Diversity of schools - can this work both ways? Am I being unreasonable?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Asian families tend to be pragmatic about public schools, not chasing some ideal sounding ethnic breakdown.

Because they understand that the role of a school is to give their kids the best education available, rather than to advance some sort of progressive utopia.

Just another reason why Asians do well academically. For them, it's a purely transactional experience.

Hmm, but I don’t value the Asian model of learning. Diversity is important. A good school for all is an excellent goal. Injecting UMC who score well on exams improves lower income kids’ education and goals while improving UMC kids too. I reject that test scores and my kid’s outcomes are my entire focus. We live in a democracy and we need to improve public education for ALL kids. UMC families need to stop defeating schools and hoarding opportunities.

Yea no. My goal is for my kid, especially since DC is not meeting my kids academic potential by focusing on just the bottom.

It’s not families that are responsible for improving education for all kids, it’s the school district. And to that DC is failing miserably. DC can’t even meet my kid’s needs so why should I be concerned about other kids?

The purest distillation of DCUM. “I refuse to care about anyone else’s kids. Why doesn’t everyone else care about my kids!”

Exactly! Me, me, me, my kid. Entitlement and self-absorption is the norm. It’s gross. I want everyone’s needs to be met. PP kid is likely average and PP can’t handle it so she blames DCPS for not challenging her kid.

I totally agree with the above PP. DCUM Conventional Wisdom is "the only reasonable choice is grab as much as you can" for yourself/your kids/your family, and fight anything that doesn't benefit me (sorry, my kid) before (or grudgingly, concurrently with) everybody else's.

There is a growing minority view that community benefit first, e.g., from joining low-income/nonwhite schools or avoiding self-segregation into racial enclave charters, is acceptable or even good for everyone, but this view is usually shouted down, typically with a "whatevs, I'm gonna get mine" or "since I'm not white, my culture says I need to get mine first" or something similarly head-scratching.

For my end, I want my kids in the low-income, "underperforming" schools and have them there now, where my kids are succeeding just fine, socially and academically. No, we are not a naive bleeding heart PK family though I'm not going to out myself to My Very Good Friends of DCUM. My goal is to be part of the community and support excellence as they grow rather than shout about it from outside or dismiss these schools as "non-options."

I was you. The problem is that this approach requires collective action. We ultimately left in 3rd grade. My kid was doing great academically but NOT socially, and it was getting harder each year as more of the students at or above grade level left. I was not going to make my kid suffer for my ideals. If your kids are happy at their school, great, but my kid wasn't. Should I have continued to force her to when there were other options available?

You can roll your eyes all you want, but the truth is that people of all races mostly move out of these underperforming schools because their kids are struggling in some way. I know for us, we really wanted the neighborhood school and the community and we didn't want to be driving to a charter or another DCPS far from our home. But it's what we now do because losing the neighborhood/community aspect of our school wound up being worth gaining a school with academics that appropriately challenge our kid and without the disruptions and distractions of high truancy rates.

Also, our last year at our IB, the push to raise test scores was so intense that the school was honestly too academic and "excellence" focused. The kids were hardly getting any breaks from academics at all, with a measly little 10 minute recess after lunch. The material they were expected to get through worked against learning, it was just cramming as much as possible into their little heads in the hopes that PARCC scores would come up. Nevermind if they retained it or enjoyed the process in any way. Going to a school that doesn't have that pressure to raise scores is wonderful because kids can just learn at a natural pace and in an age-appropriate way. They still don't spend enough time outside, but they do more art and music and focus more on social skills and building community. This was near impossible at our IB due to academic remediation expectations.

But you do you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Asian families tend to be pragmatic about public schools, not chasing some ideal sounding ethnic breakdown.

Because they understand that the role of a school is to give their kids the best education available, rather than to advance some sort of progressive utopia.

Just another reason why Asians do well academically. For them, it's a purely transactional experience.

Hmm, but I don’t value the Asian model of learning. Diversity is important. A good school for all is an excellent goal. Injecting UMC who score well on exams improves lower income kids’ education and goals while improving UMC kids too. I reject that test scores and my kid’s outcomes are my entire focus. We live in a democracy and we need to improve public education for ALL kids. UMC families need to stop defeating schools and hoarding opportunities.

