the Atlantic: The Elite College Students Who Can't Read Books

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are in MCPS. They do definitely read at least a few full books on English class. I wish it was more — it seems like it’s one full book per quarter plus then poems and short stories built around that. This quarter my 10tj grader is reading Circe. Last year he read Life of Pi as the last book but I can’t remember what else. I think they are decent books but I do wish they were reading more like 6-8 books a year and mixing in some older ones — maybe 1 19th century and a couple 20th century. It does seem like there is a preference for stuff that came out in the 21st century.

I think the colleges are getting what they asked for. They want kids that have endless extracurriculars, travel teams, competitive clubs that do regional/national competitions, kids that do tons of volunteer work or internships. Exactly when do they think kids are gojng to have time to just read novels? I read tons of novels growing up because my only extracurriculars were a couple clubs that met occasionally and did 1-2 events a year.

PP makes a great point about kids not having time for reading.

They don't have time because their parents make them do all of these ridiculous activities. Your kid can get into a ton of schools without all of that bit parents are so nervous that they just do what everyone else does. If I tell you my kid only did a once a month activity and worked in the summer and got in everywhere, people will say that's a lie. It isn't but you've all bought into the lie that your kid won't get in anywhere without all of these activities. Why are you so insecure?

it depends on where "everywhere" is

[Anonymous]

Agree that club sports and other time-consuming but mindless extracurriculars are what's pushing out actual college prep activities like reading & analyzing multiple difficult several hundred page novels and more deriving of mathematical proofs and immersive academic activities like independent studies.

Our current grind culture (team sports and checking off all these boxes) is crushing imagination and critical thinking to dust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Agree that club sports and other time-consuming but mindless extracurriculars are what's pushing out actual college prep activities like reading & analyzing multiple difficult several hundred page novels and more deriving of mathematical proofs and immersive academic activities like independent studies.

Our current grind culture (team sports and checking off all these boxes) is crushing imagination and critical thinking to dust.

💯
My kid would love to read more, but she has to volunteer and do a school club and show leadership and uniqueness and originality and prep for SAT and get a 4.0 and blah blah blah blah

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

No surprise, it is one of the reasons Gen Z can’t keep a job. Sure they have punched all the right tickets to get into top schools who have dumbed down the education and passed them off to employers with high GPAs by just giving out As. Clearly Columbia and all of the other “prestigious” schools could not have admitted anyone who wasn’t the best of the best.

Get back to teaching core subjects in K-12, have kids do homework, go back to a grading scale where C is average. Bust the teachers unions and bring discipline back to the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are in MCPS. They do definitely read at least a few full books on English class. I wish it was more — it seems like it’s one full book per quarter plus then poems and short stories built around that. This quarter my 10tj grader is reading Circe. Last year he read Life of Pi as the last book but I can’t remember what else. I think they are decent books but I do wish they were reading more like 6-8 books a year and mixing in some older ones — maybe 1 19th century and a couple 20th century. It does seem like there is a preference for stuff that came out in the 21st century.

I think the colleges are getting what they asked for. They want kids that have endless extracurriculars, travel teams, competitive clubs that do regional/national competitions, kids that do tons of volunteer work or internships. Exactly when do they think kids are gojng to have time to just read novels? I read tons of novels growing up because my only extracurriculars were a couple clubs that met occasionally and did 1-2 events a year.

PP makes a great point about kids not having time for reading.

They don't have time because their parents make them do all of these ridiculous activities. Your kid can get into a ton of schools without all of that bit parents are so nervous that they just do what everyone else does. If I tell you my kid only did a once a month activity and worked in the summer and got in everywhere, people will say that's a lie. It isn't but you've all bought into the lie that your kid won't get in anywhere without all of these activities. Why are you so insecure?

What's was the once a month activity? Private school? Where is "everywhere"? How many of the 10 commonapp EC slots did they leave blank?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP. Despite its length, W&P is much easier than M&M. Tolstoy uses fairly simple vocabulary and sentence structure.

