"Not a Meritocracy"

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

How do you know this?

Average SAT for education majors in the 900s.

cite source, please and thanks.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2017/05/11/education-programs-and-unselective-colleges/amp/

Barely a 50 point diff.

1060 vs 1116

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:"Np. You paid $50k a year to get your kid into a good college. Indeed you are outraged that you are not getting this expected outcome. But classmate larlo’s parents paid an extra $50million to some T20 get their kid into a super great college. And you somehow think that is unfair? You have no moral ground to stand on. You are a hypocrite. You tried to buy your kid a leg up on the public school kids and you lost. You think public school kid parents should similarly resent you for buying your kids way into a better school? I’m sure in that case your argument would be ‘well we all want to give our kids the best opportunities."

OP is worried about her child getting into college. Are parents of private school kids not allowed to say that their child has worked hard, Did she say that kids at public schools don't work hard? [b]No she did not. Does slamming her make you feel better? Sad.[/b]

OP isn’t worried about her child getting into *a* college. There are thousands of colleges.

And yes, she did say public school kids do “minimal work.”

OP here. I most definitely did not say that.

Here’s the quote but I don’t know who wrote it:

“ But is it hard to see your kid work herself to the bone for four years and get deferred from Wisconsin when her neighbor down the street -- an equally smart, engaging and accomplished kid -- who did minimal work at Wilson gets in.”

Plus Wisconsin is extremely competitive. What's wrong with IU or Michigan State? Many state flagships are no longer safeties for anyone.

Private school parents did not pay beaucoup bucks just so that their larlo ends up at IU or Michigan State.

Specifically, what is wrong with IU or Michigan State?

nothing for the mere mortals, but it's not good enough after spending $50K year for several years in K-12.

"not good enough" is not specific

IU and Mich State are not "good enough".

I think the point is they are fine institutions, but not really special from the standpoint of someone with a lot of ambition and wants to have a strong brand name associated with themselves. Historically, and perhaps currently, many people of moderate intellect would attend these schools.

Jesus. I went to one of the Ivies you’d like to send your kid to. Plenty of people of “moderate intellect” there. Especially the athletes.

So did I. And I agree. But also many brilliant people. More moderate and less brilliant at IU and MSU, I would assume

Is there evidence to back up this claim beyond optional test scores?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school, especially one built on a set of values, like a Friends school, is just a completely different environment than a STEM and score obsessed public magnet. Believe it or not, many people do not just send their kids to these schools for a "competitive edge."

Unfortunately, if the only world you know is the TJ-type one, you just are living in a different reality. I went from SFS to UVa and was shocked by all of the NoVa kids who seemed caught up in scores and rankings. My high school experience was really different and much more values based. We didn't have class rank or anything like that. If you can't accept that and think every parent (and student) is just focused on "winning," you definitely belong at the public magnet.

Then don't complain when your kid doesn't get into a top college, which is what this thread is about. Oh I know.. you didn't send them to private school just for top college as the end goal. You would be perfectly happy with your kid going to mediocre private college.

Oh, I definitely won't be complaining. Unlike many of the parents on here, my hope for my kids is not that they go to the highest ranked school possible majoring in CS. I have moved away from DC and they go to private schools where I think they will get the benefit of a supportive, fulfilling high school experience followed by a great college experience. My goal in life is not for them to be miserable robots. I went on a tour of a private school that felt like a magnet public a couple of years ago and could not get out of there fast enough. All they talked about was how many college classes you could take and that once you finished everything they offered, you could get online and take more. I wondered if the kids all had online PhDs at 18. The whole thing was such a sad view into how so many parents think and what schools think these people want to hear. My kids will not be experiencing that view of education. That's why they don't go to the public magnets where we live, which also send a ton of kids to top colleges. Not interested.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lots of insecurity from public school parents here.
1) You'll find super smart kids at both public and private. I don't see any private school parents denying that fact.
2a) Private school is simply expensive and out of reach for many families. This in itself raises the hackles of public school parents who see this as fundamentally unfair and elitist. I don't think any private school parent would disagree. It's something that many private school parents acknowledge, and feel uncomfortable about, but in the end choose private because they can.
2b) Families who live in $1.5M homes in Ward 3 are also highly privileged, in the grand scheme of things. So, it's a bit disingenuous to criticize private school parents when you yourself likely have a HHI well, well above the city median.
3) As a private school parent, I like the fact that my kids are in a safe, small environment where teachers, administrators, and staff know my kids personally. I like that the teachers respond to my emails. I like that they don't have to walk through metal detectors. I like that kids aren't getting arrested at my kids school. I like that there aren't physical fights daily. I like that the there isn't a "Yale-or-Jail" mentality to the kids, which, frankly is the case at Jackson-Reed; and to make it worse, most of the "Yale" kids are White, and most of the "Jail" kids are Black. White JR parents like to tout the diversity of the school, but their kids' friends are almost all White. There is a lot of segregation within the school. While our kids' private school isn't perfect, there are lot more multi-ethnic/racial friendships than what I observe at JR. My sample size is admittedly small, but I don't see the Yale-Jail divide at top private schools they way I see it at JR.