Yea no. My goal is for my kid, especially since DC is not meeting my kids academic potential by focusing on just the bottom.

It’s not families that are responsible for improving education for all kids, it’s the school district. And to that DC is failing miserably. DC can’t even meet my kid’s needs so why should I be concerned about other kids?

The purest distillation of DCUM. “I refuse to care about anyone else’s kids. Why doesn’t everyone else care about my kids!”

Exactly! Me, me, me, my kid. Entitlement and self-absorption is the norm. It’s gross. I want everyone’s needs to be met. PP kid is likely average and PP can’t handle it so she blames DCPS for not challenging her kid.

I totally agree with the above PP. DCUM Conventional Wisdom is "the only reasonable choice is grab as much as you can" for yourself/your kids/your family, and fight anything that doesn't benefit me (sorry, my kid) before (or grudgingly, concurrently with) everybody else's.

There is a growing minority view that community benefit first, e.g., from joining low-income/nonwhite schools or avoiding self-segregation into racial enclave charters, is acceptable or even good for everyone, but this view is usually shouted down, typically with a "whatevs, I'm gonna get mine" or "since I'm not white, my culture says I need to get mine first" or something similarly head-scratching.

For my end, I want my kids in the low-income, "underperforming" schools and have them there now, where my kids are succeeding just fine, socially and academically. No, we are not a naive bleeding heart PK family though I'm not going to out myself to My Very Good Friends of DCUM. My goal is to be part of the community and support excellence as they grow rather than shout about it from outside or dismiss these schools as "non-options."

Have your children reached middle school?

Thanks for confirming the DCUM typical BS. Yes, and again, not going to out myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The neighborhood middle and high schools in DC apart from the obvious three have boundary participation rates ranging from 7% to 39%. That's not just UMC people deciding that these aren't the best schools for their kids. Avoiding schools where most kids are significantly behind and where there are attendence and disciplinary challenges is actually a totally normal thing across income and racial lines.

You want to do something different, no one can stop you. But consider that your narrative about how your kids are doing great and other families who prioritize their children are selfish makes it much less likely that your kids will share with you if something is going wrong for them.

yes this. when I chat with parents across the income spectrum (blue collar, no college, non-white, the whole range) at our EOTP (very decent elementary with a terrible middle school feeder -- Cardozo), ALL of them are planning to lottery out for middle school. I seriously haven't met a single parent who plans to send their kid to Cardozo. The schools vary (UMC parents hoping for Latin or moving to Upper NW, MC/LMC looking at McKinley middle or Howard middle school) but everyone has a plan. all are loving parents to sweet kids who all want the best for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:


I went to school in a school that was so white I can still name the 3 non-white kids in our graduating class of 400. And it wasn’t any more diverse socio-economically — everyone was UMC, in the 80s meaning of the term and not the DCUM version that actually means “sort of rich.” Almost everyone went on to college, but we all went to state schools. Even with that homogeneous population, we had tracking. The district proposed doing away with tracking at one point when I was in 11th or 12th grade, and the kids in the advanced classes all freaked out because we knew what it was like in earlier grades in non-tracked classes and didn’t want to go back to being bored all day.

Yes, tracking can get complicated because it intersects with issues of race and class. But there are good reasons for tracking that have nothing to do with race or class. The DCUM cohort tends to be made up of people who were once advanced students bored in non-tracked classes. Many of us now have children facing the same issue. There’s more to it than just “socially segregating.”


This, and not just bored. Many of us were very academically minded students who were bullied in non-tracked classes or had to deal with behavioral disruptions from students who didn't care to learn, refused to do the homework, and had little interest in the material. And I went to a majority white school that was like this. I want honors classes for my kid because I distinctly remember what it was like to be sitting in a classroom feeling enthusiastic about the material and barely able to discuss it because so much of the class was taken up with behavioral concerns and students goofing off and trying to distract the teacher. And then also being targeted by those same students for being lame enough to like school and learning.

