Yondr pouch pilot program at some MS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is going to flop.

It’s been going well so far, so I guess it’s not gonna be an absolute failure as you predicted

What counts as "going well" and how could you know that? Have any of these schools even issued the pouches yet?

Yes, Robinson’s been doing it for a week. No issues. Classrooms are livelier, hallway incidents are down, kids are in class more often based on ehallpass data (guessing since they aren’t going to the bathroom to scroll for 20 minutes). It’s honestly been the most positive change in my memory as a teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

Pretty obvious that in your child's situation, mommy is the problem, not the school. Your kid doesn't need to text you in the middle of the day to tell you she's having a bad day. Land the helicopter, mama!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

Kids are not unattended so I’m not sure how that could be true.

They are comparing schools with vs without pouches. How could they compare and orovide stats if some schools didn’t trial the pouches? We are at a pouch school and so far it is going great.

Yondr says they have been doing this since 2014. Seems an adequate amount of time to collect data to demonstrate outcomes. The "going great" anecdotes on this board have been just that -- anecdotal. If you're going to spout statistics at me suggesting that this will, for example, reduce the incidence of suicide and depression, why can't we expect them to demonstrate that the magic pouch actually affects outcomes? If this were a zero-cost solution, then it would be a no-brainer. But there are costs and trade-offs here so it is not a no-brainer. It's vaguely interesting that some people think it's "gone well," but when the issue on the table is whether we've bought snake oil, it's reasonable to expect actual quantification to inform the decision of whether to continue down the path.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

Pretty obvious that in your child's situation, mommy is the problem, not the school. Your kid doesn't need to text you in the middle of the day to tell you she's having a bad day. Land the helicopter, mama!

DCUM: where insults stand in for substantive responses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

You day you want data to see if it's worth it. That's the whole point of this! Some schools are using the pouches and some are trying "away for the day". Test schools are those with the pouches and control schools are those without. How do expect to gather data on the success if we don't try?

[Anonymous]

Since we are sharing updates and anecdotes, my daughter is at a control school without pouches and reports no issues from the first two weeks. Students have cells off and away, just last like year. Teachers in 8th grade are enforcing this just like her 7th grade teachers did and kids are not trying to sneak them out.

[Anonymous]

It would be much easier simply to ban students having cell phones outright. They can put up some landlines in the lobby for emergencies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

You day you want data to see if it's worth it. That's the whole point of this! Some schools are using the pouches and some are trying "away for the day". Test schools are those with the pouches and control schools are those without. How do expect to gather data on the success if we don't try?

Because Yondr's PowerPoint says they have been doing this since 2014, and is selling their product on the notion that cell phones are statistically responsible for the ills of society. They've had 10 years by their count to collect data showing they affect these outcomes. Either we care about data or we don't. We can't use data to demonstrate the problem and then say it would be unfair to use the same data to measure the proposed solution. My hypothesis: Yondr pouches will have zero impact on depression and distraction rates as compared to schools with a non-Yondr "away for the day" policy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

You day you want data to see if it's worth it. That's the whole point of this! Some schools are using the pouches and some are trying "away for the day". Test schools are those with the pouches and control schools are those without. How do expect to gather data on the success if we don't try?

Because Yondr's PowerPoint says they have been doing this since 2014, and is selling their product on the notion that cell phones are statistically responsible for the ills of society. They've had 10 years by their count to collect data showing they affect these outcomes. Either we care about data or we don't. We can't use data to demonstrate the problem and then say it would be unfair to use the same data to measure the proposed solution. My hypothesis: Yondr pouches will have zero impact on depression and distraction rates as compared to schools with a non-Yondr "away for the day" policy.

Then FCPS will decide not to get pouches for all. And no one will care as long as kids aren’t disrupting class and the school with their phones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've got 2 kids at one of the MS where this pilot is being run. They get their pouches next week. I don't mind school having a no-cell-phones policy (the school already had one), and frankly would prefer that devices (including laptops) be off and away during instructional time BUT I think the idea that these pouches are going to be the silver bullet is utterly stupid.

We are just suckers paying who-knows-how-much (FCPS is saying $18/kid for replacement but I doubt that is the true price tag) for a system that kids will quickly outsmart. My money is on 1,000 tech-savvy kids versus a few tech-dumb administrators. My kid already read Yondr's patent application out of curiosity (spoiler alert: it is just a strong magnet). Just say cell phones aren't allowed and enforce the policy. Yondr is an expensive version of enforcement that won't be any more effective than the cheap version and will cause knock-on issues.