And yes, for sure, the top JR kids are getting into top colleges, but that's not the main reason we are sending our kids to private. I know my kid will get into college, probably a pretty good one, even with the grade deflation.

This alleged mentality is cited only by people like you, who don’t have kids at JR. It is absolutely not the way kids at JR think about the school or their peers. Stop projecting your class- and race-based assumptions on to other people’s children.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

How do you know this?

Average SAT for education majors in the 900s.

cite source, please and thanks.

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2017/05/11/education-programs-and-unselective-colleges/amp/

Barely a 50 point diff.

1060 vs 1116

+1 And test scores are now optional so this study really does not carry much weight in the modern landscape.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school, especially one built on a set of values, like a Friends school, is just a completely different environment than a STEM and score obsessed public magnet. Believe it or not, many people do not just send their kids to these schools for a "competitive edge."

Unfortunately, if the only world you know is the TJ-type one, you just are living in a different reality. I went from SFS to UVa and was shocked by all of the NoVa kids who seemed caught up in scores and rankings. My high school experience was really different and much more values based. We didn't have class rank or anything like that. If you can't accept that and think every parent (and student) is just focused on "winning," you definitely belong at the public magnet.

Then don't complain when your kid doesn't get into a top college, which is what this thread is about. Oh I know.. you didn't send them to private school just for top college as the end goal. You would be perfectly happy with your kid going to mediocre private college.

Oh, I definitely won't be complaining. Unlike many of the parents on here, my hope for my kids is not that they go to the highest ranked school possible majoring in CS. I have moved away from DC and they go to private schools where I think they will get the benefit of a supportive, fulfilling high school experience followed by a great college experience. My goal in life is not for them to be miserable robots. I went on a tour of a private school that felt like a magnet public a couple of years ago and could not get out of there fast enough. All they talked about was how many college classes you could take and that once you finished everything they offered, you could get online and take more. I wondered if the kids all had online PhDs at 18. The whole thing was such a sad view into how so many parents think and what schools think these people want to hear. My kids will not be experiencing that view of education. That's why they don't go to the public magnets where we live, which also send a ton of kids to top colleges. Not interested.

That's great for you and your kid. But, DC area parents do care about where their kids go to college. And I bet you don't think rich private school kids who major in CS are "miserable robots".

Also, the social media app you and your kids are using were probably "miserable robots" who took a lot of STEM courses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school, especially one built on a set of values, like a Friends school, is just a completely different environment than a STEM and score obsessed public magnet. Believe it or not, many people do not just send their kids to these schools for a "competitive edge."

Unfortunately, if the only world you know is the TJ-type one, you just are living in a different reality. I went from SFS to UVa and was shocked by all of the NoVa kids who seemed caught up in scores and rankings. My high school experience was really different and much more values based. We didn't have class rank or anything like that. If you can't accept that and think every parent (and student) is just focused on "winning," you definitely belong at the public magnet.

Then don't complain when your kid doesn't get into a top college, which is what this thread is about. Oh I know.. you didn't send them to private school just for top college as the end goal. You would be perfectly happy with your kid going to mediocre private college.

Oh, I definitely won't be complaining. Unlike many of the parents on here, my hope for my kids is not that they go to the highest ranked school possible majoring in CS. I have moved away from DC and they go to private schools where I think they will get the benefit of a supportive, fulfilling high school experience followed by a great college experience. My goal in life is not for them to be miserable robots. I went on a tour of a private school that felt like a magnet public a couple of years ago and could not get out of there fast enough. All they talked about was how many college classes you could take and that once you finished everything they offered, you could get online and take more. I wondered if the kids all had online PhDs at 18. The whole thing was such a sad view into how so many parents think and what schools think these people want to hear. My kids will not be experiencing that view of education. That's why they don't go to the public magnets where we live, which also send a ton of kids to top colleges. Not interested.