I know black kids who are giant nerds like I was and I would also like them to have access to tracked classes that are filled with peers who care about the material and where they can move at a speed that matches their interests and ability.

Public schools have a lot of kids who just don't want to be there and don't want to learn. There are lots of reasons for that, but it's unclear to me why the kids who love school and love learning need to dumb themselves down to accommodate these kids when they could just be in another room actually learning. At least for a couple subjects a day. People who opposed honors classes or tracking are either willfully forgetting what public school was like for the academic students or they were not very academic themselves.

+1 to all of this. Have a kid at a popular charter who was a lackadaisical student in 8th and complained to me in 9th grade about how the kids in her regular classes were disruptive and the teacher couldn't get through the material because of managing behavioral issues. (9th was first year of real honors track separation). I told her that if she wanted to be with other students who weren't disruptive and wanted to learn, then she needed to work hard to qualify for the honors level. This "honors for all" or ---to be more accurate about most regular DCPS MS and high schools--NO honors for anyone---is idiotic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Asian families tend to be pragmatic about public schools, not chasing some ideal sounding ethnic breakdown.

Because they understand that the role of a school is to give their kids the best education available, rather than to advance some sort of progressive utopia.

Just another reason why Asians do well academically. For them, it's a purely transactional experience.

Hmm, but I don’t value the Asian model of learning. Diversity is important. A good school for all is an excellent goal. Injecting UMC who score well on exams improves lower income kids’ education and goals while improving UMC kids too. I reject that test scores and my kid’s outcomes are my entire focus. We live in a democracy and we need to improve public education for ALL kids. UMC families need to stop defeating schools and hoarding opportunities.

Yea no. My goal is for my kid, especially since DC is not meeting my kids academic potential by focusing on just the bottom.

It’s not families that are responsible for improving education for all kids, it’s the school district. And to that DC is failing miserably. DC can’t even meet my kid’s needs so why should I be concerned about other kids?

The purest distillation of DCUM. “I refuse to care about anyone else’s kids. Why doesn’t everyone else care about my kids!”

Exactly! Me, me, me, my kid. Entitlement and self-absorption is the norm. It’s gross. I want everyone’s needs to be met. PP kid is likely average and PP can’t handle it so she blames DCPS for not challenging her kid.

I totally agree with the above PP. DCUM Conventional Wisdom is "the only reasonable choice is grab as much as you can" for yourself/your kids/your family, and fight anything that doesn't benefit me (sorry, my kid) before (or grudgingly, concurrently with) everybody else's.

There is a growing minority view that community benefit first, e.g., from joining low-income/nonwhite schools or avoiding self-segregation into racial enclave charters, is acceptable or even good for everyone, but this view is usually shouted down, typically with a "whatevs, I'm gonna get mine" or "since I'm not white, my culture says I need to get mine first" or something similarly head-scratching.

For my end, I want my kids in the low-income, "underperforming" schools and have them there now, where my kids are succeeding just fine, socially and academically. No, we are not a naive bleeding heart PK family though I'm not going to out myself to My Very Good Friends of DCUM. My goal is to be part of the community and support excellence as they grow rather than shout about it from outside or dismiss these schools as "non-options."

Have your children reached middle school?

Thanks for confirming the DCUM typical BS. Yes, and again, not going to out myself.

OP here.

If your kid is white and goes to a middle school in DC that’s <1% white, you’re one of about 15 families that can say that. In which case, yes, obviously naming the school would identify you. If that’s the case, I would like to hear more about your experience, without identifying yourself. Was there a social shift from Elementary School into middle school? When did you/your child feel that? How do your kids feel about their school experience? What would you say some of the challenges have been for your family on this path? I’d be really eager to hear more from you if you’re willing.

I will say, though, given the numbers, I’m skeptical. Eliot-Hine, Stewart Hobson, Jefferson, none of them are <1% white, and so are explicitly NOT what I’m talking about here.

[Anonymous]

yes, so I am PP with MS kid:

socially - transition was more gradual than abrupt. MS child is socially very adaptable, moreso than us, child's parents. Finds many ways to engage with many kids.

