able to send our children there with enthusiasm past age 5.

[Anonymous]

not shut, shun

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can you move this conversation to the G/T thread just started, or begin another? I'm sure some Ludlow Taylor followers would appreciate it

This LT follower thinks this is just the conversation we should be having.

The neighborhood community is loaded with braniac parents of tiny tots who plan to shut Ludlow mainly because they have no reason to believe that their children will be challenged academically there, or fit in socially, after prek 4.

What other conversation should we be having? The one about renovating the building, or getting Cobbs canned, or grim PTA politics? All old hat. At least a conversation about stepping up challenge for advanced learners/gifted kids is a new spin on the inappropriateness of LT's school culture for the gentrifiers (read the majority of in-boundary parents).

Oh, I forgot, we should just shut up and pay hefty property taxes to support a school for which mediocrity would be a lofty goal, without being able to send our children there with enthusiasm past age 5.

Sorry, didn't mean to imply that you should shut up, I just thought it was counterproductive to have two parallel discussions about advanced learners going on at the same time.

[Anonymous]

Pull outs for advanced students in elementary school are mainly to keep the wolves at bay. A good teacher meets each student at their level for any subject. The teachers at Ludlow Taylor are HIGHLY QUALIFIED and do just that. DCPS uses Impact to evaluate their teachers. If they are no good they leave. Teachers and paraprofessionals at LT stay. In the words of Principal Cobbs herself she "hires great teachers." Maybe try asking to observe a class. Actually watch a fourth grade math lesson. It is better to see something and observe someone's practice first hand before making a judgment. Unfortunately these judgements result in many families deciding not to attend Ludlow and then joining in on the bad mouthing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pull outs for advanced students in elementary school are mainly to keep the wolves at bay. A good teacher meets each student at their level for any subject. The teachers at Ludlow Taylor are HIGHLY QUALIFIED and do just that. DCPS uses Impact to evaluate their teachers. If they are no good they leave. Teachers and paraprofessionals at LT stay. In the words of Principal Cobbs herself she "hires great teachers." Maybe try asking to observe a class. Actually watch a fourth grade math lesson. It is better to see something and observe someone's practice first hand before making a judgment. Unfortunately these judgements result in many families deciding not to attend Ludlow and then joining in on the bad mouthing.

Disagree, strongly. In an urban setting, where many low-SES kids lack basic skills in the upper elementary grades because poverty and chaotic home lives have been holding them back since birth (or rather conception), pull outs for advanced students, and/or looping up to higher grade reading and math classes, are not just window dressing, but essential instructional tools. When most of the high-SES kids scored advanced on the DC-CAS while most of the low-SES kids can't score proficient (yes, at LT), you need the pull outs.

LT has a ghetto feel that only a few arch liberals in the neighborhood embrace for the elementary grades. Mainstream upper-middle-class parents won't stay after K. Droves of IB parents pay hefty property tax to support the school without feeling comfortable using it. The arrangement is seriously unfair and bad for the Stanton Park neighborhood. If you want a neighbhorhood school in a neighborhood that's mostly high-SES, you need a school that's mostly high-SES. Bad mouthing isn't the issue.

[Anonymous]

I agree it's bad for the neighborhood to have a school that's not used by neighborhood kids and is constantly defamed on DCUM. But it seems to me that the solution is for all the neighborhood kids who are there in pre-K to just stay for K and beyond. There are definitely enough kids in the neighborhood to fill the school. That's the simplest way for LT to become a neighborhood school.