Harvard Rejects Trump Admin’s Demands, Going to Court

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tax exempt status next.

It's absurd the Harvard pays no taxes and gets $9B of federal money. Meanwhile their class sizes remain tiny, while they talk about equity and privilege, and play racial discrimination games where a black student has 10x the odds of getting in than an Asian American student with similar stats across all achievement deciles.

Please share a post SCOTUS ruling source for that statistic.

I happen to disfavor affirmative action too, but am often surprised how many rail against that while fine with athletic recruiting. They have the highest admit rates of all, and these are supposed to be academic institutions. Some people are just born more athletic; an average person can’t get recruited with just hard work the way they can get good grades or test scores with just hard work.

They haven't released all their admissions data to the general public. But what days we have shows pretty dramatic racial discrimination. Why are you giving them a pass from stuff they were doing just a few years ago?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard acted like it's above the law and discriminated Asians all they want.
Now it's acting like it's entiled to my tax money.

Trump always acts like he is above the law. He's broken the law more than ten times in the past week, I bet.

What do I care what Harvard does? They are not deporting innocent people. They are not telling people to take vitamin A to fight the measles. They are not proclaiming people as "dead," so that they can't open bank accounts. They are not trying to prevent women from voting.

They discriminated my Asian kid favoring URMs and Rich Whites with my tax money.

Hah, sour grapes!

Yeah I'm sure you would say the same to blacks during segregation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard acted like it's above the law and discriminated Asians all they want.
Now it's acting like it's entiled to my tax money.

Trump always acts like he is above the law. He's broken the law more than ten times in the past week, I bet.

What do I care what Harvard does? They are not deporting innocent people. They are not telling people to take vitamin A to fight the measles. They are not proclaiming people as "dead," so that they can't open bank accounts. They are not trying to prevent women from voting.

In other words, Harvard shouldn’t continue doing cutting edge research because they rejected my kid.
They discriminated my Asian kid favoring URMs and Rich Whites with my tax money.

Not because they rejected his kid. Because they racially discriminated against his kid

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No you are looking at different things. Viewpoint diversity is about making sure all viewpoints are welcomed. DEI has morphed into putting one group over another based on past wrong etc.

I understand the sales pitch, but the mechanism is spelled out in the letter. Each paragraph starts off with what sound like good intentions, but then when you read how it will be implemented the risks and dangers become clear. The gov should not be involved in picking the faculty or students of a private school just because the gov is a large customer of a university (paying for and receiving the benefits of research).

Nor should the gov be dictating which student orgs get kicked off campus just based on allegations. There’s a need for due process.

DEI was not about putting one group over another. It was about giving (previously wronged) groups help to reach the level enjoyed by others. I don’t agree with all the tools it used to do that, like affirmative action, but having a place to go when there is a complaint or a need for training isn’t crazy. It could be rolled into HR at some places since it’s the same kind of compliance function, but calling a student facing org HR is confusing. (Ultimately there will be a rebrand just so Trump can say he won.)

DEI brought this down on everyone. Maybe next time don't let the lunatic left FA and the world won't have to FO

The pendulum swings both ways, except the next president will be eligible for 2 terms. Moderation is usually the wise move if wanting durable policies. It won’t be long before the middle third of the country who actually decide elections tire of blaming everything on DEI. It’s already getting old. Most people were not as adversely affected by it as they will be the looming financial crisis. Autocrats have a legacy of stirring up anger, overpromising salvation, but actually making things worse by disregarding democracy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tax exempt status next.

It's absurd the Harvard pays no taxes and gets $9B of federal money. Meanwhile their class sizes remain tiny, while they talk about equity and privilege, and play racial discrimination games where a black student has 10x the odds of getting in than an Asian American student with similar stats across all achievement deciles.

also rich Whites, powerful people, celebrities, etc. with my tax money.
F that.

I agree, they can fund themselves with their endowment. They can increase class sizes if they need more money. But if they are going to institutionally discriminate based on race and legacy/donor status, then they are no different than a Southern country club, and they can be taxed like one starting now.

This has been discussed ad nauseum in older threads, but no, they can no just use their endowment however they want. There are restrictions.