This kid is super proud of friends and school. Does not want to change schools for anything. Kind of has a chip on shoulder about the big schools like Deal and all they've got; I don't want to encourage that, but if my kid lines up with the underdogs for the rest of their life, I'd probably be pretty proud.

School does not seem to be a big challenge, but there are some accelerated cohorts. The kids are friendly, belying many stereotypes. Trouble of course is that it doesn't show up on objective testing.

Challenges include knowing whether there is better that can be extracted out of our kid educationally and whether that matters. This kid could of course be put in some kind of pressure cooker to get a "better educational experience" but that's kind of counterfactual. What I'd like is for teachers to push everyone to do more.

Other challenges include not having sports program I'd want my kid to have or extracurriculars that seem to be as enriching.

My hope is that going through this MS and its particular program with an integrated student body will make the school better at reaching everybody who's in the school's pattern and pushing them to succeed as well as good for my kid in terms of socializing them into a world that's not Bethesda and the Ivy League. I think that the school-related "rigor" efforts and support come through engagement with school leadership and teachers, so some of that depends on specific individuals rather than the system in my opinion. I think DCPS has a lot of teachers and administrators who care a lot, but it's hard to expect them to give 110% to every student all the time. I can understand why caring about students who could fall from being net positives in society to net negatives first, as a matter of triage, is logical. That said, I think part of how you reach these kids is expecting greater things from them than society has expected to date.

I'd just say as our MS kid goes through MS, it seems like kid is on top of grades and tests very well so is very likely to move to a selective HS instead of neighborhood HS.

So if I was to suggest what things might be like for others joining the so-called underperforming MS: socially, adaptable kids can do fine! Academically, parent engagement seems pretty valuable, and can help all students win against a public service bureaucracy, extracurricularly, it can be a little rough. But, again, I value placing my kids into an integrated cohort across race and class very highly, probably more highly than placing them in an academically rigorous cohort, believing that our children are likely to be academically successful as well as well-suited to a future better than ours.

So - clearly living in a way that's not so congruent with that of the DCUM norm. Optimistic and engaged.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yes, so I am PP with MS kid:

socially - transition was more gradual than abrupt. MS child is socially very adaptable, moreso than us, child's parents. Finds many ways to engage with many kids.

This kid is super proud of friends and school. Does not want to change schools for anything. Kind of has a chip on shoulder about the big schools like Deal and all they've got; I don't want to encourage that, but if my kid lines up with the underdogs for the rest of their life, I'd probably be pretty proud.

School does not seem to be a big challenge, but there are some accelerated cohorts. The kids are friendly, belying many stereotypes. Trouble of course is that it doesn't show up on objective testing.

Challenges include knowing whether there is better that can be extracted out of our kid educationally and whether that matters. This kid could of course be put in some kind of pressure cooker to get a "better educational experience" but that's kind of counterfactual. What I'd like is for teachers to push everyone to do more.

Other challenges include not having sports program I'd want my kid to have or extracurriculars that seem to be as enriching.

My hope is that going through this MS and its particular program with an integrated student body will make the school better at reaching everybody who's in the school's pattern and pushing them to succeed as well as good for my kid in terms of socializing them into a world that's not Bethesda and the Ivy League. I think that the school-related "rigor" efforts and support come through engagement with school leadership and teachers, so some of that depends on specific individuals rather than the system in my opinion. I think DCPS has a lot of teachers and administrators who care a lot, but it's hard to expect them to give 110% to every student all the time. I can understand why caring about students who could fall from being net positives in society to net negatives first, as a matter of triage, is logical. That said, I think part of how you reach these kids is expecting greater things from them than society has expected to date.

I'd just say as our MS kid goes through MS, it seems like kid is on top of grades and tests very well so is very likely to move to a selective HS instead of neighborhood HS.

So if I was to suggest what things might be like for others joining the so-called underperforming MS: socially, adaptable kids can do fine! Academically, parent engagement seems pretty valuable, and can help all students win against a public service bureaucracy, extracurricularly, it can be a little rough. But, again, I value placing my kids into an integrated cohort across race and class very highly, probably more highly than placing them in an academically rigorous cohort, believing that our children are likely to be academically successful as well as well-suited to a future better than ours.

