Pamela Geller is nuts

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
She is a very vocal opponent of radical Islam. She is not an opponent of Islam, much to the left's chagrin. I think sane people are opponents of radical Islam. Doesn't the first amendment give both of them the same rights? Or does it only count if you support those rights? Seems to me, you feel the latter.

By the way? If you think we should be upholding the rights of radical Islamists, you're insane.

Neither the school nor the cultural center involved "radical" Muslims. You can't run from the truth. Even you have said that the difference between "Islam" and "radical Muslims" is hair splitting. So, your attempt to distinguish in this manner is not very credible.

The ties are up for debate. The hair-splitting comes from the attempts of the left to accuse those who oppose radical islam of opposing all islam; conservatives are quite clear on the fact that they differ.

Yes, quite clear

http://allenbwest.com/2015/05/sharia-law-comes-to-walmart/

"There was a young man doing the checkout and another Walmart employee came over and put up a sign, “No alcohol products in this lane.” So being the inquisitive fella I am, I used my additional set of eyes — glasses — to see the young checkout man’s name. Let me just say it was NOT “Steve.”

I pointed the sign out to Aubrey and her response was a simple question, how is it that this Muslim employee could refuse service to customers based on his religious beliefs, but Christians are being forced to participate in specific events contrary to their religious beliefs?"

Col. West is right. Why are Muslims are protected class in this country?

The article goes on to state that checkers under 21 are not allowed to ring up alcohol. So in other words, this is a total bust.

In this situation, West was incorrect. Were the EEOC not suing a trucking company because Muslims refused to deliver alcohol (part of their job), it would be a non-issue. Again, why are Muslims a protected class? Christians should be forced to bake cakes for gay weddings, but when Muslims refused....crickets.

The larger question, again, is why are Muslims (and gay people for that matter) a protected class? That's not really equality, is it?

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
She is a very vocal opponent of radical Islam. She is not an opponent of Islam, much to the left's chagrin. I think sane people are opponents of radical Islam. Doesn't the first amendment give both of them the same rights? Or does it only count if you support those rights? Seems to me, you feel the latter.

By the way? If you think we should be upholding the rights of radical Islamists, you're insane.

Neither the school nor the cultural center involved "radical" Muslims. You can't run from the truth. Even you have said that the difference between "Islam" and "radical Muslims" is hair splitting. So, your attempt to distinguish in this manner is not very credible.

The ties are up for debate. The hair-splitting comes from the attempts of the left to accuse those who oppose radical islam of opposing all islam; conservatives are quite clear on the fact that they differ.

You said that "Islam kills gay men daily" was true? You are the one accusing all of Islam and not radical Muslims. You were quite clear about that and had several chances to clarify. It is not hairsplitting to point it out.

What makes it splitting hairs is you do it to distract from the fact that Islamists kill gay people. It doesn't. Furthermore, this is very typical of progressives like yourself and it shows conservatives like myself that the compassionate left is a myth. The more you push on this point, the more your true colors show

I don't get it. Do you think "Islam kills gay men daily" or not? If, yes, you clearly are holding the entire religion responsible for what a small minority does. If not, then why can't you say "No, I don't believe that"? This is not hairsplitting. This is a binary question do you or do you not believe that the religion of Islam kills gay men daily?

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
She is a very vocal opponent of radical Islam. She is not an opponent of Islam, much to the left's chagrin. I think sane people are opponents of radical Islam. Doesn't the first amendment give both of them the same rights? Or does it only count if you support those rights? Seems to me, you feel the latter.

By the way? If you think we should be upholding the rights of radical Islamists, you're insane.

Neither the school nor the cultural center involved "radical" Muslims. You can't run from the truth. Even you have said that the difference between "Islam" and "radical Muslims" is hair splitting. So, your attempt to distinguish in this manner is not very credible.

The ties are up for debate. The hair-splitting comes from the attempts of the left to accuse those who oppose radical islam of opposing all islam; conservatives are quite clear on the fact that they differ.

You said that "Islam kills gay men daily" was true? You are the one accusing all of Islam and not radical Muslims. You were quite clear about that and had several chances to clarify. It is not hairsplitting to point it out.