The benefactor and school actually create a contract that limits both how funds are used and how much is spent per year (because the school is contractually obligated to keep the fund operating in perpetuity). If the school misuses endowment funds, they are both opening themselves up to lawsuits and diminishing their ability to collect more funds in the future (because people would rather give to orgs that comply.)

Then maybe stop racially discriminating for a few years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s extortion. No previous White House has ever tried to use the power of the state to steer the nation’s preeminent institutions of higher learning in an ideological direction favored by the president.

“U.S. research universities, and the federal funding that supports them, are one major reason Americans have collected more Nobel Prizes than citizens of any other country. They also help make the United States the world’s innovation engine and the top destination for foreign students. No other country is as adept at converting raw human talent and ideas into cutting-edge products. Research universities anchor innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley, which in turn fuel the country’s economic growth.”

Nearly a month ago, for example, Columbia University agreed to most of the White House’s demands in the hopes that Trump and his team would restore $400 million in federal funding. Not only were those hopes soon dashed — Columbia didn’t get its money back — but the administration soon after proposed installing oversight personnel to help run the school in ways that would make the president happy.

In effect, the White House responded to Columbia’s appeasement by trying in part to take over Columbia.

+100

People cheering for this are puppets. It’s the beginning of a fascist regime. They want to control all of the elite universities so there are no alternative ideas or push back. Much like firing all the IGs.

Obama sent letters threatening universities to install DEI or lose funding. Full compliance.

It is the government's responsibility to uphold civil rights and non-discrimination laws. Call it "control" if you want - but it's controlling fairness.
The Trump administration's demands work against civil rights and are controlling ideology they agree with and eliminating opposing views. That is not appropriate government "control."
It isn't federal regulations or government policies that are to blame if students with more conservative views don't feel comfortable expressing those views on their campus, or similarly employees in a company. That's the result of the school and the company's chosen practices.
Is Trump going after Liberty University for being too conservative or too Christian?

Trump administration is demanding as one of several conditions that Harvard stop discriminating against Asians and Harvard said no. Very simple.

No, the letter is saying a bunch more. If that’s all the letter said it would be a normal case of “no we didn’t” vs “yes you did” settled in court. The letter wants a bunch of crazy stuff, the most outrageous being the idea the gov gets to oversee hiring and admissions to comply with ideological diversity as they see fit.

The problem isn’t the idea of ideological diversity, which is wonderful. The problem is the gov shouldn’t police thought in academia.

They had their chance to goy out voluntarily, now they do it under supervision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tax exempt status next.

It's absurd the Harvard pays no taxes and gets $9B of federal money. Meanwhile their class sizes remain tiny, while they talk about equity and privilege, and play racial discrimination games where a black student has 10x the odds of getting in than an Asian American student with similar stats across all achievement deciles.

Please share a post SCOTUS ruling source for that statistic.

I happen to disfavor affirmative action too, but am often surprised how many rail against that while fine with athletic recruiting. They have the highest admit rates of all, and these are supposed to be academic institutions. Some people are just born more athletic; an average person can’t get recruited with just hard work the way they can get good grades or test scores with just hard work.

They haven't released all their admissions data to the general public. But what days we have shows pretty dramatic racial discrimination. Why are you giving them a pass from stuff they were doing just a few years ago?

Because it wasn't illegal then. 37% Asian for the class of '28 and you're still claiming they are racist against Asians? By the way, most of the Asians who work and study at top institutions, and there are a lot of us, are firmly anti-Trump, because we know better than to think he is on our side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s extortion. No previous White House has ever tried to use the power of the state to steer the nation’s preeminent institutions of higher learning in an ideological direction favored by the president.

“U.S. research universities, and the federal funding that supports them, are one major reason Americans have collected more Nobel Prizes than citizens of any other country. They also help make the United States the world’s innovation engine and the top destination for foreign students. No other country is as adept at converting raw human talent and ideas into cutting-edge products. Research universities anchor innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley, which in turn fuel the country’s economic growth.”

Nearly a month ago, for example, Columbia University agreed to most of the White House’s demands in the hopes that Trump and his team would restore $400 million in federal funding. Not only were those hopes soon dashed — Columbia didn’t get its money back — but the administration soon after proposed installing oversight personnel to help run the school in ways that would make the president happy.