The big knock-on issue is that a magnet can't use judgment and grant exceptions in real time. I can think of many reasons why there should be exceptions to cell phone bans for particular situations and we won't be able to think of them in advance. Some could be life or death (on another board, someone mentioned a kid had a heart attack and classmates spent 10 minutes trying to find a teacher because cell phones were banned), and some could just be normal parent-kid communication issues ("I'm having a bad day, mom"). You can't reason with a magnet.

I totally get that there are problems with kids and cell phones -- self-esteem, distraction, etc. -- but this is just a foolhardy measure with logical appeal that won't correct any of those problems. In fact, the schools are on the one hand claiming the moral high ground on cell phones and then plopping a distracting computer in front of every kid. If we had stats showing that schools with Yondr pouches have demonstrably higher test scores or demonstrably lower suicide rates post-Yondr, I'd listen and likely think they are worth the trouble. But we don't have those stats. Our administrators instead put up specious support on a Yondr-branded PowerPoint that suggested (and the administrators expressly asserted) that cell phones are solely responsible for increases in suicide and depression rate increases since 2010.

I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

You day you want data to see if it's worth it. That's the whole point of this! Some schools are using the pouches and some are trying "away for the day". Test schools are those with the pouches and control schools are those without. How do expect to gather data on the success if we don't try?

Because Yondr's PowerPoint says they have been doing this since 2014, and is selling their product on the notion that cell phones are statistically responsible for the ills of society. They've had 10 years by their count to collect data showing they affect these outcomes. Either we care about data or we don't. We can't use data to demonstrate the problem and then say it would be unfair to use the same data to measure the proposed solution. My hypothesis: Yondr pouches will have zero impact on depression and distraction rates as compared to schools with a non-Yondr "away for the day" policy.

Then FCPS will decide not to get pouches for all. And no one will care as long as kids aren’t disrupting class and the school with their phones.

Well, here's hoping, but the FCPS I know is not nearly so sensible as all that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Since we are sharing updates and anecdotes, my daughter is at a control school without pouches and reports no issues from the first two weeks. Students have cells off and away, just last like year. Teachers in 8th grade are enforcing this just like her 7th grade teachers did and kids are not trying to sneak them out.

Just like last year? My now-9th grader told me last year that phones were away in middle school. Now he tells me that kids were on phones during class, the "good" kids sometimes and the "bad" kids all the time. So "just like last year" isn't really reassuring.

[Anonymous]

Everyone thinks their child is not using their phone. Your good kid is sneaking their phone.

-teacher (who knows his ‘good’ kid is sneaking his phone even though he has a strong GPA and teachers have never mentioned it/caught it. They’re addictive.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Since we are sharing updates and anecdotes, my daughter is at a control school without pouches and reports no issues from the first two weeks. Students have cells off and away, just last like year. Teachers in 8th grade are enforcing this just like her 7th grade teachers did and kids are not trying to sneak them out.

Just like last year? My now-9th grader told me last year that phones were away in middle school. Now he tells me that kids were on phones during class, the "good" kids sometimes and the "bad" kids all the time. So "just like last year" isn't really reassuring.

You couldn’t get my sarcasm with the update and all of these people sharing how great it is with the pouches? It’s been 9 days of school. That’s it. Of course it’s going to all go to hell with both groups. It’s only the first two weeks and everything is sunshine and rainbows in both groups because it’s the very beginning of the year. Middle schoolers are generally not going to test the rules in the early days. Let’s all check back in next month.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Since we are sharing updates and anecdotes, my daughter is at a control school without pouches and reports no issues from the first two weeks. Students have cells off and away, just last like year. Teachers in 8th grade are enforcing this just like her 7th grade teachers did and kids are not trying to sneak them out.

+1 same. My son is a freshman at a non pouch school and away for the day seems to be working fine. And all without the hefty price tag of Yondr pouches. Just good old fashioned discipline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm so tired of schools operating like prisons and then wondering why the students act like inmates.

This.

We are in a non-DMV division with weapons detectors at all levels (ES, MS, HS) and with a new(er) no-cell policy (different policy and consequences ES vs MS/HS). Most HS classrooms have phone cubbies or boxes. Some teachers just have phones laid out on an empty desk at the front of the room or in the "marker" tray of their whiteboard. Our division opted against pouches and will try what they are doing now first.

Next up for us are ID badges, to be worn on lanyards around the neck, all day, all circumstances (incl recess, PE, and sports)...but they might walk some of that back.

The phone experiment is going OK, with many students and teachers liking it. But almost all hate the current detectors and prospect of ID badges. They feel like walking through TSA every day and just being a QR Code "number" (on their badges).

I'm glad we only have two years left. The End can't come soon enough.