So - clearly living in a way that's not so congruent with that of the DCUM norm. Optimistic and engaged.

DP, also with MS kid at one of these schools. Above comments are mostly spot-on with our experience, especially the bold parts. Social adjustment was a bit more abrupt--going from an ES where you've known the same kids for 7-8 years and suddenly lots of new kids from other schools who are having their own struggles adapting led to some social stress at the beginning. The school was super helpful--even focusing on cooperative games for the first month of PE to keep kids from different schools from sticking in those groups. All is well--kid loves the school and friends old and new.

We are happy with the sports offered, and the culture, community, and communication at the school. Kid's sense of personal responsibility has grown tremendously, and they are also very on top of grades, so I also expect a selective HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Asian families tend to be pragmatic about public schools, not chasing some ideal sounding ethnic breakdown.

Because they understand that the role of a school is to give their kids the best education available, rather than to advance some sort of progressive utopia.

Just another reason why Asians do well academically. For them, it's a purely transactional experience.

Hmm, but I don’t value the Asian model of learning. Diversity is important. A good school for all is an excellent goal. Injecting UMC who score well on exams improves lower income kids’ education and goals while improving UMC kids too. I reject that test scores and my kid’s outcomes are my entire focus. We live in a democracy and we need to improve public education for ALL kids. UMC families need to stop defeating schools and hoarding opportunities.

Yea no. My goal is for my kid, especially since DC is not meeting my kids academic potential by focusing on just the bottom.

It’s not families that are responsible for improving education for all kids, it’s the school district. And to that DC is failing miserably. DC can’t even meet my kid’s needs so why should I be concerned about other kids?

The purest distillation of DCUM. “I refuse to care about anyone else’s kids. Why doesn’t everyone else care about my kids!”

Exactly! Me, me, me, my kid. Entitlement and self-absorption is the norm. It’s gross. I want everyone’s needs to be met. PP kid is likely average and PP can’t handle it so she blames DCPS for not challenging her kid.

I totally agree with the above PP. DCUM Conventional Wisdom is "the only reasonable choice is grab as much as you can" for yourself/your kids/your family, and fight anything that doesn't benefit me (sorry, my kid) before (or grudgingly, concurrently with) everybody else's.

There is a growing minority view that community benefit first, e.g., from joining low-income/nonwhite schools or avoiding self-segregation into racial enclave charters, is acceptable or even good for everyone, but this view is usually shouted down, typically with a "whatevs, I'm gonna get mine" or "since I'm not white, my culture says I need to get mine first" or something similarly head-scratching.

For my end, I want my kids in the low-income, "underperforming" schools and have them there now, where my kids are succeeding just fine, socially and academically. No, we are not a naive bleeding heart PK family though I'm not going to out myself to My Very Good Friends of DCUM. My goal is to be part of the community and support excellence as they grow rather than shout about it from outside or dismiss these schools as "non-options."

Have your children reached middle school?

Thanks for confirming the DCUM typical BS. Yes, and again, not going to out myself.

But...you also offered a whole screed indicative of "DCUM typical BS". That BS is just the self-congratulating, judgmental bent.

[Anonymous]

Yes, you're right. I prefer my choices over most of DCUM's choices and DCUM's conventional wisdom.

My hope is that by offering different viewpoints and experiences, we might begin to see more multidimensional views here.

Have a good one!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, you're right. I prefer my choices over most of DCUM's choices and DCUM's conventional wisdom.

My hope is that by offering different viewpoints and experiences, we might begin to see more multidimensional views here.

Have a good one!

Your views are pretty commonplace on DCUM, though. Every thread on the relevant topic has views similar to yours.

Everyone just echoes the same stuff back and forth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1. Asian families tend to be pragmatic about public schools, not chasing some ideal sounding ethnic breakdown.

Because they understand that the role of a school is to give their kids the best education available, rather than to advance some sort of progressive utopia.

Just another reason why Asians do well academically. For them, it's a purely transactional experience.