In effect, the White House responded to Columbia’s appeasement by trying in part to take over Columbia.

+100

People cheering for this are puppets. It’s the beginning of a fascist regime. They want to control all of the elite universities so there are no alternative ideas or push back. Much like firing all the IGs.

Obama sent letters threatening universities to install DEI or lose funding. Full compliance.

It is the government's responsibility to uphold civil rights and non-discrimination laws. Call it "control" if you want - but it's controlling fairness.
The Trump administration's demands work against civil rights and are controlling ideology they agree with and eliminating opposing views. That is not appropriate government "control."
It isn't federal regulations or government policies that are to blame if students with more conservative views don't feel comfortable expressing those views on their campus, or similarly employees in a company. That's the result of the school and the company's chosen practices.
Is Trump going after Liberty University for being too conservative or too Christian?

Trump administration is demanding as one of several conditions that Harvard stop discriminating against Asians and Harvard said no. Very simple.

Half the country thinks it’s just swell to discriminate against those uppity Asian Americans. How dare they quote the plain English of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

You know that Trump and MAGA do not like the Asian infiltration of the tech industry, right? And that many cannot even distinguish between foreign Asians and Asian-Americans? For crying out loud, open your eyes and turn on your brain.

So just ignore the anti Asian racial discrimination?

One racist at a time. If Harvard is ever in the position to deal a blow to white supremacy, we will support it. But right now Trump is in a position to attach real consequences to racially discriminating against Asians. Sure the academic disruption is unfortunate but how important would you think the disruption was of it was attaching consequences to anti black discrimination or anti Hispanic discrimination?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s extortion. No previous White House has ever tried to use the power of the state to steer the nation’s preeminent institutions of higher learning in an ideological direction favored by the president.

“U.S. research universities, and the federal funding that supports them, are one major reason Americans have collected more Nobel Prizes than citizens of any other country. They also help make the United States the world’s innovation engine and the top destination for foreign students. No other country is as adept at converting raw human talent and ideas into cutting-edge products. Research universities anchor innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley, which in turn fuel the country’s economic growth.”

Nearly a month ago, for example, Columbia University agreed to most of the White House’s demands in the hopes that Trump and his team would restore $400 million in federal funding. Not only were those hopes soon dashed — Columbia didn’t get its money back — but the administration soon after proposed installing oversight personnel to help run the school in ways that would make the president happy.

In effect, the White House responded to Columbia’s appeasement by trying in part to take over Columbia.

+100

People cheering for this are puppets. It’s the beginning of a fascist regime. They want to control all of the elite universities so there are no alternative ideas or push back. Much like firing all the IGs.

Obama sent letters threatening universities to install DEI or lose funding. Full compliance.

It is the government's responsibility to uphold civil rights and non-discrimination laws. Call it "control" if you want - but it's controlling fairness.
The Trump administration's demands work against civil rights and are controlling ideology they agree with and eliminating opposing views. That is not appropriate government "control."
It isn't federal regulations or government policies that are to blame if students with more conservative views don't feel comfortable expressing those views on their campus, or similarly employees in a company. That's the result of the school and the company's chosen practices.
Is Trump going after Liberty University for being too conservative or too Christian?

Trump administration is demanding as one of several conditions that Harvard stop discriminating against Asians and Harvard said no. Very simple.

No, the letter is saying a bunch more. If that’s all the letter said it would be a normal case of “no we didn’t” vs “yes you did” settled in court. The letter wants a bunch of crazy stuff, the most outrageous being the idea the gov gets to oversee hiring and admissions to comply with ideological diversity as they see fit.

The problem isn’t the idea of ideological diversity, which is wonderful. The problem is the gov shouldn’t police thought in academia.

Neither should academia police it.

No, they shouldn’t, but that’s not what they have tried to do. It might seem like it happens occasionally when we read about something silly like a prof getting canceled by peers, but that’s not an institutional intention, and that’s what lawsuits are intended to remedy. The letter to Harvard is talking about the gov literally overseeing future hires and admits based on ideology. The scale and institutional intent are different here.