That's great for you and your kid. But, DC area parents do care about where their kids go to college. And I bet you don't think rich private school kids who major in CS are "miserable robots".

Also, the social media app you and your kids are using were probably * "miserable robots" who took a lot of STEM courses.

sorry, should state * made by

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

Sure, but the little kid who was educated by the Towson education major could grow up to go into a public magnet program and do exceedingly well in college.

Whereas, a private school kid whose parents spent a ton of money on K-12, and taught by a liberal arts major at some SLAC could end up at UI or Michigan State.

YMMV.

???

What's the ??? about? What major or college the teacher went to, especially in the lower grades, does not really impact what college a kid who was taught by such a teacher ends up at, nor does it indicate what their SAT scores are. So, what does it matter if a private school teacher went to a fancy school or that a public school teacher went to to Towson? At least the public school teacher is certified. Don't you look for certifications when you hire someone? Why wouldn't you want your expensive private school teacher to be certified? Seems weird.

Thanks for clarifying - I didn't understand the point.

Personally, I'm more interested if the teacher's major is in the subject they are teaching and if they continue to take CEUs, especially in the sciences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

Sure, but they at least need to be certified, unlike private school teachers.

FYI - being smart doesn't make you a good teacher, especially in the lower grades.

A thousand times this!

I have a PhD from MIT. One of my kids as a third grader would have decided she didn't like math if I was the only one involved. Luckily she had a lovely third grade (public) school teacher who truth be told didn't know a ton about math but did know about how kids learn. I dont recall where her degree was from but I dont think it was anywhere people on this board would get excited about. I credit her with keeping the math/science option open for my DD. My DD is now studying physics at UChicago and this teacher had a ton to do with that outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lots of insecurity from public school parents here.
1) You'll find super smart kids at both public and private. I don't see any private school parents denying that fact.
2a) Private school is simply expensive and out of reach for many families. This in itself raises the hackles of public school parents who see this as fundamentally unfair and elitist. I don't think any private school parent would disagree. It's something that many private school parents acknowledge, and feel uncomfortable about, but in the end choose private because they can.
2b) Families who live in $1.5M homes in Ward 3 are also highly privileged, in the grand scheme of things. So, it's a bit disingenuous to criticize private school parents when you yourself likely have a HHI well, well above the city median.
3) As a private school parent, I like the fact that my kids are in a safe, small environment where teachers, administrators, and staff know my kids personally. I like that the teachers respond to my emails. I like that they don't have to walk through metal detectors. I like that kids aren't getting arrested at my kids school. I like that there aren't physical fights daily. I like that the there isn't a "Yale-or-Jail" mentality to the kids, which, frankly is the case at Jackson-Reed; and to make it worse, most of the "Yale" kids are White, and most of the "Jail" kids are Black. White JR parents like to tout the diversity of the school, but their kids' friends are almost all White. There is a lot of segregation within the school. While our kids' private school isn't perfect, there are lot more multi-ethnic/racial friendships than what I observe at JR. My sample size is admittedly small, but I don't see the Yale-Jail divide at top private schools they way I see it at JR.

And yes, for sure, the top JR kids are getting into top colleges, but that's not the main reason we are sending our kids to private. I know my kid will get into college, probably a pretty good one, even with the grade deflation.

This alleged mentality is cited only by people like you, who don’t have kids at JR. It is absolutely not the way kids at JR think about the school or their peers. Stop projecting your class- and race-based assumptions on to other people’s children.

What are the demographics of the kids at JR who don't go to college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lots of insecurity from public school parents here.
1) You'll find super smart kids at both public and private. I don't see any private school parents denying that fact.
2a) Private school is simply expensive and out of reach for many families. This in itself raises the hackles of public school parents who see this as fundamentally unfair and elitist. I don't think any private school parent would disagree. It's something that many private school parents acknowledge, and feel uncomfortable about, but in the end choose private because they can.
2b) Families who live in $1.5M homes in Ward 3 are also highly privileged, in the grand scheme of things. So, it's a bit disingenuous to criticize private school parents when you yourself likely have a HHI well, well above the city median.
3) As a private school parent, I like the fact that my kids are in a safe, small environment where teachers, administrators, and staff know my kids personally. I like that the teachers respond to my emails. I like that they don't have to walk through metal detectors. I like that kids aren't getting arrested at my kids school. I like that there aren't physical fights daily. I like that the there isn't a "Yale-or-Jail" mentality to the kids, which, frankly is the case at Jackson-Reed; and to make it worse, most of the "Yale" kids are White, and most of the "Jail" kids are Black. White JR parents like to tout the diversity of the school, but their kids' friends are almost all White. There is a lot of segregation within the school. While our kids' private school isn't perfect, there are lot more multi-ethnic/racial friendships than what I observe at JR. My sample size is admittedly small, but I don't see the Yale-Jail divide at top private schools they way I see it at JR.