Hmm, but I don’t value the Asian model of learning. Diversity is important. A good school for all is an excellent goal. Injecting UMC who score well on exams improves lower income kids’ education and goals while improving UMC kids too. I reject that test scores and my kid’s outcomes are my entire focus. We live in a democracy and we need to improve public education for ALL kids. UMC families need to stop defeating schools and hoarding opportunities.

I support improving all schools for all kids. But I also know that I, individually, can have little or no impact on that, especially in a hidebound and incompetent administration like DCPS. Positive change like that takes decades. It became clear that DCPS is in a downward spiral again, which is why we picked up our kids and moved to Arlington this year. I can't wait around and hope that DCPS gets its act together fast enough to give my kids a good education.

[Anonymous]

woah a couple of people posted that they are overall reasonably happy at a non-charter middle school eotp and get attacked simply because it is not the response that you pp wanted

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:yes, so I am PP with MS kid:

socially - transition was more gradual than abrupt. MS child is socially very adaptable, moreso than us, child's parents. Finds many ways to engage with many kids.

This kid is super proud of friends and school. Does not want to change schools for anything. Kind of has a chip on shoulder about the big schools like Deal and all they've got; I don't want to encourage that, but if my kid lines up with the underdogs for the rest of their life, I'd probably be pretty proud.

School does not seem to be a big challenge, but there are some accelerated cohorts. The kids are friendly, belying many stereotypes. Trouble of course is that it doesn't show up on objective testing.

Challenges include knowing whether there is better that can be extracted out of our kid educationally and whether that matters. This kid could of course be put in some kind of pressure cooker to get a "better educational experience" but that's kind of counterfactual. What I'd like is for teachers to push everyone to do more.

Other challenges include not having sports program I'd want my kid to have or extracurriculars that seem to be as enriching.

My hope is that going through this MS and its particular program with an integrated student body will make the school better at reaching everybody who's in the school's pattern and pushing them to succeed as well as good for my kid in terms of socializing them into a world that's not Bethesda and the Ivy League. I think that the school-related "rigor" efforts and support come through engagement with school leadership and teachers, so some of that depends on specific individuals rather than the system in my opinion. I think DCPS has a lot of teachers and administrators who care a lot, but it's hard to expect them to give 110% to every student all the time. I can understand why caring about students who could fall from being net positives in society to net negatives first, as a matter of triage, is logical. That said, I think part of how you reach these kids is expecting greater things from them than society has expected to date.

I'd just say as our MS kid goes through MS, it seems like kid is on top of grades and tests very well so is very likely to move to a selective HS instead of neighborhood HS.

So if I was to suggest what things might be like for others joining the so-called underperforming MS: socially, adaptable kids can do fine! Academically, parent engagement seems pretty valuable, and can help all students win against a public service bureaucracy, extracurricularly, it can be a little rough. But, again, I value placing my kids into an integrated cohort across race and class very highly, probably more highly than placing them in an academically rigorous cohort, believing that our children are likely to be academically successful as well as well-suited to a future better than ours.

So - clearly living in a way that's not so congruent with that of the DCUM norm. Optimistic and engaged.

DP, also with MS kid at one of these schools. Above comments are mostly spot-on with our experience, especially the bold parts. Social adjustment was a bit more abrupt--going from an ES where you've known the same kids for 7-8 years and suddenly lots of new kids from other schools who are having their own struggles adapting led to some social stress at the beginning. The school was super helpful--even focusing on cooperative games for the first month of PE to keep kids from different schools from sticking in those groups. All is well--kid loves the school and friends old and new.

We are happy with the sports offered, and the culture, community, and communication at the school. Kid's sense of personal responsibility has grown tremendously, and they are also very on top of grades, so I also expect a selective HS.

It’s easy to be on top of grades when majority is so low performing. It’s all relative to your peer group. If your kid was placed in a high performing group, your kid may just be on the average side and in the middle. Ask the parents who move from poorly performing EOTP schools to WOTP.