Academia isn’t perfect, but blowing up their autonomy is out of proportion to its problems. It also ignores a central tenet of conservatism: don’t assume all change is good, esp for systems that are mostly working. Our universities are (were?) the envy of the world and fueled generations of innovation and global economic leadership. This is high risk/low reward behavior.

This is FAFO

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s extortion. No previous White House has ever tried to use the power of the state to steer the nation’s preeminent institutions of higher learning in an ideological direction favored by the president.

“U.S. research universities, and the federal funding that supports them, are one major reason Americans have collected more Nobel Prizes than citizens of any other country. They also help make the United States the world’s innovation engine and the top destination for foreign students. No other country is as adept at converting raw human talent and ideas into cutting-edge products. Research universities anchor innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley, which in turn fuel the country’s economic growth.”

Nearly a month ago, for example, Columbia University agreed to most of the White House’s demands in the hopes that Trump and his team would restore $400 million in federal funding. Not only were those hopes soon dashed — Columbia didn’t get its money back — but the administration soon after proposed installing oversight personnel to help run the school in ways that would make the president happy.

In effect, the White House responded to Columbia’s appeasement by trying in part to take over Columbia.

+100

People cheering for this are puppets. It’s the beginning of a fascist regime. They want to control all of the elite universities so there are no alternative ideas or push back. Much like firing all the IGs.

Obama sent letters threatening universities to install DEI or lose funding. Full compliance.

It is the government's responsibility to uphold civil rights and non-discrimination laws. Call it "control" if you want - but it's controlling fairness.
The Trump administration's demands work against civil rights and are controlling ideology they agree with and eliminating opposing views. That is not appropriate government "control."
It isn't federal regulations or government policies that are to blame if students with more conservative views don't feel comfortable expressing those views on their campus, or similarly employees in a company. That's the result of the school and the company's chosen practices.
Is Trump going after Liberty University for being too conservative or too Christian?

Trump administration is demanding as one of several conditions that Harvard stop discriminating against Asians and Harvard said no. Very simple.

No, the letter is saying a bunch more. If that’s all the letter said it would be a normal case of “no we didn’t” vs “yes you did” settled in court. The letter wants a bunch of crazy stuff, the most outrageous being the idea the gov gets to oversee hiring and admissions to comply with ideological diversity as they see fit.

The problem isn’t the idea of ideological diversity, which is wonderful. The problem is the gov shouldn’t police thought in academia.

Very simple. Then stop being discriminatory against Asians.

Honestly you can ignore this guy/gal.

Did some Asians vote for Trump because of this? Sure. But they like money and Trump is trashing the economy.

Also, they would like opportunities for their kids that use their brains, not this manufacturing paradise Trump is suggesting. They will dump Trump if he keeps this up. Only the crazies like Kash will stick with him
- an Asian

So you're cool with the racial discrimination?

We won't vote for him but it feels nice to see consequences for the racial discrimination. Watching everyone STFU about them being able to discriminate because they are private is cathartic

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s extortion. No previous White House has ever tried to use the power of the state to steer the nation’s preeminent institutions of higher learning in an ideological direction favored by the president.

“U.S. research universities, and the federal funding that supports them, are one major reason Americans have collected more Nobel Prizes than citizens of any other country. They also help make the United States the world’s innovation engine and the top destination for foreign students. No other country is as adept at converting raw human talent and ideas into cutting-edge products. Research universities anchor innovation clusters such as Silicon Valley, which in turn fuel the country’s economic growth.”

Nearly a month ago, for example, Columbia University agreed to most of the White House’s demands in the hopes that Trump and his team would restore $400 million in federal funding. Not only were those hopes soon dashed — Columbia didn’t get its money back — but the administration soon after proposed installing oversight personnel to help run the school in ways that would make the president happy.

In effect, the White House responded to Columbia’s appeasement by trying in part to take over Columbia.

+100

People cheering for this are puppets. It’s the beginning of a fascist regime. They want to control all of the elite universities so there are no alternative ideas or push back. Much like firing all the IGs.

Obama sent letters threatening universities to install DEI or lose funding. Full compliance.