What makes it splitting hairs is you do it to distract from the fact that Islamists kill gay people. It doesn't. Furthermore, this is very typical of progressives like yourself and it shows conservatives like myself that the compassionate left is a myth. The more you push on this point, the more your true colors show

I don't get it. Do you think "Islam kills gay men daily" or not? If, yes, you clearly are holding the entire religion responsible for what a small minority does. If not, then why can't you say "No, I don't believe that"? This is not hairsplitting. This is a binary question do you or do you not believe that the religion of Islam kills gay men daily?

Are you focusing on the 'daily' or on the Islam kills gay men? I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok. The other poster said that it was done daily, and you attributed the 'daily' part to me. It's up to him to prove quantification on a daily basis - which is why I have been simply ignoring your harping on the word 'daily'. It was not something that I typed. You attributed it to me. Me? I really don't care if the killings are daily, weekly, hourly, or monthly. I care that Islam does condone the killing of gay INDIVIDUALS.

If it's quantification you are after, please quantify for me the number of gay individuals killed by Islamic individuals and show me how many of those murders are prosecuted in an Islamic court of law, whatever that may be. That's the part I care about - that the crimes are sought after and prosecuted just like they are here in the US.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

Yeah, I'm sure you are the gay man's best friend.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

Iran is a despotic government that is hardly representative of Islam. As Shia Muslims, they are a small minority. Do you honestly think Iran is representative of the entire religion of Islam? There is no question that some Muslims are very homophobic. The same can be said of members of other religions. Why do you ignore Uganda with its "kill the gays" law? Why do you not consider Christianity to kill gays in the same way you do Islam? The answer is Islamophobia.

We agree that you believe "Islam kills gay men". There is really no need for further discussion. You can drop your pretense of opposing "radical' Muslims. You have made everything very clear.

[Anonymous]

I get it Jeff. You don't really care about individuals. You are about the political correctness. How ver progressive of you. Lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I get it Jeff. You don't really care about individuals. You are about the political correctness. How ver progressive of you. Lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

I believe you have conveniently forgotten the persecution gay men face from others as well. I'll just leave these here:

http://m.thenation.com/blog/179191-its-not-just-uganda-behind-christian-rights-onslaught-africa

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/12/04/pastor-calls-for-killing-gays-to-end-aids/19929973/

http://m.christianpost.com/news/bible-says-gays-should-be-executed-and-i-believe-every-word-says-arizona-pastor--99583/

[Anonymous]

I just find it funny that conservatives fall all over themselves to protect the poor gay men from evil Muslims but have no problem with it when the same is done by Christians. I wonder how the LGBT community feels about all of this...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It's mentioned for sure. This is where justification is found for the practice.
http://islamqa.info/en/427

OP here. I'm amazed how far this thread has strayed from the topic.

I'm also amazed at this PP who posts this link as the justification for FGM, but apparently hasn't actually read it. There are so many "caveats" included in this article and the author even states that it is not mandatory. This is not a requirement of Islam and frankly, only observed in some locations. This posters is like the poster saying that the Mormon practice of door-to-door proselytizing is an inherent feature of Christianity.

Some of the quotes:

Ibn Qudamah (may Allah have mercy on him) said, in his book al-Mughni: "Circumcision is obligatory for men, and it is an honour for women, but it is not obligatory for them. This is the opinion of many scholars.

In this matter, it is wise to follow the interests of the female: if the clitoris is large, then part of it should be removed, otherwise it should be left alone.

A hadith on the topic of female circumcision has been attributed to the Prophet (Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon Him), according to which he said: "Circumcision is a Sunnah for men, and an honour for women," but there is some debate as to the authenticity of this hadith.

How circumcision is to be performed is mentioned in the hadith narrated by Umm ‘Atiyah, may Allah be pleased with her, according to which a woman used to perform circumcisions in Madinah. The Prophet (Peace and Blessings of Allah be upon Him) told her: "Do not abuse (i.e. do not go to extremes in circumcising); that is better for the woman and more liked by her husband."