M&M?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

No surprise, it is one of the reasons Gen Z can’t keep a job. Sure they have punched all the right tickets to get into top schools who have dumbed down the education and passed them off to employers with high GPAs by just giving out As. Clearly Columbia and all of the other “prestigious” schools could not have admitted anyone who wasn’t the best of the best.

Get back to teaching core subjects in K-12, have kids do homework, go back to a grading scale where C is average. Bust the teachers unions and bring discipline back to the classroom.

Unions are what attract the best teachers. Go look at states like Arizona where there are no unions. Low pay won’t attract teachers. They are hiring warm bodies left and right there since the pay is so low.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

No surprise, it is one of the reasons Gen Z can’t keep a job. Sure they have punched all the right tickets to get into top schools who have dumbed down the education and passed them off to employers with high GPAs by just giving out As. Clearly Columbia and all of the other “prestigious” schools could not have admitted anyone who wasn’t the best of the best.

Get back to teaching core subjects in K-12, have kids do homework, go back to a grading scale where C is average. Bust the teachers unions and bring discipline back to the classroom.

How is it that the unemployment rate is 4.1% yet GenZ can’t keep a job? GenZ is 27% of the workforce…so clearly a large %age seem to keep a job.

No to mention nearly 60% of 18 year olds don’t ever go to college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP. Despite its length, W&P is much easier than M&M. Tolstoy uses fairly simple vocabulary and sentence structure.

M&M?

PP. The Master and Margarita, by Mikhail Bulgakov, which was mentioned by the poster I responded to. M&M is a key work of 20th century Russian literature and quite a read. It's a weird, fantastical piece about the devil visiting Moscow in the 1930s and wreaking havoc (with an entire subplot about Jesus and Pontius Pilate). The whole thing is a study on Stalinist repression and Soviet corruption.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

No surprise, it is one of the reasons Gen Z can’t keep a job. Sure they have punched all the right tickets to get into top schools who have dumbed down the education and passed them off to employers with high GPAs by just giving out As. Clearly Columbia and all of the other “prestigious” schools could not have admitted anyone who wasn’t the best of the best.

Get back to teaching core subjects in K-12, have kids do homework, go back to a grading scale where C is average. Bust the teachers unions and bring discipline back to the classroom.

How is it that the unemployment rate is 4.1% yet GenZ can’t keep a job? GenZ is 27% of the workforce…so clearly a large %age seem to keep a job.

No to mention nearly 60% of 18 year olds don’t ever go to college.

Bad parenting by their Gen X parents is part of it, but mostly due to America’s failing educational system - https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bosses-firing-gen-z-grads-111719818.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

No surprise, it is one of the reasons Gen Z can’t keep a job. Sure they have punched all the right tickets to get into top schools who have dumbed down the education and passed them off to employers with high GPAs by just giving out As. Clearly Columbia and all of the other “prestigious” schools could not have admitted anyone who wasn’t the best of the best.

Get back to teaching core subjects in K-12, have kids do homework, go back to a grading scale where C is average. Bust the teachers unions and bring discipline back to the classroom.

WTF do teacher unions have to do with this PP? I’m pretty sure teachers are not the ones pushing for lack of discipline and handing out As. That would be parents and admin.

[Anonymous]

I am curious how many of the parents lamenting the easy As handed out in high schools would actually freak out if their kids came home with Bs and Cs.

[Anonymous]

My BASIS DC middle-schoolers have read at least 2 full books a year in class starting in fifth grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am curious how many of the parents lamenting the easy As handed out in high schools would actually freak out if their kids came home with Bs and Cs.

All of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am curious how many of the parents lamenting the easy As handed out in high schools would actually freak out if their kids came home with Bs and Cs.

Well, I did exactly that and wanted that outcome. I moved my kid to private specifically to avoid the easy As, and that kid got two Cs his first semester after being an easy 4.0 student. It may in fact have impacted his college chances. I did not care because my goals were longer than college. DC is now a young adult who is soaring, and part of that is his discipline and capacity for hard work.

Kids need to learn hard work and discipline at some point. If they don’t learn it in high school or college, they learn it on their first job, which is not an ideal spot to learn.