And yes, for sure, the top JR kids are getting into top colleges, but that's not the main reason we are sending our kids to private. I know my kid will get into college, probably a pretty good one, even with the grade deflation.

This alleged mentality is cited only by people like you, who don’t have kids at JR. It is absolutely not the way kids at JR think about the school or their peers. Stop projecting your class- and race-based assumptions on to other people’s children.

What are the demographics of the kids at JR who don't go to college?

+1 This is why kids are better off with a Quaker education. Kids who aren't headed for college are never even allowed through the front door

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school, especially one built on a set of values, like a Friends school, is just a completely different environment than a STEM and score obsessed public magnet. Believe it or not, many people do not just send their kids to these schools for a "competitive edge."

Unfortunately, if the only world you know is the TJ-type one, you just are living in a different reality. I went from SFS to UVa and was shocked by all of the NoVa kids who seemed caught up in scores and rankings. My high school experience was really different and much more values based. We didn't have class rank or anything like that. If you can't accept that and think every parent (and student) is just focused on "winning," you definitely belong at the public magnet.

Then don't complain when your kid doesn't get into a top college, which is what this thread is about. Oh I know.. you didn't send them to private school just for top college as the end goal. You would be perfectly happy with your kid going to mediocre private college.

Oh, I definitely won't be complaining. Unlike many of the parents on here, my hope for my kids is not that they go to the highest ranked school possible majoring in CS. I have moved away from DC and they go to private schools where I think they will get the benefit of a supportive, fulfilling high school experience followed by a great college experience. My goal in life is not for them to be miserable robots. I went on a tour of a private school that felt like a magnet public a couple of years ago and could not get out of there fast enough. All they talked about was how many college classes you could take and that once you finished everything they offered, you could get online and take more. I wondered if the kids all had online PhDs at 18. The whole thing was such a sad view into how so many parents think and what schools think these people want to hear. My kids will not be experiencing that view of education. That's why they don't go to the public magnets where we live, which also send a ton of kids to top colleges. Not interested.

That's great for you and your kid. But, DC area parents do care about where their kids go to college. And I bet you don't think rich private school kids who major in CS are "miserable robots".

Also, the social media app you and your kids are using were probably * "miserable robots" who took a lot of STEM courses.

sorry, should state * made by

Did American kids make TikTok?

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Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

Sure, but they at least need to be certified, unlike private school teachers.

FYI - being smart doesn't make you a good teacher, especially in the lower grades.

A thousand times this!

I have a PhD from MIT. One of my kids as a third grader would have decided she didn't like math if I was the only one involved. Luckily she had a lovely third grade (public) school teacher who truth be told didn't know a ton about math but did know about how kids learn. I dont recall where her degree was from but I dont think it was anywhere people on this board would get excited about. I credit her with keeping the math/science option open for my DD. My DD is now studying physics at UChicago and this teacher had a ton to do with that outcome.

Ditto. Immigrant aunt who barely speaks English still managed to teach my kids so much that they both skipped grades while she was their nanny. No SAT score there!

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Anonymous wrote:Ok. Everyone is disappointed when their hard working student does not get into a desired college. That is true across the board.

Yes, but private school parents seem to be blaming the private school, as if paying for the $$ private school should mean they should get special treatment.

I have no dog in this fight but it seems the position of the private schools is that their kids with lower GPAs are being evaluated more harshly. Like the appropriate adjustments are not being made for the rigor of the grading.

This. My kid has been in public and private. Public school was not rigorous (even though it’s one of the “top area public schools). My kid’s gpa would be much higher in public. Maybe colleges were never really distinguishing between the rigor of schools or mandatory SATs disguised this.

The public school applicants have AP scores to validate their grades. If we're talking about public school kids applying to the type of schools the OP think he kid deserves to attend, you are talking about a lot of 4s and 5s in classes with curriculums that are supposed to be consistent across all schools offering the course.

Is it MCPS where you get an 82 one semester and a 92 the next and they end up with an A for the year? That’s the crazy grade inflation I’m talking about.

Indeed, but as a PP stated, just look at their AP test scores.

Everyone games the system to their advantage. Kids will put in the minimal effort to get the A, but when it counts like the AP test scores, they will show their ability.