So, Islam does not promote FGM. One Muslim Sheikh mentions it in a Q&A. Additionally, it isn't a requirement, it is very clearly optional and each individual woman can decide for herself. Additionally, there is the proscription that if the clitoris is small, that it should be left alone.


Pretty sketchy argument to use this as a large scale criticism of Islam in general.

Ick. That is like saying it is ok to cut off part of the penis if it is too big! Also, that fact that this Muslim Sheikh says it is optional does not make his stance on FGM better at all. The only correct stance should be outright condemnation of FGM and Islam fails to do this IMHO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Ick. That is like saying it is ok to cut off part of the penis if it is too big! Also, that fact that this Muslim Sheikh says it is optional does not make his stance on FGM better at all. The only correct stance should be outright condemnation of FGM and Islam fails to do this IMHO.

So, you also condemn Christianity and are just as vocal about the Christians who do this, right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation#Religion

FGM is also practised by animist groups, particularly in Guinea and Mali, and by Christians.[141] In Niger, for example, 55 percent of Christian women and girls have experienced FGM, compared with two percent of their Muslim counterparts.[142] There is no mention of FGM in the Bible, and Christian missionaries in Africa were among the first to object to it.[143] The only Jewish group known to have practised it are the Beta Israel of Ethiopia; Judaism requires male circumcision, but does not allow FGM.[144]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

I believe you have conveniently forgotten the persecution gay men face from others as well. I'll just leave these here:

http://m.thenation.com/blog/179191-its-not-just-uganda-behind-christian-rights-onslaught-africa

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/12/04/pastor-calls-for-killing-gays-to-end-aids/19929973/

http://m.christianpost.com/news/bible-says-gays-should-be-executed-and-i-believe-every-word-says-arizona-pastor--99583/

Does that justify Islam's horrific track record re: gay people? I'd say no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do believe in fact, that Islam does kill gay men, that they support killing gay men, and that it is much more than a small minority that believe this to be ok.

These are your words. No argument, right? So, just drop your protestations that you only oppose "radical" Muslims. The words that you type clearly show that you attribute to an entire religion the deeds of a small minority. The vast majority of Muslims do not kill gay men and do not support killing gay men. This is a misrepresentation based in your Islamophobia.

Does the government of, say, Iran, prosecute the murder of gay individuals? How about Syria? The Washington Post had this to say:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-double-threat-for-gay-men-in-syria/2014/04/25/30117ee2-ca3a-11e3-a75e-463587891b57_story.html

it's not a 'phobia' to state the truth, that a particular religion has persecuted gays in countries that do not prosecute it, because they condone it.

It is, however, bigoted to minimize the horror gay individuals face in these countries. Congrats. You've earned it.

I believe you have conveniently forgotten the persecution gay men face from others as well. I'll just leave these here:

http://m.thenation.com/blog/179191-its-not-just-uganda-behind-christian-rights-onslaught-africa

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/12/04/pastor-calls-for-killing-gays-to-end-aids/19929973/

http://m.christianpost.com/news/bible-says-gays-should-be-executed-and-i-believe-every-word-says-arizona-pastor--99583/

Does that justify Islam's horrific track record re: gay people? I'd say no.

It doesn't justify it, no. But it should signify that you should not single out Islam as homophobic when other religions also have this issue. You can fight against homophobic regimes, nations, politics, but to single out Islam over other equally homophobic religions for that issue is just bigoted.

Some of the anti-Muslim posters have singled out Islam for their homophobic issues, despite the fact that it has been pointed out that these issues are common in other religions as well including Christianity (as illustrated above).

Some anti-Muslim posters have denounced Islam for FGM, yet the issue is not a religious issue. This is a practice that is common on the continent of Africa in multiple nations, many of which are Muslim, but also common in several other nations, including Christian ones.

The point is that yes, many Muslims have these deplorable practices, but these practices are not a part of their religion, but usually part of the culture or nation. Some of us are saying don't blame the religion for non-religious practices performed by some members. Otherwise it would be appropriate to blame all of Christianity for the deplorable behavior of the Westboro Baptist Church. Or for abortion house bombings.