Good match schools?

[Anonymous]

The poster said urban or suburban. there are some rural campuses on that list that need to to be eliminated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Every school that is a "match" for her stats is a reach school for everyone. So go ahead and apply to a bunch of the dreams and cross your fingers.

Then the real question is which of the schools for which her stats are above the 75th percentile, is good for what she wants to study, does not yield protect, and meets all her other nice to haves.

This. She should be looking at schools ranked, say, 35+ in the USNWR. Her safeties will be here. As a PP said, there's no such thing as a match for kids like your DD-- the "match" schools just aren't sure things for anyone.

Incidentally, among those schools ranked 40+ will be many that will offer her large merit scholarships.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let her apply wherever her heart desires. Stop making these kids afraid of failures or rejections when these are life lessons. Doesn’t matter how many times you fall, what matters is how many times you stand up again! No wonder kids these days are emotionally very soft and have myriad mental issues. Eventually your DC will end up at a college she is supposed to be

This is just ridiculously stupid advice.

How is it stupid when college applications are more of a lottery?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let her apply wherever her heart desires. Stop making these kids afraid of failures or rejections when these are life lessons. Doesn’t matter how many times you fall, what matters is how many times you stand up again! No wonder kids these days are emotionally very soft and have myriad mental issues. Eventually your DC will end up at a college she is supposed to be

This is just ridiculously stupid advice.

How is it stupid when college applications are more of a lottery?

We often talk about college admissions like it's a lottery, a complete crap shoot. But it's not a lottery. In a true lottery situation, every chance (ticket) has equal odds of being chosen. And the tickets are unrelated to one another. Having one of your tickets chosen doesn't increase the chances that another one of your tickets will be chosen.

College admissions isn't like that. Not every application has an equal chance of being chosen. We think it seems like they do, because of the information we hold in our hands: We have a good idea of grades and test scores and even ECs of other kids, and we know that some kids with a GPA of x and test scores of y and ECs of a and b get admitted and others don't. It seems random. But it's not. Colleges are not putting all the applications from kids who meet baseline criteria into a hat and then pulling out a random sampling. They are READING the applications. They know that Larla with x GPA and y SAT and a&b ECs also has an amazingly glowing teacher recommendation and wrote a really funny, interesting essay; and Larlie with same GPA and scores and ECs has a nice but not stellar rec and wrote an essay that was pretty mediocre; and Larleen, also same GPA, scores, and ECs, is a desirable prospect in one of those ECs. And they choose accordingly.

And, most colleges are choosing on similar metrics, so having one application be among the chosen ones at school X increases the odds that you'll be chosen at school Y. Larla is going to be admitted to Harvard AND to Stanford, Larlie won't get into either school, and Larleen will get into Harvard because they need a bassoonist this year but not Stanford because they are lousy with bassoonists right now. Larlie increasing her apps to include Yale and Princeton isn't going to up her odds of admission--all 4 schools are going to find her essay mediocre. Larla also applies to Yale and Princeton and gets in there, too, because they too know a great essay and rec when they see them.

That doesn't mean there isn't an element of randomness. There is. But it's not as random as it looks to outside observers.

This means that it's a bad strategy for high-achieving kids to increase the number of top colleges they apply to but not add some lower-tier colleges. Applying just to Harvard, Stanford, Yale, and Princeton is not upping your odds of attending a top 5 school. It would be if those schools drew acceptances out of a hat. But they don't.

And this doesn't even get into the cost. If you are a high-achieving kid from a family that doesn't have $250k to spend on college (or doesn't want to spend that much) but isn't needy enough to get financial aid, applying to Harvard, Stanford, Yale, and Princeton is a waste of time. These schools don't give merit aid and you're not getting financial aid. This is why at the end of the day, Larlie might pass on her 4 top choices and go to UVA instead. Good thing her parents insisted she apply there!

The heart wants what it wants, but wanting doesn't get you admitted to college and doesn't get you the money to go there. People don't say that kids should find matches and safeties because they are afraid kids' fee-fees will be hurt by rejection. They say that finding matches and safeties are important because without them rejection means **you don't go to college this year.** You might be willing to take the chance that your kid spends another year in the basement, but IMO that's a monumentally stupid chance to take.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would help to know the following:

Does she need financial aid or merit aid to attend?

What schools does she have in mind for her reaches?

She needs some merit aid, but not a lot.

For her reaches she is in love with brown and Amherst, but we know that's huge lottery. Also on her list are Carnegie Mellon and case western reserve, both as reaches. The only school she is thinking of as a match is northeastern. Thank you!