Lots of public school kids get majority 5s on APs and 1500+ SAT scores. No amount of grade inflation is going to help with the AP test scores.

I don’t care about AP scores. The colleges are screening by GPAs which are artificially inflated.

AP scores validate or discredit a GPA. They are the one objective measure of course rigor that colleges have. Schools can talk about how rigorous their classes are until they are blue in the face, but a kid with and A and a 5 in a similarly titled class from a no name public school is going to be viewed as having done well in a rigorous class.

There are many schools that don't do AP for many unique and valid reasons.

What valid reasons do private schools use to get rid of AP classes?

They think they can create better classes.

Yet, based on the grade inflation argument, AP exams (and classes) are really the only objective measurement of ability. Basically, private schools are getting rid of AP classes because they don't want to pay College Board. IMO, it's a financial reason. Their teachers aren't even certified teachers.

When I see job postings, I always see how the employers want certifications in abc, xyz, but I guess for private K-12, certifications need not be required. I guess it's because they don't get paid as much. Private school parents are happy to spend $$ on schools being taught by teachers who don't get paid that much and aren't certified. Then, those same parents expect high results for college admissions.

Go figure.

Lots of Towson-educated “education” majors teaching in our local public schools. The vast majority of them wouldn’t have survived or gotten into a top college or a difficult subject-matter major.

Sure, but they at least need to be certified, unlike private school teachers.

FYI - being smart doesn't make you a good teacher, especially in the lower grades.

A thousand times this!

I have a PhD from MIT. One of my kids as a third grader would have decided she didn't like math if I was the only one involved. Luckily she had a lovely third grade (public) school teacher who truth be told didn't know a ton about math but did know about how kids learn. I dont recall where her degree was from but I dont think it was anywhere people on this board would get excited about. I credit her with keeping the math/science option open for my DD. My DD is now studying physics at UChicago and this teacher had a ton to do with that outcome.

PP here.. parents are the worst at teaching their kids because of the dynamic.

Even so, an MIT grad wouldn't necessarily be great at teaching young kids, older maybe, but not young. To your point, you don't need to be good at math in the younger grades to teach math to them, but like you said, you need to know *how* to teach kids with different learning styles. Teachers who take continuing education and training learn pedagogy to teach different learning styles. I could not teach 30 kids who have different learning styles. I was barely able to teach my own kids ES math even though I'm good at math, but I'm not good at *teaching*. That's a whole separate subject matter that requires certification and training. And someone from Towson education major would get that training.

Do private school teachers with fancy degrees get those kind of training and certification?

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Anonymous wrote:Lots of insecurity from public school parents here.
1) You'll find super smart kids at both public and private. I don't see any private school parents denying that fact.
2a) Private school is simply expensive and out of reach for many families. This in itself raises the hackles of public school parents who see this as fundamentally unfair and elitist. I don't think any private school parent would disagree. It's something that many private school parents acknowledge, and feel uncomfortable about, but in the end choose private because they can.
2b) Families who live in $1.5M homes in Ward 3 are also highly privileged, in the grand scheme of things. So, it's a bit disingenuous to criticize private school parents when you yourself likely have a HHI well, well above the city median.
3) As a private school parent, I like the fact that my kids are in a safe, small environment where teachers, administrators, and staff know my kids personally. I like that the teachers respond to my emails. I like that they don't have to walk through metal detectors. I like that kids aren't getting arrested at my kids school. I like that there aren't physical fights daily. I like that the there isn't a "Yale-or-Jail" mentality to the kids, which, frankly is the case at Jackson-Reed; and to make it worse, most of the "Yale" kids are White, and most of the "Jail" kids are Black. White JR parents like to tout the diversity of the school, but their kids' friends are almost all White. There is a lot of segregation within the school. While our kids' private school isn't perfect, there are lot more multi-ethnic/racial friendships than what I observe at JR. My sample size is admittedly small, but I don't see the Yale-Jail divide at top private schools they way I see it at JR.

And yes, for sure, the top JR kids are getting into top colleges, but that's not the main reason we are sending our kids to private. I know my kid will get into college, probably a pretty good one, even with the grade deflation.

This alleged mentality is cited only by people like you, who don’t have kids at JR. It is absolutely not the way kids at JR think about the school or their peers. Stop projecting your class- and race-based assumptions on to other people’s children.

What are the demographics of the kids at JR who don't go to college?

+1 This is why kids are better off with a Quaker education. Kids who aren't headed for college are never even allowed through the front door

Real strong Quaker values there.