It is the government's responsibility to uphold civil rights and non-discrimination laws. Call it "control" if you want - but it's controlling fairness.
The Trump administration's demands work against civil rights and are controlling ideology they agree with and eliminating opposing views. That is not appropriate government "control."
It isn't federal regulations or government policies that are to blame if students with more conservative views don't feel comfortable expressing those views on their campus, or similarly employees in a company. That's the result of the school and the company's chosen practices.
Is Trump going after Liberty University for being too conservative or too Christian?

Trump administration is demanding as one of several conditions that Harvard stop discriminating against Asians and Harvard said no. Very simple.

No, the letter is saying a bunch more. If that’s all the letter said it would be a normal case of “no we didn’t” vs “yes you did” settled in court. The letter wants a bunch of crazy stuff, the most outrageous being the idea the gov gets to oversee hiring and admissions to comply with ideological diversity as they see fit.

The problem isn’t the idea of ideological diversity, which is wonderful. The problem is the gov shouldn’t police thought in academia.

The Fed does this indirectly all the time. The Biden administration used the power of the purse to enforce DEI and gender identity policies across the country. Title IX as well. Affirmative Action. So you can't cherry pick what is acceptable for the government to do when it comes to the power of the purse. Which is why the schools are reeking of hypocrisy.

Obama did the same thing as well.

Neither Biden nor Obama tied funding to direct control of university hiring or admissions, as the letter to Harvard threatens.

I get the issue with trans athletes, but the number of people impacted by this war on academia is many orders of magnitude greater.

And yet nobody said up against that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tax exempt status next.

It's absurd the Harvard pays no taxes and gets $9B of federal money. Meanwhile their class sizes remain tiny, while they talk about equity and privilege, and play racial discrimination games where a black student has 10x the odds of getting in than an Asian American student with similar stats across all achievement deciles.

Please share a post SCOTUS ruling source for that statistic.

I happen to disfavor affirmative action too, but am often surprised how many rail against that while fine with athletic recruiting. They have the highest admit rates of all, and these are supposed to be academic institutions. Some people are just born more athletic; an average person can’t get recruited with just hard work the way they can get good grades or test scores with just hard work.

They haven't released all their admissions data to the general public. But what days we have shows pretty dramatic racial discrimination. Why are you giving them a pass from stuff they were doing just a few years ago?

Because it wasn't illegal then. 37% Asian for the class of '28 and you're still claiming they are racist against Asians? By the way, most of the Asians who work and study at top institutions, and there are a lot of us, are firmly anti-Trump, because we know better than to think he is on our side.

Fake Asian strikes again. If you were real Asian, you would know that Harvard's admission rate for Asians were strangely fixed at around 16% for decades prior to the scouts decision.

They connivingly started yo increase the admissions rate for Asians few years before the scouts decision and continued. They still have a new affirmative action plan called DEI now and Harvard will fight till death to racially discriminate against Asians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Great leadership by Harvard, MIT and Princeton - keep it coming!!

Maybe the others will follow now.

+1000 My DS said the schools standing up to Trump have more aura. Columbia and the ones who folded are looking like sell-outs.

Anyone else thinking Supreme Court stacked with Harvard/Yale grads might be Harvard leaning once this case gets there?

You mean like they were with Harvard vs SFFA?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So dumb. “No government — regardless of which party is in power — should dictate what private universities can teach, whom they can admit and hire, and which areas of study and inquiry they can pursue”’

The government isn’t saying that. No one is forcing Harvard to do anything. They have a billion dollar endowment and can do as they please.

What they can’t do is foster an educational atmosphere of harassment and expect the taxpayers to finance it.

Sounds like you skipped the letter with the Trump admin’s demands. In the second link.

I literally quoted from the article.

No one is forcing Harvard to do anything.

Harvard is throwing a hissy fit because it wants to do certain things AND get taxpayer funds.

Doesn’t work like that.

All taxpayers will never agree on anything. If the standard for receipt taxpayer funds is agreement from all taxpayers, then nothing would ever be funded from public coffers.

Right. That's why we have elections. Trump won the last election. In no small part because people were turned off to the liberal elite messaging, the racial discrimination against white and asians, the never ending stream of woke ideology coming out of places like Harvard.