That's important to know. A lot of the top slacs don't give merit aid at all. You can find this information out easily thru your college counselor or online. Only the second and third tier schools that want to exchange money for say a top GPA or top ACT score give merit. The others don't have to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let her apply wherever her heart desires. Stop making these kids afraid of failures or rejections when these are life lessons. Doesn’t matter how many times you fall, what matters is how many times you stand up again! No wonder kids these days are emotionally very soft and have myriad mental issues. Eventually your DC will end up at a college she is supposed to be

This is just ridiculously stupid advice.

How is it stupid when college applications are more of a lottery?

We often talk about college admissions like it's a lottery, a complete crap shoot. But it's not a lottery. In a true lottery situation, every chance (ticket) has equal odds of being chosen. And the tickets are unrelated to one another. Having one of your tickets chosen doesn't increase the chances that another one of your tickets will be chosen.

College admissions isn't like that. Not every application has an equal chance of being chosen. We think it seems like they do, because of the information we hold in our hands: We have a good idea of grades and test scores and even ECs of other kids, and we know that some kids with a GPA of x and test scores of y and ECs of a and b get admitted and others don't. It seems random. But it's not. Colleges are not putting all the applications from kids who meet baseline criteria into a hat and then pulling out a random sampling. They are READING the applications. They know that Larla with x GPA and y SAT and a&b ECs also has an amazingly glowing teacher recommendation and wrote a really funny, interesting essay; and Larlie with same GPA and scores and ECs has a nice but not stellar rec and wrote an essay that was pretty mediocre; and Larleen, also same GPA, scores, and ECs, is a desirable prospect in one of those ECs. And they choose accordingly.

And, most colleges are choosing on similar metrics, so having one application be among the chosen ones at school X increases the odds that you'll be chosen at school Y. Larla is going to be admitted to Harvard AND to Stanford, Larlie won't get into either school, and Larleen will get into Harvard because they need a bassoonist this year but not Stanford because they are lousy with bassoonists right now. Larlie increasing her apps to include Yale and Princeton isn't going to up her odds of admission--all 4 schools are going to find her essay mediocre. Larla also applies to Yale and Princeton and gets in there, too, because they too know a great essay and rec when they see them.

That doesn't mean there isn't an element of randomness. There is. But it's not as random as it looks to outside observers.

This means that it's a bad strategy for high-achieving kids to increase the number of top colleges they apply to but not add some lower-tier colleges. Applying just to Harvard, Stanford, Yale, and Princeton is not upping your odds of attending a top 5 school. It would be if those schools drew acceptances out of a hat. But they don't.

And this doesn't even get into the cost. If you are a high-achieving kid from a family that doesn't have $250k to spend on college (or doesn't want to spend that much) but isn't needy enough to get financial aid, applying to Harvard, Stanford, Yale, and Princeton is a waste of time. These schools don't give merit aid and you're not getting financial aid. This is why at the end of the day, Larlie might pass on her 4 top choices and go to UVA instead. Good thing her parents insisted she apply there!

The heart wants what it wants, but wanting doesn't get you admitted to college and doesn't get you the money to go there. People don't say that kids should find matches and safeties because they are afraid kids' fee-fees will be hurt by rejection. They say that finding matches and safeties are important because without them rejection means **you don't go to college this year.** You might be willing to take the chance that your kid spends another year in the basement, but IMO that's a monumentally stupid chance to take.

Great reply!

[Anonymous]

Since she loves Brown, how about Providence?

Fordham?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would help to know the following:

Does she need financial aid or merit aid to attend?

What schools does she have in mind for her reaches?

She needs some merit aid, but not a lot.

For her reaches she is in love with brown and Amherst, but we know that's huge lottery. Also on her list are Carnegie Mellon and case western reserve, both as reaches. The only school she is thinking of as a match is northeastern. Thank you!

Brown does not give merit aid. Only two of the NESCACs do - Trinity and Connecticut College (both of which would be matches). That means Amherst, Tufts, Wesleyan and Bowdoin are not options if you need merit aid. She might try researching outside scholarships if she decides these schools are her top choices. Case Western does offer good merit aid. She might like Villanova and they do offer merit aid. U of Rochester is a good suggestion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would help to know the following:

Does she need financial aid or merit aid to attend?

What schools does she have in mind for her reaches?

She needs some merit aid, but not a lot.

For her reaches she is in love with brown and Amherst, but we know that's huge lottery. Also on her list are Carnegie Mellon and case western reserve, both as reaches. The only school she is thinking of as a match is northeastern. Thank you!

Brown does not give merit aid. Only two of the NESCACs do - Trinity and Connecticut College (both of which would be matches). That means Amherst, Tufts, Wesleyan and Bowdoin are not options if you need merit aid. She might try researching outside scholarships if she decides these schools are her top choices. Case Western does offer good merit aid. She might like Villanova and they do offer merit aid. U of Rochester is a good suggestion.

This is good info. If you can't afford college without merit aid (but don't qualify for need-based financial aid) then start with lists of colleges that offer merit money.