Also things get much more real if your kid gets into a selective high school into a higher level playing field. High probability your kid is going to to come in less prepared and likely struggle with the higher academics. This has been shown again and again and why colleges have summer academic programs for kids from low performing schools or offer remedial programs/tutoring support for freshman’s. If you look at the stats, much higher percentage of these kids drop out and never get a degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:yes, so I am PP with MS kid:

socially - transition was more gradual than abrupt. MS child is socially very adaptable, moreso than us, child's parents. Finds many ways to engage with many kids.

This kid is super proud of friends and school. Does not want to change schools for anything. Kind of has a chip on shoulder about the big schools like Deal and all they've got; I don't want to encourage that, but if my kid lines up with the underdogs for the rest of their life, I'd probably be pretty proud.

School does not seem to be a big challenge, but there are some accelerated cohorts. The kids are friendly, belying many stereotypes. Trouble of course is that it doesn't show up on objective testing.

Challenges include knowing whether there is better that can be extracted out of our kid educationally and whether that matters. This kid could of course be put in some kind of pressure cooker to get a "better educational experience" but that's kind of counterfactual. What I'd like is for teachers to push everyone to do more.

Other challenges include not having sports program I'd want my kid to have or extracurriculars that seem to be as enriching.

My hope is that going through this MS and its particular program with an integrated student body will make the school better at reaching everybody who's in the school's pattern and pushing them to succeed as well as good for my kid in terms of socializing them into a world that's not Bethesda and the Ivy League. I think that the school-related "rigor" efforts and support come through engagement with school leadership and teachers, so some of that depends on specific individuals rather than the system in my opinion. I think DCPS has a lot of teachers and administrators who care a lot, but it's hard to expect them to give 110% to every student all the time. I can understand why caring about students who could fall from being net positives in society to net negatives first, as a matter of triage, is logical. That said, I think part of how you reach these kids is expecting greater things from them than society has expected to date.

I'd just say as our MS kid goes through MS, it seems like kid is on top of grades and tests very well so is very likely to move to a selective HS instead of neighborhood HS.

So if I was to suggest what things might be like for others joining the so-called underperforming MS: socially, adaptable kids can do fine! Academically, parent engagement seems pretty valuable, and can help all students win against a public service bureaucracy, extracurricularly, it can be a little rough. But, again, I value placing my kids into an integrated cohort across race and class very highly, probably more highly than placing them in an academically rigorous cohort, believing that our children are likely to be academically successful as well as well-suited to a future better than ours.

So - clearly living in a way that's not so congruent with that of the DCUM norm. Optimistic and engaged.

DP, also with MS kid at one of these schools. Above comments are mostly spot-on with our experience, especially the bold parts. Social adjustment was a bit more abrupt--going from an ES where you've known the same kids for 7-8 years and suddenly lots of new kids from other schools who are having their own struggles adapting led to some social stress at the beginning. The school was super helpful--even focusing on cooperative games for the first month of PE to keep kids from different schools from sticking in those groups. All is well--kid loves the school and friends old and new.

We are happy with the sports offered, and the culture, community, and communication at the school. Kid's sense of personal responsibility has grown tremendously, and they are also very on top of grades, so I also expect a selective HS.

It’s easy to be on top of grades when majority is so low performing. It’s all relative to your peer group. If your kid was placed in a high performing group, your kid may just be on the average side and in the middle. Ask the parents who move from poorly performing EOTP schools to WOTP.

Also things get much more real if your kid gets into a selective high school into a higher level playing field. High probability your kid is going to to come in less prepared and likely struggle with the higher academics. This has been shown again and again and why colleges have summer academic programs for kids from low performing schools or offer remedial programs/tutoring support for freshman’s. If you look at the stats, much higher percentage of these kids drop out and never get a degree.

Cool, thanks. Your opinion with no knowledge of my family or my child or their school is definitely going to change my approach to parenting and set the expectation of failure. Much appreciated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:woah a couple of people posted that they are overall reasonably happy at a non-charter middle school eotp and get attacked simply because it is not the response that you pp wanted

Who attacked them? One of the people who sends her kids to a non-charter MS has said very nasty things about other people and I haven't seen anything like that from the other side. Critical, yes. Not nasty.