If I have learned one thing in the past couple of years is all the same people who say they can't stand racism against Asians had no problem with COVID epithets and violence against Asians and hate meritocracy when Asians actually thrive.

The same people who cry about anti semitism at universities embrace salutes and white supremacists like Stephen miller.

So no...no one is taking you any seriously any more. You've rung a false tune on that bell too many times.

You know Stephen Miller is Jewish right?

It wasn't the Republicans calling Asians racist for fighting against anti Asian racism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So dumb. “No government — regardless of which party is in power — should dictate what private universities can teach, whom they can admit and hire, and which areas of study and inquiry they can pursue”’

The government isn’t saying that. No one is forcing Harvard to do anything. They have a billion dollar endowment and can do as they please.

What they can’t do is foster an educational atmosphere of harassment and expect the taxpayers to finance it.

Sounds like you skipped the letter with the Trump admin’s demands. In the second link.

I literally quoted from the article.

No one is forcing Harvard to do anything.

Harvard is throwing a hissy fit because it wants to do certain things AND get taxpayer funds.

Doesn’t work like that.

You truly do not get it. There's a lot more at stake than Harvard. Colleges like Hillsdale are fine because they don't do cutting edge research that costs millions of dollars year in and year out. You are supporting the tactics of an authoritarian regime that is telling scholars and students what and how they should think, and allowing the mobs to take out people with whom you disagree. If you are in favor of these cuts because you are fearful of antisemitism or you think that Harvard is full of antisemites, you are foolish. Putin and Orban, and Mao all used these oppressive tactics. You're siding with the Devil, who will have no scruples turning on Jews when convenient.

Exactly this. Jews have just become a convenient excuse for repression and censorship by budding fascists and their right-wing toadies.

I want to see more Jews (I am Jewish) speak out about this. Stop using the historic hatred of Jews as a tool in fascism! I want nothing to do with this.

Also the way these people conflate anti-semitism with opposition to the current Israeli government does not in any way make me, a Jew, feel safer. I also oppose the actions of the current Israeli government. If I speak out about that, am I an anti-Semite?

We need to stop this.

I can't tell you how many Jewish people I know who believe this. You aren't allowed to saying ANYTHING negative about Israel ever.

+1. I am horrified by my otherwise progressive, liberal Jewish friends (even those who went to law school!) who would rather squelch free speech and academic freedom than have to tolerate criticism of Israel, or have their children be exposed to this on college campuses. They cannot comprehend intellectually the distinction between criticism of Israel's actions and antisemitism, even though there are tens of thousands of Israeli Jews who are publicly protesting against Netanyahu and the ongoing war in Gaza. It's short-sighted at best. The problem, of course, is that accepting the immediate relief offered by Trump's strong-arming of colleges comes with a very, very high price tag. Trump is not out to protect the Jews; he's courting the favor of White evangelical Christians who believe that they need to support Jews to hasten the second coming of Christ. When that happens, Jews who have not accepted Christ as their savior will be annihilated, which should strike terror in every Jew.

Because it comes from the same will spring as antisemitism. No other country has been held to the impossible standard that Israel has been held to. That comes from antisemitism.

Israel has declared war on Hamas. Their conduct of this war is no worse than our prosecution of the war in Afghanistan or Iraq. No worse than any number of other wars.

The Japanese killed 2000 at Pearl harbor. We proceeded to kill 2 million Japanese including civilian casualties in two atomic explosions. This war ends the moment Hamas unconditionally surrender.

Your argument is that since others have done equally terrible, or even worse acts against civilians, it's OK to continue to do terrible things to civilians?

What about the military theory of proportional response? It's what's *supposed* to be used, and it is actually used in most cases.

PP, we're supposed to deplore the mistakes of the past and do better, every one of us, as nations and peoples.

It's not great but this is war. A war Hamas started on October 7. A war that will stop as soon as they unconditionally surrender.

Proportional response is not applicable to war. You eat trying to beat the other side into submission not limit their casualties to about the same as your casualties.

Israel's mistake was not doing this sooner in an attempt to get the rest of the world to like them. The rest of the world was never going to like them. Jews are only loved when they are suffering. We mourn their death but are disgusted by their success.